Blue and green Whites: different species?

[mrk]

I am greatly confused! For the second time, I have had a frog supplier tell me not to put the blue color White's in with the green. I have 5 baby green colored and want to get one or two Australian blues. I know they originate from different areas so does this mean they shouldn't be in the same habitat? Some people tell me its okay and I have seen pics of this on this Forum, yet some say its not a good idea. Opinions?

[maimedophelia]

You can keep the Australian Whites Tree Frogs (a.k.a Blue Dumpy) with the Indonesian White's Tree Frogs (a.k.a. White Dumpy).

The Australian White's are generally more blue, blue-green, or aqua (but sometimes light green and brown) while the Indonesian White's are typically more pale green, green, and brown. There is nothing wrong with housing these two together however it is not widely favored by the breeding community because there are efforts to preserve the two lines genetically as the Litoria Caerulea (Australian: Blue Phase) are a somewhat newly established line (2+decades).

The only problem you should face is quarantine.

Quarantining your new White's will be really important since the Australian's Whites and Indonesian White's both encounter different types of parasites (they all have them but it's the "how many" that's important) and introducing an unfamiliar parasite (that isn't hurting it's host) can be bad for your pre-existing frogs.

Even some of the very basic common care guides will tell you that you can house these two types together so your local pet-shop owner is either being overly cautious or is misinterpreting the data and mistakes un-advised breeding as un-advised co-habitation.

I personally know of several people who happily and successfully co-habitat different color strains of White's. I wish you the best of luck with yours.

[Katieasaur]

theyre actually the exact same kind of frog from the same place (america as they are no longer allowed to import from australia) they are just different morphs, in other words they kept breeding the bluish colored green frogs until they got the blue frogs

[John]

This one is really a matter of opinion. If you're not going to breed them then there's no harm putting them together - they are similar enough. However, new frogs should always undergo a period of quarantine isolation before introducing them to your old frogs.

[maimedophelia]

While it is illegal to import these frogs, that doesn't mean that it doesn't happen. Sometimes breeders can get them cheaper and will say that their captive bred even if they aren't. This is rare but it happens. Plus, if a breeder has established lines and has been keeping them isolated and consistently bred over multiple generations the starter pair was most likely imported and therefor the parasites and natural bacteria will be passed down for generations - this goes for both color phases - so - even if the frog is legitimately captive bred it will still generally have different inherent parasites and bacteria. There is no harm in quarantining your frogs but the fall out from not doing it because of assumptions could be dangerous (or even deadly) to other frogs regardless of pedigree. Ere on the side of caution for the sake of the little amphibious ones.

[Tony]

While it is illegal to import these frogs, that doesn't mean that it doesn't happen.

Indonesian White's are routinely and legally imported. They are notorious fro bringing in chytrid so make sure they go through a thorough quarantine before introducing them to an existing collection.

[maimedophelia]

Thanks Tony - I wasn't aware that it was still legal for Indonesian White's - good to know.

[mrk]

Thanks so much for the clarification! It is good to know I can tell my daughter we can get the Blue Dumpies she is in love with! (2 hopefully). Now I just have to find some! Any suggestions that don't cost a fortune? I live a couple hours from St. Louis, so maybe a reptile show? Also, how long should I quarantine them? If they naturally carry different parasites, etc., won't they pass them on to the White Dumpies after quarantine too? I will definitely take the time to quarantine to be safe but I don't know how long is long enough!?

[maimedophelia]

"Also, how long should I quarantine them?"

Most things I've read say about 4-6 weeks. If you can get stool samples to a vet in the first week and get them to tell you if there is any major issue you can probably err more toward the 4 week limit - it will give you some assurances either way.

"If they naturally carry different parasites, etc., won't they pass them on to the White Dumpies after quarantine too?"

I honestly don't know - nothing I've read or researched has made that clear to me either. I think it's sort of like how humans all have natural bacteria inside us - more than we actually want to know about - but we don't contaminate anyone else unless the bacteria reach abnormal levels. You're quarantining more for the abnormal level bacteria than the natural bacteria.

A really good book for White's Owners is Care and Breeding of Popular Tree Frogs. It covers a lot of intro owner guidance as well as a fair amount of information about illnesses, treatments, quarantining, etc. It's a great book and really cheep used. Since you have certainly committed to keeping White's it would probably be a great addition to your library.

Enjoy - Blue Dumpies are beautiful little creatures. Your daughter is going to love them. Mine occasionally changes from light brown to bright aqua depending on his mood and cage temperature. Generally he's just a lovely shade of light aqua-blue.

[mrk]

Thanks so much! I plan to get the book very soon. Can't wait to get the Blues, but I am having trouble finding them.