Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 22

Thread: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

  1. #1

    Default Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    This could go in the toad section as well as this section since toads are still considered frogs and the one that I am asking about is actually a climbing toad. I was wondering if anyone knew anything about the Yellow Spotted Climbing toad. I can't find anywhere to purchase one of these except in post from more than 5 years ago in various forums on the internet. They seem really expensive but cool none the less. Any information at all would be appreciated greatly.

  2. # ADS
    Circuit advertisement
    Join Date
    Always
    Posts
    Many
     

  3. #2
    Tony
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    They are sporadically available as imports from Malaysia, as far as I know they have not been bred in captivity. jkooiman or SethD could probably provide some good care info.

  4. #3
    wesleybrouwer
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    Lovely species, one of my favourites.
    Who happen to have been bred in captivity
    In my photo album, 1 juvenile female from around 6 months can be seen.



    I will look my harddrive for some more pictures, i know they have to be there somewhere.

  5. This member thanks wesleybrouwer for this post:


  6. #4
    wesleybrouwer
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    I just noticed there where more pictures in my album on them,

    This is one from about 2 weeks of age:




    They already started hassling the females around 6 months.



    Already witnessed the first amplexed couples around the time the males started to practice calling.




    This reminds me to grab the camera more often, i didn't make pictures for a while


    Here one of my adult females, i won a photo contest with it, so i couldn't help showing her off


  7. This member thanks wesleybrouwer for this post:


  8. #5
    Tony
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    Nice work Wesley, I'm glad to be wrong on this one.

  9. #6

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    Quote Originally Posted by wesleybrouwer View Post
    Lovely species, one of my favourites.
    Who happen to have been bred in captivity
    In my photo album, 1 juvenile female from around 6 months can be seen.



    I will look my harddrive for some more pictures, i know they have to be there somewhere.
    This is really an awsome species. Thank you for posting these. Maybe I can get some one day.

  10. #7
    wesleybrouwer
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    They seem to be sporadicly exported,
    main problem is (was) that they just catch females, since the males look like an uninteresting species to them.

    With these species, it is difficult to get males, just the other way around then normal frog imports.

    I found the freshly imported frogs rather fragile, most of them are heavily parasitised,
    treating is a disaster as well, since they seem to be water proof, except for a small portion of the underside.
    They take up water with this, dosing is rather difficult this way.

    What i noticed was that the male have an even higher mortality rate then the females.
    More then once i ordered some additional males, just to find them dead in the boxes.
    Females seem to be a little stronger, altough i lost a couple of them as well.

    I know got a healthy group, established for over a year or 1,5-2,
    containing 2 males and 5 females.
    They costed me a fortune, but i think it's worth every penny to me.
    I bought most of the males at €125 ($175) each and the females at €185($260) each,
    imagine how it hurt to see them die on you

    Hopefully we will see more of this species in the hobby soon
    Altough around here, most people are only focussing on the poison darts.
    I don't think i will sell lots of the offspring around here unfortunately.


    The tads and juveniles are hard to raise as well.
    I praise myself lucky to have 9 remaining that has past the seemingly critical stage of 6-9 months.
    From the sporadical breeding efforts, all of them experienced the same problem raising them to adulthood.
    The few tads that became toadlets didn't make it past the 6 months.
    Mine are now over a year, but still not fully grown i think, they are still a lot smaller then the WC parents.
    Hopefully everything goes well, so i'll be able to breed the first F2 generation i know off.

    Fingers crossed


    By the way, this is what is a big problem with this species,
    tapeworms, and lots of them.
    This is from one stool of a female i got in.
    Never seen a species with that much tapeworms in it.


  11. This member thanks wesleybrouwer for this post:


  12. #8

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    Quote Originally Posted by wesleybrouwer View Post
    They seem to be sporadicly exported,
    main problem is (was) that they just catch females, since the males look like an uninteresting species to them.

    With these species, it is difficult to get males, just the other way around then normal frog imports.

