Dart frog vivarium

[MikeM670]

I've found a couple of recipes for ABG mix, in case you want to try to duplicate it:

2 parts Ground Tree Fern Root
2 parts milled Sphagnum Moss
2 part fine orchid bark
(i cannot emphasize *fine* enough here, it's hard to find)
1 part sphagnum peat moss
1 part charcoal

Will you be planting your vivarium?

I haven't tried mixing my own ABG Mix yet as its hard to find some of the materials needed. I have purchased all of the ABG Mix used so far from Josh. I just dump it into a bucket dry, mix up with my hands and then add non-chlorinated water, and mix again. Then apply. No fuss no muss!

[guppygal]

That's what I do, since it's the easiest way. I don't think that leaf litter on top of sphagnum is gonna cut it, but that's just me

[camfish]

I might put a couple plants in but i just want to keep it simple for my first dart frog viv. For leaf litter though should i just get dead leaves from my backyard and boil them or microwave them? Also what kind of guard would be good to keep the substrate out of the gravel that ill use for the drainage layer?

[MikeM670]

I might put a couple plants in but i just want to keep it simple for my first dart frog viv. For leaf litter though should i just get dead leaves from my backyard and boil them or microwave them? Also what kind of guard would be good to keep the substrate out of the gravel that ill use for the drainage layer?

I can say on the leaves from your yard as all the leaves I have in my tanks came from Josh. I don't know if they are treated in some fashion or not.

As for the filter mesh you can use plastic window screen or landscape fabric.

[camfish]

Do you treat the ones from joshs frogs or do you just put them straight in the tank?

[Grrrit]

Straight in the tank.

[MikeM670]

Do you treat the ones from joshs frogs or do you just put them straight in the tank?

Yes they go straight into the tank. They come in what I think is a 1 gallon bag.

[camfish]

Ok thank you all again for all your help, i want to get either auratus or azureus but Joshs Frogs looked like they didn't have any, when i first get them should i feed flightless friut flies or springtails?

[guppygal]

I might put a couple plants in but i just want to keep it simple for my first dart frog viv. For leaf litter though should i just get dead leaves from my backyard and boil them or microwave them? Also what kind of guard would be good to keep the substrate out of the gravel that ill use for the drainage layer?

Darts require lots of places to hide, or they will die from the stress. Usually, the substrate is the last thing on the list when building a vivarium. Most of the work goes into the background and the planting. PDF hobbyists consider their vivariums a work of art resembling a small tropical ecosystem. The background can be as simple as some cork tiles siliconed to the glass, or raw cork bark mashed into Great Stuff on up to some very elaborate and artistic root systems, vines, rocks, etc. It give the frogs places to hide, explore, and hunt for their food.

It sounds like you have the substrate under control. The only thing I can add is that the substrate also provides a home for springtails and isopods to thrive and reproduce, thus providing your frogs with extra snacks.

Have you done any research on your fruitfly cultures yet?

[camfish]

Yes i've started to look into them what kind should i first get when i get my frogs? and would it be ok to dust with tetrafauna reptocal?

[guppygal]

Yes i've started to look into them what kind should i first get when i get my frogs? and would it be ok to dust with tetrafauna reptocal?

You need to start your cultures BEFORE you get your frogs. Melanogaster fruitflies take about 2 weeks before you can feed out and start new cultures; hydei take longer, about 3 weeks, but they're a larger fly and less work for the frogs to hunt down and eat.

I've never heard of the supplement you're talking about. I've heard of Repashy, tho I don't use it. My supplements consist of 45% each of Herptivite Multi-vitamins and Rep-Cal Calcium with about 10% paprika for my yellow and red frogs. It helps them keep their color.

The most important thing is to get the hang of culturing your fruitflies before you get your frogs. You can purchase both the flies and supplements at various online vendors, tho I think Josh's Frogs seems to be the most reliable. You can also get that ABG substrate from him.

[camfish]

I seen the reptocal on joshsfrogs and i was planning on just ordering a producing culture when i order my frogs so ill have those to feed them while i start my other cultures. Does it matter if i get the flightless or wingless? will one or the other be too large for the frogs?

