Chinese Grocery Store

[Wambli]

I went to the Chinese grocery store last night and they sell live bullfrogs along with lots of other live animals to eat… I got a male… yellow neck… big ear… American bullfrog. I sifted through a tank with about 50 frogs in it… they were piled 2 deep in most areas where the water ran in like a waterfall. After handling most of the boys to find the smallest one and the one with no marks or cuts. I sacked him up.. And paid 2.73 for him tax included… 5.00 a lb. When I got home and put speedie next to him… he is 2X her size… but I don’t think he can get his mouth around her. He is not bashful at all… once I got him in the pen he saw a crawdad in the water and BAM he went in after it. Wow… was that exciting. The funny thing is that speedie and the un-named male bullfrog hung out all night together… and this morning it looked like ¼ of the feeder fish were gone. I am thinking that they did not feed him since he came out of the pond since he was to be sold as food. He is a very nice looking frog… his colors are bright. I just don’t want him to eat speedie… she is 3” he is 5” . Maybe I need to release him at my friends farm and get a male closer to her size? Or do you think she is safe?

[SludgeMunkey]

PLEASE!

Do not release him into the wild. He could be carrying diseases and parasites from god knows where that could devastate the wild amphibian population in your area. Especially if it is from the conditions you describe. there is no telling where the frog came from or what it has been exposed to in such cramped quarters.

It is better to keep one separate in temporary quarters until they are of compatible size.

[Wambli]

So I might have infected my frog with the new frog... can I have it checked out at the vet? or is it something I will see soon... I had no idea... the frog looks healthy... he ate right a way... ? wow... stupid me... I just thought it would be easer than walking around in the swamp again to find a male....

[Kurt]

You should always quarantine all new animals before introducing them to your other established animals. So there is a high possibility for cross infection in this situation of yours. It would be a good idea to see the vet, have them both checked out. A fecal test should be done as well and your fecal sample should be no more than 24 hours old. Any older and it is no good for testing. I think is an extremely safe bet that there will be gastrointestinal parasites in the fecal sample.

Also it is illegal to release captive animals into the wild even if they are native.

[John]

Also it is illegal to release captive animals into the wild even if they are native.

Is this a US federal law? Remember that this is an international web site (it's actually located in London, England). I'd be very interested in seeing the text of that law.

[Kurt]

I believe it to be a US Fedral Law. Don't know where to find the actual text of the law. Sorry.

[John]

I believe it to be a US Fedral Law. Don't know where to find the actual text of the law. Sorry.

I think this is highly suspect. Otherwise there are kids all over the US breaking the law when they let their froglets go after keeping tadpoles.

[Kurt]

Well they are not going to chase after little kids. It aimed at people releasing pets after they get bored with or overwhelmed by their pets and let them go. It to protect native species from disease and invasive species. I know it a law in MA and I am 75% certain it applies to the entire country.

[John]

What you just described does not describe releasing native species back to where they came from. I'd like something solid.

[Kurt]

The disease part does. Tell you what I will do some digging and let you know what I find.

[John]

Thanks, that would be great.

[Ebony]

Wambli

I can't imagine what it would have been like to see those poor Frogs in the store. It would have been hard not to save the lot.

I hope your Frogs will be ok. Unfortunatly I had to learn the hard way about putting a new Frog in quarantine. Good luck at the Vets

[John]

I can't imagine what it would have been like to see those poor Frogs in the store. It would have been hard not to save the lot.

I understand where you're coming from, but American Bullfrogs are a plague species. Don't pity them - almost every other frog and toad species needs your pity ahead of those. American Bullfrog's are like Marine/Cane Toads in many parts of the US, and usually bigger.

[Ebony]

Wow! I have heard of frogs being a problem in places around the world. Guess Its like Possum's here.

[SludgeMunkey]

Is this a US federal law? Remember that this is an international web site (it's actually located in London, England). I'd be very interested in seeing the text of that law.

As far as I have been able to find out it is not a federal law, however, it is State law just about everywhere, as best as I can tell. Many, many Cities and counties also have similar laws.

So, thanks to the Lacey Act, in some cases it could be a federal offense, since the Lacey Act re-enforces state and local laws. Simply put- if it is illegal to do in a state, then it is illegal federally.

[adawinters]

Do you know if the releasing laws have any exemptions for minors? I know that states that require herping permits also have policies (sometimes? I don't know about all 50 states, and some have no herping policies at all) wherin children/minors can catch amphibians without the required permits. I just wondered if release laws have any age-specific exemptions as well.

Sorry if I'm keeping us off topic. I hope that speedy will be ok with the new guy. Maybe, once you finish the quarantine period, you could introduce them for supervised together-time? You could monitor their interactions to see if there is any aggression/food dominance/attempted ingestion spurred on by the size discrepancy, while you're there to break it up. Over a few weeks/months of supervised visits, you might better be able to judge if they can be housed together. (And Speedy will have grown a bit, anyway.) At 3 and 5 inches, does it really look like he can fit her in his mouth? (I've never actually kept bullfrogs, so while I know they're voracious eaters, I'm not sure how big their prey items get. I could easily be way off the mark.)

[Kurt]

I think the frogs have already been introduced and house together.

[SludgeMunkey]

I agree Kurt.

The good news is, Bullfrogs are hardy lads, and this thread has developed nicely into information on adding animals to an existing collection.

[John]

Except that your signature says frogs are reptiles...

[adawinters]

Awww... but it's Ambrose Bierce... ya gotta love Ambrose Bierce.