    I found the freshly imported frogs rather fragile, most of them are heavily parasitised,
    treating is a disaster as well, since they seem to be water proof, except for a small portion of the underside.
    They take up water with this, dosing is rather difficult this way.

    What i noticed was that the male have an even higher mortality rate then the females.
    More then once i ordered some additional males, just to find them dead in the boxes.
    Females seem to be a little stronger, altough i lost a couple of them as well.

    I know got a healthy group, established for over a year or 1,5-2,
    containing 2 males and 5 females.
    They costed me a fortune, but i think it's worth every penny to me.
    I bought most of the males at €125 ($175) each and the females at €185($260) each,
    imagine how it hurt to see them die on you

    Hopefully we will see more of this species in the hobby soon
    Altough around here, most people are only focussing on the poison darts.
    I don't think i will sell lots of the offspring around here unfortunately.


    The tads and juveniles are hard to raise as well.
    I praise myself lucky to have 9 remaining that has past the seemingly critical stage of 6-9 months.
    From the sporadical breeding efforts, all of them experienced the same problem raising them to adulthood.
    The few tads that became toadlets didn't make it past the 6 months.
    Mine are now over a year, but still not fully grown i think, they are still a lot smaller then the WC parents.
    Hopefully everything goes well, so i'll be able to breed the first F2 generation i know off.

    Fingers crossed


    By the way, this is what is a big problem with this species,
    tapeworms, and lots of them.
    This is from one stool of a female i got in.
    Never seen a species with that much tapeworms in it.

    Do you have any that you would be willing to sell? I would deffinately be interested. If not that's ok.

  13. #9
    wesleybrouwer
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    I think it would become even more expensive if i have to ship them all the way across the big pond.
    A large portion of the price i paid includes shipping etc. ofcourse,
    i believe it's cheaper to import directly into the US.
    Didn't kingsnake import them a few years ago?

  14. #10

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    Well Wesley, if you were to sell some how much would you be willing to let one go including shipping. I really do like what you have done with your toads and am very impressed as well.

  15. #11
    Tony
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    Quote Originally Posted by EZweasel View Post
    Well Wesley, if you were to sell some how much would you be willing to let one go including shipping. I really do like what you have done with your toads and am very impressed as well.
    Importing frogs from Europe would likely cost at least a grand, probably more, just in permit and shipping costs. You would be much better off grabbing a group the next time they come in from Malaysia.

  16. #12
    SethD
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    As has been said they are sporadically available in small numbers as WC individuals in the states at fairly high prices of between 60-100$ each. I have one pair but have not tried to breed them. They have been sporadically bred over here in the states too but when it was done there was virtually no demand even at the reasonable price of 30-35$ for well started individuals. Saw cheap CB juveniles sit with the same wholesalers for months a few years ago. If your patient and keep a close eye on what is being imported for a year or two you can probably find some WC adults, otherwise your likely out of luck. Care is very similar to a lot of large tropical tree frogs except they are more active during daylight hours than your average tree frog. They are also unusual for a toad in that breeding does not require much careful cycling from what I understand. It seems they can breed with just good feeding and some time in a rain chamber. I know my male goes girl crazy every so often with no environmental changes at all.

  17. #13
    jkooiman
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    .[/QUOTE] Saw cheap CB juveniles sit with the same wholesalers for months a few years ago.[/QUOTE]

    @ Seth When was this, I don't remember that?

    Next to Atelopus these are my dream species. Hands down.

    Thanks Wesley Brouwer for the great info!

    They are notoriously difficult from all I've read. Steve Busch in Oregon, USA, bred them though. The metamorphs were typically tiny, as is customary for Bufonids. I have no idea what happened to his metamorphs, I'm wondering if these are the ones Seth is referring to?

    Whatever the case, I believe most of these SE asian imports have a reputation for arriving in bad condition, across the board, regardless of genus. And then there's Chytrid...

