Help! Red Eye Tree Frog problem!! Red Wounds on belly.

[kittysolo]

I joined FrogForum.net a few days ago to post about my new red eyes, I mentioned that I had a frog who developed red wounds on his belly and after the vet treated him with Ivermectin he died. I discovered the problem last Sat night, by Monday many more wounds had appeared.
This cannot wait till Monday, and I do not know of another Exotic Vet in the area. I can only predict this frogs wounds will progress the same.

I check on all my frogs last night (as I do every day since last weeks discovery), all frogs appeared healthy with bright white bellies. I just checked on them again to find one with several red dots on his belly, and one red lump on his side. I separated him to a tank lined with only paper towels.

I read the article about emergency frog care, I have access to both Flaygil and Bayril, can I use them both as precaution? Also thinking about putting a dab on Neosporin on the dots. I gave a random fecal sample from 2 of my 5 frogs to the vet on Thurs, I'm awaiting response from that.

Like I said the same red dots appeared on another frog last Sat night and by Monday he was covered.

Heeelllppp!!

[Tony]

Why did your vet prescribe ivermectin? It is a powerful anti-parasitic drug and can be difficult to properly dose. Skin lesions like that are likely to be bacterial, not from parasites. I would treat with Baytril.

[Kurt]

Or SMZ or Amikacin. It definitely looks like red-leg, which is very contagous and can develop under unsanitary conditions. So clean that cage well and get to the vet and tell him treat with the previously mentioned drugs. My preference is Amikacin, as Baytril can be a little too strong.

[kittysolo]

The tanks are clean, I last deep cleaned them a week ago and change their water everyday. How often do you recommend the tanks are cleaned? Every time I have moved the other frogs to clean they shed their skin and it become a dramatic event for the both of us!
I got this frog 2 weeks ago.

The vet said he used one drop of Ivermectin and perscribed either Baytril orally or a drop on the skin of Ciprofloxacin Ophthalmic Solution everyday for a week, to try to cure the red bumps on the last frog, but he died before we could start the treatment.

[kittysolo]

It definitely looks like red-leg

I just looked that up, your right. I read it can be caused by any stressing factor. They were just shipped from the breeder and then I brought them home. Since I brought this guy home he has been moved to a different tank because of the same problem with the other frog last week.
I'm going to try Baytril baths till Mon, and on Mon I'll get the Ciprofloxacin Opthalmic Solution the vet prescribed for the last frog. I like the idea of just one drop a day on his back for treatment, which I can do without even waking him up.

[Leefrogs]

OH YA, I rembrr your last post that's the vet who didn't know that red eyes have white markings on their backs. I would take whatever meds and info he has and throw it in the trash. If you give your frog a drop of that ivermectin and (another one)he dies, then will you listen to us??

It's stress realated you've had them two weeks and deep cleaned the cage already. What did you use to clean?

[Kurt]

You could be over cleaning as well, causing more stress. When I get new frogs, they are kept on paper towels for a few weeks, before they get their permanent substrate.

[kittysolo]

I'm not trying Ivermectin again, but I do want to try the Cipro because it will be much easier on the frog to administer than Baytril. Te vet said Cipro is just a higher cleaner version of baytril.

I cleaned because of the red dots appearing on the last frogs belly. I had no clue what it was and took precaution incase it was contagious. I'm using a cleaner called Healthy Habitat.

I did try a baytril bath last night, but the frog really didn't like it. He spent the whole time trying to break out of the container (I used reverse osmosis trepid water). Dose him orally probably isn't going to be any easier on him. Without antibiotic there isn't a chance of healing is there?

[Leefrogs]

I don't mean to jump on you, it's more anger tward the vet. I'm sorry I seem cross.
I would try treating his water bowl and see if he likes it better. I maybe wrong on this, as he may freik out anyways. I've never had to treat with mess.

To reduce stress in the new environment, I would cover 3 or more sides of the tank. Leave just a crack, so you can see if he's using the water bowl.

