NO NO NO!!! Another sick red-eye

[LIZZIE82]

Isabel, my red-eye tree frog is sick, I think. I have that horrible, sinking feeling. I left town on Saturday for a day trip. I came home about 2 am and she didn't move since when I left at 9am. I wonder if she just slept through b/c of the normal night/day light thing and my interaction with her.

Sammy, my other red-eye died last week. They were in the same tank at the pet store. I think he died of a parasite that she may have, as well. I have some antibiotics that I had for Sammy. I called my vet and he said to give it to her, as well.

I cannot watch her die, too. I really hope I'm wrong. I really, really hope I'm wrong. If she doesn't make it, I will never do frogs again! I have tried so so so hard to keep these guys happy and healthy and they just die on me!!!

[bshmerlie]

Lizzie you mentioned in another post that you have lost three frogs in the last month. We would like to help but we need some further information and background from you.
1. Where did you purchase them from?
2. Were they wild caught or captive bred?
3. How old were each of them?
4. What are your temps and humidity?
5. What are you using to monitor it?
6. Do you have live plants or fake plants?
7. What kind of substrate? And drainage layer?
8. How were they when you got them?...active? ...eating?
9. What kind of water are you using for misting and soaking?
10. We need to see pictures of your enclosures....asap.
11. Where are they located in your house? Is it quiet enough? Or heavy traffic area?
12. Is it completely dark for them at night?
13. What size are they and what size is their food? What are you feeding them?
Sometimes you buy a sick frog and despite your best efforts they don't make it. Other times environmental conditions are not meeting the frogs needs and that stress can make them susceptible to diseases and parasites. It is important to figure out what is going on in your situation to help stop the demise of your frogs. Please post pictures of your frog and enclosure so that we can better help you.

[clownonfire]

The answers you will give to Cheri's questions will really help.

I wanted to know, did you bring your animals to a vet at this point? I can't remember if you answered this already?

Eric

[LIZZIE82]

Thanks for the replies, guys.

I'm going to answer all the questions. Please, any suggestions are appreciated! If I'm doing something wrong, please tell me, but be nice. There is sooo much conflicting info out there!

1: Petco
2: I have been told Captive-bred. I wonder, though.
3: Not sure the age; less than a year.
4: Temp is about 75 during the day. I let it drop to the lowest at 66 at night. Humidity can fluxuate. It's between 55 to 75, depending when I mist.
5: I have a digital gauge for temp... and I have a gauge for humidity.
6: I have a live bromeliad and fake plants, too. I have some rocks in there, too. I also have a plant background that surrounds the back of the terranium and half of the side.
7: I use half eco-earth and half paper towels. I had all eco earth but they would just get covered in it and I wasn't able to see if it needed cleaned. I bought some moss that I'm scared to put in. I don't want them to get impacted..
8: They were fine.
9: I use spring and or distilled.
10: I have a picture posted.
11: They are in the dining room. It's just me in an apartment. They are alone all day and only have to put up with me at night and I'm normally in the living room.
12: As dark as can be. I have lights outside my window that shine in a little. That's why I have the background on the side that faces the window to get it as dark in there as possible.
13: I feed crickets, the smallest I can get. No wings. I use the rule of no longer than between the eyes. I also got some roaches and phoenix worms that my sister raises. (She breeds cameleons, and knows A LOT about amphibians and has also worked in many vet offices. So, she has been able to help a lot. She thinks there is a communal parasite going on. She also told me NOT to get red-eyes!)
Isabel is about 1.5 inches long.

Last night, when she was still asleep I gave her .01cc of Baytril. She got up at the normal time with her little yawning ritual. She ate and prowled around and then she went back to sleep. Do you think she's bored? I think she might miss Sammy. She looked for him for a long time after I put him in another tank. Then, I removed my green tree frog that I have in there because I was told to not mix species but I think she misses her. I know my green tree frog misses her. They were buddies and would lay together on a leaf. They would get up and I would catch them roaming around together. I would like to get her a buddy, but I'm afraid of bringing more disease to the mix, ya know?

I had my other two at the vet. I have not taken this one in. There is nothing physically saying that she is sick. Just a feeling and that she doesn't stay up like she used to. I called the vet and he told me to use the AB that he put Sammy on. I haven't been able to find a good vet that specializes in Amphibians. This one supposedly does, but he doesn't seem to know most of the answers to my questions. I have called several others in the surrounding areas. They are all so pessimistic. Saying that if they "look sick, then it's probably too late." One said that I could bring them in but she didn't think she could do anything. I didn't like the attitude that they were doomed without them being seen and didn't want to drop 100.00 for a visit for her to say there was nothing they could do. It was also over an hour away and I don't want to stress them.