    Whatever the case, I would keep these ventilated above all else. Species that have skin that deflects water seem to be built for water conservation. Most SE asian Rhacophorids also are built for are very well-ventilated setup.

    I read that this species avidly accepts carpenter ants, indicating that they may pursue an ant-eating lifestyle, not a good omen for hobbiests. It would seem though, that with heavy supplementations, such a dietary hurdle could be surmounted, As is seen in the modern dart hobby. I have never seen, nor owned one, very cool though, an admirable endeavor, whatever the case. Thanks, JVK

  18. #14
    SethD
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    Quote Originally Posted by jkooiman View Post
    .
    Saw cheap CB juveniles sit with the same wholesalers for months a few years ago.[/QUOTE]

    @ Seth When was this, I don't remember that?[/QUOTE]

    Circa 2005 to 2007 or so.

    Next to Atelopus these are my dream species. Hands down.

    They are notoriously difficult from all I've read.
    I haven't found mine to be that hard. I bought two pairs at the same time because just because the price was as low as most wanted for one pair. One pair died within the first month, the other pair is still going strong about two years later.

    Steve Busch in Oregon, USA, bred them though. The metamorphs were typically tiny, as is customary for Bufonids. I have no idea what happened to his metamorphs, I'm wondering if these are the ones Seth is referring to?
    Yes, he bred them several times. "Reptile depot" had some spawn for them and did not sell the offspring for quite a long time either. Sandy Mascarino also bred them some in the mid 90's and wrote a "reptiles" magazine article about breeding them if I recall. I believe several europeans have bred them at various times too though I don't know who specifically.

    Whatever the case, I would keep these ventilated above all else. Species that have skin that deflects water seem to be built for water conservation. Most SE asian Rhacophorids also are built for are very well-ventilated setup.
    Mine have virtually zero ventilation and have been doing fine in a twenty gallon vertical for right at two years. Of course I don't over water either but I think getting healthy individuals to begin with is the biggest issue.

    I read that this species avidly accepts carpenter ants, indicating that they may pursue an ant-eating lifestyle, not a good omen for hobbiests.
    Mine readily feed on half grown crickets, small roaches, moths, smaller sized june bugs, and so forth. They will take some mealworms too but seem to prefer faster moving prey. They will not take food items as large as many other toads of similar size will take but as long as then food items are lively and not to big they are not picky.

  19. #15
    wesleybrouwer
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    I also use a main diet of small crickets, besides that, they prefer other small prey over larger ones.
    Here they are used to be eating crickets as a main food source, wich i gutload and supplement, waxworms, small grasshoppers etc.

    I do keep them well ventilated and rather dry in times.
    When i do so, they hide theirselfs in the branches and go out in the evening/night to burry theirselfs in the soil.
    This i do keep somewhat moist, so they can still regulate their water levels.
    In some of the hollow cork branches i put in some moist moss as well.

    After the dry period, i give them a wetter period in wich i let the water feature in front rise.
    I noticed they are quit adapted to swimming as well.

    I make usage of UV lights, and i do see them taking advantage of this,
    they often go and sit in the rays for a while, after wich they will retreat in their cork bark again.

    For the easyness of keeping them, i must say, getting them healthy after import can be difficult.
    Maybe it depends on the exporter and importer what shape you'll get them in.
    After they are asteblished, i must agree, they aren't that easy to stress anymore.
    The only thing is they often scratch their noses against something.

    No offence, but i think the viv of 20 gal is quit small for these frogs.
    Especially since they are easily around 3-3,5 inch each.
    If i am right, a 20 gallon tank high is 24" x 12" x 16".
    I used to quarantaine them in a 52 gallon viv i believe, altough i am not used to measure in gallons.
    The viv was 90x50x50 cm (35x20x20 inch) and it went ok.
    But now i put them in their final terrarium, i notice a huge difference in behavior.
    I think these toads need to be properly housed since they tend to move lots around the space they have available.
    I now house them (7) in a 150x65x130cm (60x26x51 inch) or 335 gallon tank.

