sHEila Prolapsed Again :(

[irThumper]

Thanks guys! As of a half an hour ago sHEila is back in his regular tank with Jelly Bean... I was concerned about him getting a respiratory problem if he was kept in the small, excessively moist, warm carrier too long. I checked the tank for leftover crickets and Jelly snatched up a tiny one that scuttled out and I grabbed the other the was slightly bigger and removed it, so sHEila is back on his favorite leaf, resting. I noticed a bit of brown in the sugar water yesterday, which must have been residual poo, but there hasn't been any since the prolapse. I'm thinking of starting everyone on an every-other-day feeding schedule, so probably will wait another day or so to feed sHEila anything (will re-read all the info first) and if I can't find the night crawlers asap it will be ONE wax worm to start, and no crickets for a long time. Re-thinking the Soldier larvae idea I had... was hoping those would help; I was told by a herp shop owner that they were digestible and a good source of protein (and that the lauric acid content could help cocci issues) but Amy (LilyPad) says she's heard they aren't as digestible as the guy says. Josh's Frogs website sells and promotes them for Dart frogs though, so...?? Phoenix Worms - Feeder Insects and Supplies | Josh's Frogs Now, how about hornworms? Folks have recommended those and they sound pretty good... Hornworms Habitat Cup (25 Count Cup - Small) 6 PACK - Hornworms | Josh's Frogs I'm wanting to get away from a cricket-only diet for everyone anyway, so trying to find the best combo of isects, that will cause the least amount of problems for my frogs, as possible. I can also get earthworms from Josh's frogs, so would be nice to find all my feeders in one spot!

[Lija]

Hornworms will work. They are like big juicy watermellon, lots of water, not much in nutritional value. Fed in big quantities will lead to diarrhea, but if you will give one or two to add to crickets you feed, it will soften the stool and will minimize the chance of reoccurring prolapse. So don't panic over softer poop.
How the treatment is going otherwise?

[UncleChester]

Thanks guys! As of a half an hour ago sHEila is back in his regular tank with Jelly Bean...

I would suggest keeping sHEila in a tank of his own, moist paper towel as substrate, water dish, and simple climbing decor that can easily be cleaned (like pvc tubing). A simple, clean, hospital tank is advisable while the frog recovers.

I'm thinking of starting everyone on an every-other-day feeding schedule, so probably will wait another day or so to feed sHEila anything (will re-read all the info first)

I'd also rethink feeding him this soon. He needs time to heal.

[irThumper]

They are actually still in their original quarantine tank, that they've been in while being treated with Metro, so all paper towel substrate and minimalist decor. He's still asleep on his leaf and has been there all morning, as per usual. I do have a post out (waiting for moderation) to Frank Indiviglio, who wrote the article about prolapse, asking for advice on the feeding/fasting. Here it is:


irThumper November 20, 2014 at 6:52 pm

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Hi, this article was recommended to me by a FrogForum member. sHEila, my young White’s tree frog (uncertain of exact age, frog croaks and has visible nuptial pads, so estimate 9 months) prolapsed on 11/7/14. I followed treatment advice and used sugar on the tissue and the problem resolved itself within a couple hours or so. I started feeding again within 2 days, starting with one wax worm… this because sHEila and his 3 companions are being treated for coccidiosis by feeding a wax worm with oral suspension Metronidazole injected into it one day a week. The next day I fed him 1 more wax worm, the day after that 2-3 small crickets (much smaller than what they’d been getting– been feeding daily because I was told I probably should while they are being treated). Everything seemed fine, he had a normal poop last week with no sign of a relapse, but on the 18th I heard a squeak from the frog room. When I went to look I saw a perfectly normal looking frog poop, I looked for sHEila under his leaf (artificial) and saw he had prolapsed again. I tried sprinkling sugar on the area but he wouldn’t leave it alone and kept kicking at it, making the swelling worse. Both pairs of my frogs are each still in 5 gallon quarantine tanks since I purchased them and have been treating them for cocci– damp paper towel substrate, minimal decor, temps 75F-80F and humidity appx 50%; lighting is T8 grow lights (I have African violets in the same room) and 60 watt blue and red incandescents for warmth. Last time sHEila prolapsed I moved him immediately to a small critter keeper, but he seemed distressed in there, so this time I opted to leave him with Jelly Bean. The prolapse did not resolve itself by the next morning this time, however, so I moved him to the small keeper– he wasn’t happy! I kept sprinkling sugar, he kept kicking it off, so finally I followed a suggestion to soak him directly in sugar water in the keeper… he climbed out, I nudged him back and didn’t let him get out again, so he puffed up until he floated on the surface and stuck his butt out of the water! So I sprinkled yet more sugar on top of the prolapse and made him stay in the water for appx 20+ min. He started to get agitated so I submerged paper towels in the water, making a big soft sugar water mattress for him to sit on, and I left him that way for the day. When I checked 2-3 hours later the prolapse had completely withdrawn. I switched him to another small keeper with a fresh mattress of wet paper towels, dish of fresh water and 3 fake silk leaves, and left him there until late this morning, when I returned him to his regular 5 gal quarantine tank (I was worried the super humid conditions in the small keeper would cause a respiratory problem). He has been sleeping comfortably on his favorite leaf ever since. He has not been fed since Monday night, prior to the prolapse, and I have no intention of putting him back on crickets for quite some time, as I feel getting those too soon might have exacerbated a return of the prolapse. The strange thing here is that sHEila is the only one of the 4 frogs to have normal poop, the others still having runny feces (not sure how well the treatments are going since it’s hard to get the right amount of med injected into the wax worms), but no one else has prolapsed either. sHEila has been an otherwise healthy, robust and active frog with a voracious appetite and great hunting skills… he jumped at and tried to eat a water droplet when I sprayed his keeper during his confinement, and I think he also jumped at a tiny flying insect that got in there (we’ve been invaded by these things this fall, not sure what they are). He also started croaking after I fed the other frogs and he didn’t get any crickets (calling me out maybe!) He is not a full grown frog, however, so I wondered, being young, and being medicated with Metro once a week (Sundays) how long SHOULD he fast… should I not feed him until Sunday when they get their medicated worm? or should I go ahead and give him a wax worm (they’re pretty small) tonight or tomorrow? I’m looking for night crawlers, which have been highly recommended by other FrogForum members, and give him no more than a one inch piece every other day until…? If I had to take him to a vet it would unfortunately only be able to be the Companion clinic up the street, as the closet herp vets are an hour away either direction and I have a malfunctioning car heater that and sHEila freaks out so much being in the small keeper that I worry the stress would do him more harm than anything. So far I have not had to manually assist the retraction either time.
Any advice on feeding/fasting is much appreciated!
~Lisa/irThumper


We'll see what he recommends. I definitely want to do what's best for my green guy!