[guppygal]

It doesn't matter as far as size goes, but I'm not sure if the reproduction time is different between the two types. I've always used flightless, but if it becomes too hot, or if new cultures accidentally include a wild fruitfly, then the flightless will fly. Yep - it sure bugs me, too ~

What kind of frogs are you getting from Josh's?

[Grrrit]

You need to start your cultures BEFORE you get your frogs. Melanogaster fruitflies take about 2 weeks before you can feed out and start new cultures; hydei take longer, about 3 weeks, but they're a larger fly and less work for the frogs to hunt down and eat.

I've never heard of the supplement you're talking about. I've heard of Repashy, tho I don't use it. My supplements consist of 45% each of Herptivite Multi-vitamins and Rep-Cal Calcium with about 10% paprika for my yellow and red frogs. It helps them keep their color.

The most important thing is to get the hang of culturing your fruitflies before you get your frogs. You can purchase both the flies and supplements at various online vendors, tho I think Josh's Frogs seems to be the most reliable. You can also get that ABG substrate from him.

true dat I got my culture kit from josh's and the poorly started melos that (I MADE) died off and I ran out of flies in a week. I was lucky to have mike novy 10 minutes away to pick some up at different stages.

[guppygal]

Yeppers, that will happen, especially if you have 20 tanks and a lot of mouths to feed.

If it will EVER rain down this way, I'll be able to treat my babies to some termites - yum!!

[Grrrit]

Termites do sound lovely! I wonder if you could culture them? But then again, a fly here and there isn't so bad but termites loose in the house eek!
Or ants even, I bet they would like those!

but we had a few really hot days that killed alot of flies off. I have grocery display shelves for "fly racks" lol I'm ready to play big league

[guppygal]

Termites do sound lovely! I wonder if you could culture them? But then again, a fly here and there isn't so bad but termites loose in the house eek!
Or ants even, I bet they would like those!

but we had a few really hot days that killed alot of flies off. I have grocery display shelves for "fly racks" lol I'm ready to play big league

My husband used to freak out about the termites until I showed him how long they survive inside a house. It's not very long at all, probably just minutes before they dry up. We have lots of termites in the south and I set traps for them. I make the traps out of a couple of cheap plastic organizer baskets (with the slots in the sides) with a bunch of wet cardboard stuck between them. I mash the organizers together as hard as I can, then tie them together. Next, I take them out to an old dead tree or log where I've found termites before, dig a small hole next to it, place my little trap in there, and cover it up. After a couple 3 weeks or so, I'll check it and I usually find a pretty nice group of fat n happy termites. I store them in an airtight tupperware container with a lot of damp cardboard for munching. They LOVE that stuff! And my darts love termites - it's like giving candy to kids, so it's a treat, not a meal. But it also works in an emergency if my cultures crash.

Now, down south, we have these horribly nasty fire ants. When you mentioned 'ants', I nearly freaked. I know of a biology teacher in Miami who lost one frog and another was badly injured when her students unknowingly tried to feed them fire ants. I'm hoping that whatever ants you're thinking of don't sting like these nasty devils.

Funny story - we were having problems with rodents in the attic and my husband works with a lady from Terminix. She said that she'd send her guys out to check the house. I didn't realize that it meant that they were checking for termites as well, so when the guy asked if I had seen any, I said 'Sure'. 'Where?' he asked. I reached down, picked up my tupperware container full of termites and handed it to him. He really didn't know what to say, except that he'd never, in all his years of exterminating termites, find someone who was actually HAPPY to have some on hand. The rest of the house checked out okay.

I'd skip the ants, tho -

[camfish]

I was looking for azureus or auratus but i didn't see any on the web site and i was thinking of maybe getting cobalts but i wanna stay with the cheaper frogs until i start getting use to keeping dart frogs.

[guppygal]

You might also consider Leucs - they're one of my most favorite frogs. The male has a birdlike call and they do well in groups, tho a 10gal is kind of small. You could put two or three in there.

BTW, they aren't very expensive, either -

[bshmerlie]

With the typical beginner terrestrial darts I wouldn't keep them in anything smaller than a 20 gallon. They are very active frogs, bouncing around and will use the space. Maybe a couple of babies growing up but by the time they reach adulthood they should be in at least a 20 gallon.