    About the breeding of reptile depot i did not know.
    The breeding attempt as written in Reptiles, i do know off, i also mailed with the author, but i got the same reply i got from the zoo in Europe that bred them.
    Difficult to raise the tads to toadlets, and high mortality with the toadlets as well.
    I to experienced this mortality rate to be extremely high, i think the critical stage lies around 6-9 months.
    After that period i didn't loose any more of them.
    I'll try to mail with Steve Busch then to see what things he did different,
    maybe i can see what makes it easy for him to raise a large amount and keep them in large amount strong and going from clutch to adults.

    I was already planning to try again, since i cycled them again and 3 of the females are getting gravid again.

    Like you said, the males will go girl crazy a lot, that is true, but having them in amplex isn't the difficult part.
    Just like all toads, getting the eggs is the tricky part
    In my experience they do need the cycle to get gravid, i use a dry/hot period followed by a colder/wet period in wich i heavily feed, that seems to be working best for me.
    I don't see and hear much from them when it is dry and warm (30-32 degrees C)
    but as soon as it is getting wetter the males will start chasing the girls.
    Can it be that the little ventilation is a trigger in you're case? Cooling down at night, getting the humidity up ?

  20. This member thanks wesleybrouwer for this post:


  21. #16
    SethD
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    Quote Originally Posted by wesleybrouwer View Post
    I
    No offence, but i think the viv of 20 gal is quit small for these frogs.
    Especially since they are easily around 3-3,5 inch each.
    If i am right, a 20 gallon tank high is 24" x 12" x 16".
    I used to quarantaine them in a 52 gallon viv i believe, altough i am not used to measure in gallons.
    It is actually a 20 gallon long set up as a vertical and I would not argue that it is on the small side. Size would be 30" x 12" x 12" in inches. I used it because it was what I had available when I first got them. I had planned to increase the size later after they were established but they seemed to do quite well as is and space is tight so I never bothered. If I was going recommend a tank to set up from scratch for a pair a 40 gal breeder tank set up as a vertical with lots of branches would be just about right in my opinion.


    In my experience they do need the cycle to get gravid, i use a dry/hot period followed by a colder/wet period in wich i heavily feed, that seems to be working best for me.
    I don't see and hear much from them when it is dry and warm (30-32 degrees C)
    but as soon as it is getting wetter the males will start chasing the girls.
    Can it be that the little ventilation is a trigger in you're case? Cooling down at night, getting the humidity up ?
    Could be, never bred them myself and was just going by what I had heard. As far as what triggers my male sometimes, I don't think that is it as sometimes he goes after the female during the day and sometimes at night and the humidity is always pretty high(false bottom tank) though not so high as to fog up the glass.. Like you say though males are not usually that hard to get interested with most toad species and the issue is usually getting the females to lay eggs.

  22. #17
    jkooiman
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    [/QUOTE]
    Yes, he bred them several times. "Reptile depot" had some spawn for them and did not sell the offspring for quite a long time either. Sandy Mascarino also bred them some in the mid 90's and wrote a "reptiles" magazine article about breeding them if I recall. I believe several europeans have bred them at various times too though I don't know who specifically.
    .[/QUOTE]

    I had forgotten about Mascarino Seth, I think I remember something about Steve helping Sandy out a bunch with that, or swapping breeders or something.I didn't realize Steve bred them more than once.

    Funny the toadlets didn't sell for awhile, you would think some of them might still be circulating around though, being captive bred, and I would assume hardy and long-lived. Of course males are pretty drab, and quite a few females pics' I've seen, I can only imagine how small, brown, and generic the toadlets would be to sell.

    A Long Term Captive pair was offered somewhere in Las Vegas last year, I should have jumped on them sooner. Their prices are usually horrendous though, rightly so if they are acclimated I would guess.

