Hey guys, clay backdrop question

[Grrrit]

I want to try out a clay backround in a vert 40b.

Has anyone here done one of these? How did it turn out, what was used? Also I would like to do a simple dripwall for the pumilio pair that will be moving into it

[John]

I've done a lot of research on this, bought the materials, but I've yet to actually use it in a terrarium. What puts me off is the weight of it - it's heavy! I can tell you what I would do but there are folks on here with a lot of experience working with this material, so I'll wait for them to chime in.

[MikeM670]

I want to try out a clay backround in a vert 40b.

Has anyone here done one of these? How did it turn out, what was used? Also I would like to do a simple dripwall for the pumilio pair that will be moving into it

I've done 6 vivariums with clay or combination of clay and foam and really like it. The four 10 gallon verticals in my gallery are all clay backgrounds with hydro balls for the substrate. As John indicated they can become heavy. The others I have done are two 20 longs and one finished 40 vert. I'm currently working on another 40 vert.

The 10 & 20L vivariums are clay only. The 40 verticals I used a combination of foam and clay. Why foam in the 40's you ask! Well I'll tell you. I used the Great Stuff Pond and Stone Foam to foam around the plant peat pots and to make some support locations for the clay. I feel that if you only used clay it would become too high to support itself and collapse. So in the 40 verticals I have foam around the peat pots and any wood I added as well as a few places where it was applied horizontal to provide a shelf for support. The new 40 verticals has much more foam then my first one, but that is because I put in several pieces of wood and one was very heavy, and a lot more plant locations. I have been cutting out excess foam to allow more space for clay.


After you have applied the foam around the pots and any wood you wish to anchor in place. I also use silicone on anything I apply like wood to give it a nice bond to the glass. Foam really just locks it in place and provides more support, you do the standard silicone and peat over the foam. When the silicone is dry it’s time to add the clay. I mix up the clay using something like Special Kitty Litter and distilled or water which chlorine has been removed. When the clay has been thoroughly mix up and is fairly wet I add stuff like coco fiber and sphagnum moss. All the recipes I have seen are for milled moss but that means I need to use the blender and I'm afraid the better half would frown on that. So the moss just goes in right out of the package. The whole thing then gets mixed together and I watch the texture to see that it is not too wet or too dry. If it’s too dry then I add more water so it’s a bit wet. I then let it sit for at least an hour for the water to absorb into the ingredients. If it’s still too wet then I add more kitty litter. Once I'm satisfied with the mix which should be stiff but feel very sticky I press a few handfuls onto the vivarium glass and sit the vivarium up. I do this to see if the clay will stay in place or slid down. If it stays in place I go ahead and applied the batch onto the glass and around the foam if there is any. Press it in good but watch the pressure around any foam as you could dislodge it if not careful. If it slides down then it is not the right consistency. I either add more water if it’s too dry or more clay, coco or moss to soak up more water. Once you work with this stuff you will get a feel for it.

As for the mix ratio I use more clay then coco or moss. I just add the ingredients by feel. There are recipes out there for you to work from.

[bshmerlie]

I do mine exactly as Mike does. The only difference is I pack coco fiber or moss on top of it. The kitty litter option although really cheap does look rather gray and I prefer the brown look. Its biggest flaw is that it is extremely heavy even with a thin layer. It can also slide if you have it too thick in areas just because of the weight. I would have to agree with Mike and suggest doing a foam and clay combo on a 40gal. I think if you did it all clay you would need three people to move it. I did three sides of a 20 and I can barely budge it. They do make different color clays you can get at craft stores that might give a better look. I used clay in all my small Exos. You can see them in my photo album. The best thing about it is you don't have to wait after you're done. You can put the frogs right in.

[MikeM670]

I do mine exactly as Mike does. The only difference is I pack coco fiber or moss on top of it. The kitty litter option although really cheap does look rather gray and I prefer the brown look. Its biggest flaw is that it is extremely heavy even with a thin layer. It can also slide if you have it too thick in areas just because of the weight. I would have to agree with Mike and suggest doing a foam and clay combo on a 40gal. I think if you did it all clay you would need three people to move it. I did three sides of a 20 and I can barely budge it. They do make different color clays you can get at craft stores that might give a better look. I used clay in all my small Exos. You can see them in my photo album. The best thing about it is you don't have to wait after you're done. You can put the frogs right in.