[Herpvet]

Or SMZ or Amikacin. It definitely looks like red-leg, which is very contagous and can develop under unsanitary conditions. So clean that cage well and get to the vet and tell him treat with the previously mentioned drugs. My preference is Amikacin, as Baytril can be a little too strong.

Hi Kurt,

Just curious as to this statement? Amikacin is a generally more toxic (kidney) drug than baytril (enrofloxacin) - have you seen lots of reactions with baytril in practice? I tend to avoid it in amphibs due to its irritancy making it unsuitable, in my view, for topical/transcutaneous administration, but would be interested to hear if you have experienced problems with baytril?

Cheers,

Bruce.

[Kurt]

I have experienced some burning and scale loss in snakes at the injection site.

[kittysolo]

I have another frog now with the same red wound on his foot. I feel so helpless.

I started Cipro drops yesterday, I can give it to them without having to disturb them which is really nice. I moved the tanks from my living room to my kitchen so they can be as undisturbed as possible. I also covered up the sides of the tanks with cardboard to try to keep them even more isolated. The kitchen still gets a lot of light, so I think I'm going to cover up the windows too.

I have been told to clean out the tanks with diluted bleach, and read on a site to change the paper towels everyday. I haven't to avoid further stressing them, but do you think its a good idea? The new frog that has the wound (Charlie) was in a different tank, but was housed with Bernard(sick guy on post) till Sat (and that tank was put together a week before). I'm wondering if there's some sort of bacteria that was left behind which caused Charlie to become sick too.

When Eloise got this this last week within 2 days she was covered in hemorrhages, Bernard has not developed any new ones, but the ones hes gotten have gotten worse everyday.

Day one is pictured above.

Day three:


Day four:


This is Charlie today

[Leefrogs]

I really feel for you. Bleach has to be rinsed really well. Like 2/3times. And diluted allot, like 1-10 parts water. If you can smell the bleach in the cage, that's not good. Bleach leaves a residue, that could be sticking around. When I deep clean , I dunk in bleach/water, scrub, and soak in water for 10X longer than they were in the bleach. For spot cleaning I use vinegar water. Vinager evaporates faster than water and leaves no residue.

I'm glad you've covered the cages this may aide in recovery.
Maybe change to spring water while they're in treatment.
But now after all this, it could've started with the bleach.

[kittysolo]

Maybe change to spring water while they're in treatment.
But now after all this, it could've started with the bleach.

I have not bleached, the tank was cleaned with Healthy Habitat cleaner originally, and when I removed Bernard from the tank with Charlie and Faraday on Sat I did not clean the tank.
I was asking if I should clean the tank now, or just leave them alone?

I've been using reverse osmosis water, is spring water better for them?

[Kurt]

Oh yeah don't use reverse ossmosis water. This could be part of the problem. Mist with distilled water and fill the water bowl(s) with either dechlorinated tap or spring water.

Clean out the tank and all its funiture with a bleach/water solution, about a 1:10 ratio. Rinse thoroughly and rinse with water with dechlorinator in it. Wooden items cannot be bleached, but you can boil or bake them. Plastic cannot be boiled or baked, but can be bleached.

Lastly get these guys to the vet.

[kittysolo]

Lastly get these guys to the vet.

Been to the vet already, their on a Ciprofloxacin prescription right now. I'll bleach their tanks tonight, everything's glass or plastic in their tanks.

Everything I read online is different, about their care. I'll switch to spring water, I've been using distilled water in the 29g's fogger, I'll start using that in the mister too.


Thank you so much!

[kittysolo]

Just finished bleaching the tanks. Really worried that both Bernard and Charlie started bleeding. A wound on Charlies foot opened up, and I'm not sure what exactly bleed on Bernard. I swabbed them with neosporin before I put them back in their tanks.
Oy vey! I really hope that was worth it!
I switched them to spring water too.

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[Kurt]

Time will tell. Good luck and you're welcome.

[kittysolo]

He died... I head a squeaky groan and looked into the tank to find him dead on his back...
I feel empty now. Incredibly worried about the rest.

[Leefrogs]

I'm so sorry for your loss. I hope the other 3 are ok.
My thaughts are with you.