    @ Wesley, that is very interesting information about the tapeworms. All of the information you've shared has been awesome.

    I'm interested in the tadpole/metamorph failure. This species breeds in slow moving jungle streams from what I understand. But that could mean anything, I've noticed that hobbyists can uncover the craziest minute specializations in species. JVK

  23. #18
    SethD
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    Funny the toadlets didn't sell for awhile, you would think some of them might still be circulating around though, being captive bred, and I would assume hardy and long-lived.
    I bought a group of six CB toadlets from reptile depot at the time for 30$ each. They ate well, grew a lot and seemed to do ok for a while but as they started to approach adulthood they all died off one by one over a space of two months or so. They were housed in a 75 gallon with about a half screen top so lots of ventilation in that particular case. Never did figure out why they died as there was no obvious reason, they would just be dead one morning. Could have been anything, something lacking in the diet, some disease, who knows.

  24. This member thanks SethD for this post:


  25. #19
    kerokero
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    wesleybrouwer has provided some excellent information on this species which seems consistent with other information I've gathered on these animals. It seems that the care needs that match these toads most similar are along the lines of Phyllomedusa species, like a slightly more humid (mid-canopy) version of P. bicolor. Like P. bicolor they will survive in smaller tanks with less movement, more humidity, and less air movement, but show the best health and behavior when given a set up similar to some Panther Chameleon set ups I know! While a vertical tank gives an impression of more "room", these guys (like most arboreals) are still looking for footprint, they just want it above the floor of the tank, so I don't think putting them in a 40breeder vertical is actually giving them more usable space. A 60 breeder (same footprint but taller) would be a much better option, but still on the small side.

    I do want to note that with at least a few of the breedings mentioned, they were with freshly imported animals and were not repeated in later years. I don't know much about Steve's experiences with them since I've not seen him give out details (at least not on the forums), but I know Reptile Depot's animals were fresh imports and not totally expected. I'd love to get more details on how tads were raised (Steve mentioned that they had the best success raising them in a pond set up) as it may play a part in the toadlet mortality. I also wonder about toadlet access to UV (more work needs to be done with this idea with amphibians - if the adults use a UV basking spot it may be important to the toadlets) as that can significantly influence toadlet growth and mortality in other toad species.

    Other factors that influence died offs at that stage in life tend to be nutritional - either adult, tadpole, or early toadlet.

    I think part of the issue with the toadlets not selling was the pure mass amount of them that were available for a relatively unknown animal. Two breedings produced a flood of them! I'm not sure they were overly flashy at that age either, and when you try and look up care for them it's basically unknown - the summary here from Wesley is the best I've seen so far.

    Can anyone give descriptions on their WC care in more detail? I've worked with Rhacophorids from the same shipments, and suspect exporter care may play a part on why these animals are in tough shape (it's just too consist in the same issues with most of the frogs being exported!). I know treating for digestive parasites in particular is tricky, since the sudden death of a heavy load of parasites can lead to huge issues with bleeding and infections. Are there ideas on slowly lowering the populations of parasites (like fish keepers using garlic foods for imports) to get populations lower before the heavy duty treatments?

  26. #20
    SethD
    Guest

    Default Re: Curious about a species of climbing toad...

    Maybe I will fiddle with my pair in a couple of months and try to breed them, perhaps there is more interest in the species this time.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Curious about frog in garden
    By JungleJunkie in forum Introductions Area
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: May 12th, 2011, 09:11 PM
  2. Replies: 3
    Last Post: February 27th, 2011, 01:59 PM
  3. Fire Bellied Toad Species
    By firebellied zach in forum General Discussion & News
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: November 30th, 2010, 10:13 PM
  4. Frog I Found. Am Curious.
    By hs981 in forum Introductions Area
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: April 17th, 2010, 07:00 PM
  5. Toad species/mixing need clarification
    By stickytoes in forum Toads
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: November 30th, 2009, 03:03 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •