Petsmart employees

[into]

I'm just ranting here, but went to the local Petsmart today (because they are cleaner than the local Petco) and noticed 2 dead fire bellied toads in their tank under the water. I told the cricket lady and she shrugged it off and seemed annoyed that I told her about it (i was polite). People that don't care about animals shouldn't be working at pet stores. It's weird, the store is the cleanest in town but the animals don't seem as healthy.

[John]

Most people don't think of animals like frogs as mattering in any way - they're not dogs right? That's probably the case here.

[John]

Good Lord by adding the word dogs to that message I changed both of the google ads completely...

[into]

I actually said that to my girlfriend... if it was a dead dog, it would be different. I understand that frogs to most people are icky cold blooded display objects, but it still looks bad for the store to have dead animals laying around.

[adawinters]

I'm sure she would have cared more if it was an animal she could sell for $200 instead of $2. To be honest, I have largely lost my ability to be outraged when petstores mistreat animals. I am, instead, overwhelmingly stunned and surprised when they don't.

[JeffX]

I'm sure she would have cared more if it was an animal she could sell for $200 instead of $2. To be honest, I have largely lost my ability to be outraged when petstores mistreat animals. I am, instead, overwhelmingly stunned and surprised when they don't.

I know how you feel about that one.

Its not just the employees but some of the customers as well. I had many customers come in and I'd refuse to sell them an animal due to them not having the proper setup. They wouldn't even care and even some would actually say it's only 5 dollars. I don't really care.

[adawinters]

I know! I've got a friend who really wants to get a goldfish in a 1 gallon bowl. I explained to her that this was not nearly big enough, and might only be able to house a betta. She doesn't like bettas. I tried to convince her that, if she really wants a small tank with orange fish, it might be better to get a 5 gallon with a pair of plattys. I explained the whole "organs keep growing," and "high urate output," thing, but she just wants her goldfish in a bowl. You know, "cuz it looks so pretty on TV." ARGH! The weird thing is, she spoiled her dog. She read everything she could, and she really did everything right for that dog. But the fish just doesn't matter. I'll admit that there are some species I can become more attached to than others, but I wouldn't knowingly make an animal suffer like that... well, except maybe a feeder. I'm sure my crickets aren't too happy with their cramped quarters. (But even they are well fed and their cage gets cleaned. And I don't claim that they're "pets.")

[into]

I blame a lot of it on miseducation and ut-ummm mismarketing. Frogs are marketed as a child's pet and some literature even states that frogs are easy to care for and maintain, but I don't know if this is entirely true given my experience so far. They are certianly not as easy as say a hampster is or even a ferret. Years ago I kept pet birds that cost hundreds of dollars and they required more emotional attention but very little maintenance and environmental care. Temperature, humidity, chemicals... none of this was really a concern, unless one got outside in the winter or snuck under the sink and chewed through a bottle of bleach.

I got into frogs when my son received a planet frog habitat ( http://www.amazon.com/Uncle-Milton-I.../dp/B000062VU0) for Christmas and this thing is now in the trash as I can't imagine putting any frog into this little tiny plastic container. I did initially because I didn't know any better.

I feel that pet store employees need to go through training programs before working out on the floor.

[Ebony]

Me too, I got into Frogs when my Son got Tadpoles for Christmas 5 years ago. There's no way he would have been able to take proper care of the tank let alone the food. It takes alot of time and effort running around catching bugs.

As for pet stores, I cant even go there. I went to one last spring that had about 20 Adult Male/Female Bell frogs in one tank and they were all mating and eggs were every where (on the Land) They only had a NZ ice cream container of water. I went in a week later and the person said that alot died .Frogs in Nz are a bit of a novelty and you don't see them very offen.
Peaple just don't care. Oh! and you dont want me to tell you about The spraying in our local Reserve that I frequent that had loads of Whistling Tree frogs and Skinks as I always heard them. Now I here nothing...Heart breaking.
GEE SORRY... But very therapeutic though.

[Kurt]

I feel that pet store employees need to go through training programs before working out on the floor.

That would be nice. Unfortunately, the ones that actually do this, still don't educate enough.

[John]

The majority of pet store jobs are low wage and the majority of pet store owners aren't graced with the conscience to override their desire to maximise profits.

[into]

yeah and low wage means little to no real training/education. I remember those days right after high school... I worked in a sporting goods store and kept getting calls from people asking about hunting equiptment. Many callers were frustrated that I couldn't help them, so I asked my manager for reference/training materials and he just gave me a funny look and kept walking. (this was before the internet boom)

[adawinters]

I honestly do feel bad, though, for the pet store clerks who DO know what they're doing. So many of us automatically assume the worst of them, and so they must spring back and forth from refusing to sell the goldfish to the girl who wants to keep it in a cup, to getting lectured by someone who assumes they're ignorant and uncaring. Then again, it is rare enough to find people who really know their stuff working in petstores.

I'd honestly like to know how much of the mismanagement of animal husbandry in chains is fostered/mandated by corporate policy (i.e. HQ says we can't open the UV light for the suchandsuch lizard as it eats away profits.) Now and then, I get the nagging suspicion that a clerk/store manager is doing the best s/he can... within the confines of a bigger, inhibitive system. (Maybe I'm just paranoid or jaded. Am I the only one who thinks this way?)

[Kurt]

I used to work in the pet industry and compared to what I know now to what I knew then, I was an ignorant little bugger. Still I was the most knowledgeable person in the store. I knew more than the store owner. (This was when Ronald Reagan was President and before the big chain stores came to town.)

So you are right, there are meaningful employees out there, but unfortunately they are in the minority, and a lot of those meaningful employees have very limited knowledge.

I use to see applicants that would state that a relative had a fish tank, so that made them qualified for a job with us. Sure it does. I have also seen employees make s**t up as they go. Or stores that would make up new names for different animal species. That made life harder for the rest of us. My old boss used to label many types of fish as "sharks" so they would sell better.

Then in the early 90's I worked at the crème de la crème of aquarium stores. We got paid more than your average pet store employee, but we also had to know a lot more than your average pet store employee. The store owner is an ichthyologist and had kept exotic animals for years. I used to hear stores of the old days and be blown away by what they used to have before the laws had changed. Can you say big cats? They are still pretty interesting and knowledgeable and carry interesting stuff. The owner told me recently that he plans to expand into reptiles.

[JeffX]

From my personal experience it all depends on where you go. I know some people who will stay away from Petco/Petsmart and the chain stores because they feel that they don't know as much. That is part of the truth. I've heard some really ignorant advice from local or independent pet stores. I had spoken to a lady who was told to take her Chinese Water Dragon outside for for it's vitamin d3. I live in Iowa and frankly this suggestion is rather absurd especially when winter comes around.

Also when I worked at Petco I can tell you I had people that worked in my departments and the managers who didn't know a thing about most of our animals. The training was focused on product placement and shelving. I was their head guy in Aquatics/Reptiles before I was given their training. I had maybe five little paragraphs on animal care. Luckily I already knew what I was doing and had enough sense to study at home. The way they setup their displays are all done through a corparate offie and they have no desire to do what the animal needs. I had twenty or more Ball Pythons stuffed into a ten gallon tank because they wouldn't bother to see what your on hands were and would just send you 15 or more. You couldn't keep them in the back either. They ALL had to be out on the floor.

[adawinters]

Yeah. I worked at a corporately owned vet's office for a while, and we had to HIDE frontline and heartguard when the corporate babysitter came around. Thing was, they wouldn't let us order more if X packages were on the shelves, even if we told them that it was in high demand, and we knew for a fact that it would sell out from the appointments later in the week alone. Strange stuff. You'd think, in that case, they'd listen, since it would mean more profit to turn over more product more frequently, but they were only concerned with the day to day.

I spent the first 17 years of my life living in New York City with petstores close to my apartment that kept horrible conditions. (When most of the staff has never seen a tree-covered hill, let alone a frog in its natural habitat, you know you're in for a treat.)Then I spent the next decade in a small town with a petstore that, for the most part, cared and researched and made an effort, (although I will say that, if you want a pet mouse in the hudson valley, be advised that ALL mice you'll find are former lab animals or their offspring; learned that one the hard way).

Now I'm somewhere in between. I've spotted the places that seem to care, but I've also been exposed to chains for the first time ever, (I'd always avoided them, how's that for bias) and have flashed back a little to my previous city experiences.

Last chain I was in, there was a really sweet old man, telling me how friendly and active the tomato frogs, but he had no idea what he was talking about. Said they'd max out at 2 inches. (I just didn't have the heart to correct him. He really liked them, and he was nice, and I was only passing through. I had errands to run.)

[Kurt]

I would've corrected him. Of course, I can be a total ******* at times! LOL

[Madeve]

My local petsmart has horrible pet husbandry except for their birds and rodents. Most fish tanks have dead fish, they keep their fire-belly toads in a completely aquatic setup with only a few floating plants. I saw this beautiful Uromastix once and he was kept in one of the smallest tanks they have (10 gal I think). They don't have many exotic pets, they usually have a couple turtles or tortoise and a few small grass lizards(not sure exactly what they are but that's what they are labeled as), every now and then they have something really unusual, like the uromastix. I've never ever seen any newts or salamander available.

My local Petco is amazing. The have knowledgable employees and I have yet to see a dead fish. Save for their crested geckos, their reptiles are kept in pretty good conditions, tank size and housing is appropriate and they even separate some animals if they have a size difference. They even told me they could order me some newts if I really wanted some but I have a better place to get my newts from.
The same 4 crested geckos have been there since the store opened earlier this year, I've been tempted many time when they go on sale to grab all 4 but then I'm afraid they will just get more in and they'll not sell and grow too big for their enclosure.

We used to have 2 local pet stores, one closed after hurricane Rita, about 3 years ago, it had pretty bad conditions. Their fish section was decent but the few rodents they kept were over crowded and inbreeding.
The other used to be the place to go to get exotic pets, they could order you anything you wanted. When I started my quest for an axolotl they knew a breeder in TX but their price was a bit out of my range. They always had snakes, frogs and a few lizards or gecko on display. Unfortunately after the last hurricane season, they relocated to a smaller shop where they only sell a few supplies, mostly for dogs and cats, and have a dog grooming salon.

So I have to shop the big corporate chain stores for supplies or order online and with shipping prices sometimes, I'd rather make the short drive.

[Kurt]

They don't have many exotic pets, they usually have a few small grass lizards(not sure exactly what they are but that's what they are labeled as)

Takydromus sexlineatus, an Asian Lacertid or true lizard. They are all wild caught and rarely do well in captivity.

[into]

My local Petco is amazing. The have knowledgable employees and I have yet to see a dead fish...

The original complaint on this thread was against a local Petsmart, but they do have the one of the cleanest pet stores around. The local Petco on the other hand is not so good (there's where I purchased all my frogs) They are understaffed and as stated earilier, they keep getting more WTFs in whether they need them of not... so I wasn't concerned about buying one that was in need and them taking that as a demand for them and ordering more.

There is another Petsmart in my area and their store is beautiful and the the WTFs are in at least in a 30 gallon tank and only a couple are in there at a time... so I guess the blame goes to the individual store managers? since there are good and bad Petcos and Petsmarts around.