Bufo nebulifer (Picture heavy)

[Kurt]

They were lumped together under Bufo. Interesting to note that coniferus and the extinct periglenes are also currently found in the genus of Ollotis.

[John]

They were lumped together under Bufo.

I thought you might say that. It is one thing to change an old taxonomic lumping but completely another to lump obviously not closely allied species in a "new" genus. Someone needs to publish something solid to deal with this chaos caused by Frost.

[Kurt]

You can always write a strongly worded letter to Frost or we can go visit him at the AMNH in NYC.

[Ebony]

He he...you guys do this allot..dont you. He He, you crack me up

[John]

Yes we do. To my eye, Kurt tends to accept anything published in a journal as being gospel. Myself, I am a career research scientist and I know better :P. Especially when many authorities aren't swallowing these proposed name changes - and that's all they are Kurt, proposed - they mean nothing if most zoologists don't accept them and use them.

Addition: Further to my last point, this paper has been out for 3 years now and Amphibiaweb is still towing the old line, as are many others. I think that says something.

[Kurt]

I see your point very clearly and I respect it. Do I agree with it? Part of me does, but then part of me doesn't. I am kind of on the fence. To me it makes sense that a genus like Bufo should be broken up to some degree and maybe you can agree with that statement. If I am understanding you, you just disagree with Frost's proposal? Hyla and Dendrobates were also broken up and I support the changes to Hyla even more. With Dendrobates I am on the fence.

Its funny how this all started. Johnny stated he was having a tough time finding info on Bufo nebulifer, so I suggested he try searching using the "new" name Ollotis nebulifer. Never meant to start an argument with John.

[John]

I think of it as a constructive debate!