I'm sorry that Octavian is still flipping over and not eating. Its hard not to worry about these guys. I've been nursing Grif back to health since he stopped eating a month and a half ago. He is doing a lot better and yet I still worry. I wish I knew more about Pacmans and well all frogs. I hope someone on here can help. Listening to John is a very good idea. He seems to know a lot and claimes to be no expert, but I think he's almost there. Good luck