About the terrarium: I have a screen on the top. I have the hood halfway on so the plant can get the fluorescent light and they will have ventilation. I also have a lamp for warmth during the day.

thanks for any help!!



I posted a pic of the tank, it's a 20 gal, tall.
Also, a picture of Isabel and Charlotte, my green tree, cuddled on a leaf.

[bshmerlie]

Lizzie...thanks for the answers to the questions. I also went back through and read your other posts And I am very concerned for your frogs. You said that you have lost three frogs in the last month. Please don't purchase anymore until we have this figured out and the two remaining frogs are thriving. Here is what I would do given the situation you are in right now. It is time to set up a more natural environment for your frogs to live in. You are going to need a few things so here is a list:
1. Leca or hydroton (red or brown clay balls sold at Petco) for the drainage layer.
2. Screen mesh to lay on top of Leca to keep soil out of it.
3. Appropriate size heat mat for side of tank.
4. Lots of Plants- very broad leafed plants....look for leaves that are three or four inches wide. Lots of plants. POTHOS is a good one and easy to grow.
5. Soil-preferably ABG mix...I believe Joshs Frogs sells it....he is a sponsor on our website here. If that's not an option ...just get one or two of the coco fiber bricks you can get at petco.
6. Sticks or branches to help break up the scenery or you can buy those flexible vine things at petco and give them climbing options.
7. Leaf litter...Joshs frogs

Once you have all your supplies put your red eye into the critter keeper and gut the 20 gallon. Clean it out really well. Lay down your Leca. You can slope it like a hill or use a piece of cork bark or wood to help make tiered levels to raise up the plants and give the tank more dimension. You can use old tupperwares underneath if you don't have that much Leca. It will take up some dead space and help you to create taller hills. Have at least two inches of Leca for your drainage layer. Then cut your screen to size and place it over the Leca. Add your soil. Now add your plants....a lot of them. Take them out of their containers and wash off all the soil. Rinse them really well. Put in a lot of plants leaving a space in the front if the tank for the water bowl and a small cricket dish. Once all your plants are in sprinkle down some leaf litter...that will help keep your frogs clean. Stick your heatmat to the side of the tank. I don't use overhead headlamps as I think it dries out the tank too much. You can cover up part of the top of the tank with a piece of plexi if you need to raise the humidity. I use the gallon sandwich bags ...dont tell anyone. I would keep both frogs in the tank until you can purchase and setup another enclosure for the other frog. The stress of being kept in a critter keeper is going to kill him eventually. I would also either block the light from window ir cover up the tank at night so they have complete darkness. The whole point of all of this is to make your frogs feel comfortable and secure. There should be so many large leafed plants that they could completely hide from you if they wanted to and you wouldn't be able to find them by just looking in. The more cover they have the more they will move around the tank. If they only have one plant they wont stray too far from it. They don't want to sit out in the open. Once they are more comfortable they wont mind doing that. The plants and soil will also help you maintain the proper humidity. Did I mention a lot of plants.........when you look at your tank it should say "Tropical Jungle". Your tank should never be sparse or bare looking. Remember they walk from branch to branch.

[LIZZIE82]

Thanks for the info!

OK, tell me if this will work:

A bottom layer of hydro balls. With a hill about 5 inches high on the left side, going down at slope. A small slope on right side and then have it flat for a soaking dish. I will use eco earth over the balls. Plant my bromeliad in the eco earth, buy the pothos plants and plant directly in soil. In the middle of the two slopes i will put a small food dish. Some branches for climbing. Can i use moss instead of leaf litter?

I will get an under tank heater.

Is this ok? I will do it ASAP.

[DonLisk]

I use Moss with my Red Eyes and I have a tropical sheet moss in their tank.

I also use Snake Plant with my Red Eyes and they love sleeping on the snake plant.
I would suggest putting your Brom in a piece of driftwood or cork round to lessen the chance of the planted section from rotting.

Also, don't forget to use the screen material between the hydroballs and the substrate or you will have a mess later on.

[LIZZIE82]

What is snake plant?

[bshmerlie]

Just google snake plant