Cheri you're right the tanks can become very heavy. I had to have help moving my 40 vertical from the basement to the room upstairs. As for color you can put some red clay into the mix to change the color a bit. I really don't mind the color as I'm hoping the moss and creeping fig will cover most of the background. Also as you mentioned I did forget to add that I press into the clay more peat or coco fibers or wood chunks. This breaks up the look as well as provides surface area for things to grow on or from.

[Grrrit]

ok heres a sketchy blueprint of my vision of what i want to build.



the cork log would support a good amount of clay i imagine. as for the walls a may not even go further than the few (2-3) small corkrounds that will be like branches going to the glass and fastend with silicone. i've also been thinking of sporadically siliconing a few flat stones in as ledges. they may help prevent any slide and could possibly help support the clay.

and as for th dripwall below the cork log im kindof lost on how i should do this. i plan to run the water line through the log or tuck it in right along with it to hide it. the method of building it is another story.

let me know what you think! i always enjoy constructive criticism!

[MikeM670]

ok heres a sketchy blueprint of my vision of what i want to build.



the cork log would support a good amount of clay i imagine. as for the walls a may not even go further than the few (2-3) small corkrounds that will be like branches going to the glass and fastend with silicone. i've also been thinking of sporadically siliconing a few flat stones in as ledges. they may help prevent any slide and could possibly help support the clay.

and as for th dripwall below the cork log im kindof lost on how i should do this. i plan to run the water line through the log or tuck it in right along with it to hide it. the method of building it is another story.

let me know what you think! i always enjoy constructive criticism!

My thoughts on support are for areas where you have a larger amount of clay in a vertical position. So if you feel there are areas with more then lets say 12 inches of clay I might want a support ledge of some sorts. For the drip wall there are several factors to think about.

1. Flow rate. Drip walls are just that. Small amounts of water dripping down a wall. So your going to need some sort of pump to handle a low rate of flow or a overflow option. Best if it can be regulated by you to fine tune this.
2. What is the drip wall going to be made of? I have seen videos and articles on just clay for the drip walls. It seems after a few days to weeks there is a film that builds up that keeps the water from contacting the actual clay so you don't have erosion. I'm not sure I would go that way. You can use cork rounds for the drip wall as it contains lots of cracks and crevices that make perfect water holding spots.
3. Your going to need a good water reservoir for the drip wall so it does not run out very quickly. Some of my builds this tends to happen. Also your going to need EASY access to the pump and a very good way to filter the water prior to the pump. So think that one through and do a lot of research.

I love water features but not sure they are worth the hassle.

If your going to install a misting system that might be a better option for a drip wall. Just point one nozzle at the spot you want really wet and spray away. Tho with that option your going to need to drain excess water frequently.

[LilyPad]

Great thread!! Very informative!

[Grrrit]

I was thinking about leaving a space in the drip wall corner open. like a cube missing of the fb and hue my pump with gravel and run the water line tucked against the cork tube. Thanks though, were making progress!

[Grrrit]

I'm going to get river stones (the tumbled smooth rocks) from a pet store. and silicon them together to build a sort of box around the pump. Then silicon a screen to the inside of my stone pump box to keep sediment out and attempt to reduce blockage. And to my understanding it wouldnt take much to stop the flow of a slow moving pump. As to a higher powered pump that could tolerate a little more abuse. I plan to do my best to double the screen between the gravel pit beneath the dripwall and my false bottom to further my attempt in keeping the sediment minimal around the pump. I've even thought about siliconing the bottom layer of stone in place to the glass and make screen walls through the return to the pump. I'll try to make another sketch of what I'm trying to explain when I get home in the morning.

[Grrrit]

ok here's my falsebottom idea. as far as the water area is concerned.



it'll be heavy. but once its done i dont plan on moving it until my lease is up and i can find a bigger house.