African Dwarf Frog questions! Please help!

[Deku]

Hello. As I used to have african CLAWED frogs years ago. Now Iam wanting to get into african DWARF frogs. Yes, I still have my toads(they're taught to hand feed--all of em--) and they are doing great. My parents made our basement into a space for fishtanks and terrariums. Currently my tanks are down there, but my friend gave me a 29g recently as a gift. My parents let me accept it, and now they let me set it up in my room. But since we want to avoid dirt in my room(due to the rugs). Id like to start an aquarium. I was thinking of having a little bit of everything. Id like to get your opinions guys. Would african DWARF frogs be happy in this tank? Iam planning on getting 6-7 of em. Those arent the only inhabitants. Iam thinking of getting 2 snails(apple), 5-6small shrimps(cherry shrimps preferably), and 7-9small 1inch schooling fish. I was thinking id go for either mosquito fish(gambusia), guppies, mountain clouds, or some other type of minnow. And no not all together. Just this:
A small group of frogs
A pair of snails
A small group of shrimp
A small group of fish.

I have the filters to back it up. :P I got my fluval 305 cleaned up and all. I have this fluval heater, that measures the EXACT water temperature and distributes it accordingly. If it gets a degree above the water temp in my room, the heater either goes in low power or doesnt heat. :P You get it? Iam planing on using fake plants, black tahitan moon sand, and some live plants and maybe an ornament or two. The black sand is my favorite and I already have it either way(he gave it to me). I have a hood already, but it has a uv light(not a super bright one), but it distributes enough uvb to keep a turtle happy(old turtle light-long story). I have airiators ment for like 100gallons. I have extra filters in case one of em screws up.

My question is, will this set up work? Frogs, fish, snails and shrimp?

As for foods, what foods should I feed ADF? I have frozen foods(brine shrimp, bloodworms, clam). I have reptomin meant for aquatic turtles and frogs. Would this be good? its fortified in calcium and vitamins. Later on Iam thinking of buying frozen daphnia, frozen krill and frozen mysis shrimp.

Please help. Iam trying to get educated on em.

[Geoff]

My question is, will this set up work? Frogs, fish, snails and shrimp?

The answer to your question is: probably. The fact is that there can never be a blueprint that guarantees success and if you're mixing different animals in the same tank there is always the potential for unforseen problems and complications. For example, competition for food.

As for foods, what foods should I feed ADF? I have frozen foods(brine shrimp, bloodworms, clam). I have reptomin meant for aquatic turtles and frogs. Would this be good? its fortified in calcium and vitamins. Later on Iam thinking of buying frozen daphnia, frozen krill and frozen mysis shrimp.

Please help. Iam trying to get educated on em.

Frozen brine shrimp and bloodworms are fine in my experience and I've bred them when those two frozen foods have formed their staple diet. I cannot comment on the other frozen foods you've mentioned as I've never used them. Live foods like tubifex, Daphnia and white mosquito larvae are the ideal. Not only are they more nutritious but the frogs' hunting behaviour, which is sometimes cat-like, is very engaging to observe.

Hymenochirus frogs are very under-rated in my opinion and often regarded as smaller versions of Xenopus but their behaviour is much more complex and all the more interesting for that. Their behaviour is largely affected by the conditions under which they are kept and a dedicated tank is best to observe it fully.

[Deku]

The answer to your question is: probably. The fact is that there can never be a blueprint that guarantees success and if you're mixing different animals in the same tank there is always the potential for unforseen problems and complications. For example, competition for food.



Frozen brine shrimp and bloodworms are fine in my experience and I've bred them when those two frozen foods have formed their staple diet. I cannot comment on the other frozen foods you've mentioned as I've never used them. Live foods like tubifex, Daphnia and white mosquito larvae are the ideal. Not only are they more nutritious but the frogs' hunting behaviour, which is sometimes cat-like, is very engaging to observe.

Hymenochirus frogs are very under-rated in my opinion and often regarded as smaller versions of Xenopus but their behaviour is much more complex and all the more interesting for that. Their behaviour is largely affected by the conditions under which they are kept and a dedicated tank is best to observe it fully.

Hmm thanks. Ived been thinking about what id do with the tank. I like having single species tank, but I wanted a community tank of some sort. I was thinking of like a group of frogs, a group of cherry shrimps, one betta, and a group of black or white colored guppies(the betta will attack any bright colored fish, esp. reds, blues, and yellows---in my experience that is) and maybe one or two otto cats(for clean up). Ived seen people put in their dwarfs with bettas and they do superb because the bettas do not eat much thus do not pose any competition for the frogs. The shrimps are scavengers and are not soo fast that will pose a competition for foods. The otto cats mainly eat algea and left overs(they are nocturnal). I found some sites that said I should feed hbh pellets and I think it was zoo meds pellet??? Iam thinking of feeding pellets meant for newts. Or maybe ill go to xenopus express and buy their pellets but in baby pellets. :P I do plan on feeding frozen foods. but i dont want to feed it "Daily". I dont know if I can culture daphnea(water fleas), brine shrimp(sea monkeys---may not be a problem), blood worms(how the heck would I even do that???). I could also offer them live earth worms(chopped). Could I feed by tongs?

[Geoff]

There's little I can add to my last post. If you want a communtity tank with frogs in it and you feel reasonably confident that it'll work then try it but I've never kept the frogs with such diverse tank mates.

You say that the shrimps are scavengers and the cats eat left overs. The frogs are bottom feeders so the question that arises in my mind is how you can ensure everything gets enough to eat even if you try using tongs. Also, getting the portion of food right without running the risk of polluting the water could be a problem.

When I mentioned live food I wasn't thinking in terms of you culturing them but buying them from a tropical fish store. However, if you're interested in going down that route you probably know that this site's sister site has forums devoted to live food culture at: Advanced Newt & Salamander Topics - Food: Live, Frozen, Freeze-Dried, Pellets, etc at Caudata.org Newt and Salamander Portal

[Jenste]

with african DWARF frogs, I really prefer having them as the only bottom dweller - - giving how hard it is to feed them anyways - it gets exponentially harder in a community tank...and even harder in a community tank with other bottom dwellers.

I would keep the adf as your only bottom dweller and stock lightly with fish - -make a large shoal of one type of tetra for appearances

that is just my opinion - i feel this may be the best solution for all the tankmates involved

[Tony]

with african DWARF frogs, I really prefer having them as the only bottom dweller - - giving how hard it is to feed them anyways - it gets exponentially harder in a community tank...and even harder in a community tank with other bottom dwellers.

I completely agree with this. Although I no longer keep them I have in the past both in community and single species tanks. Feeding was always a problem in the community tank, even though none of the fish were bottom dwellers they had no trouble making a trip down to snatch up the frog food.

[Jenste]

don't forget the dechlorinator

[1buscemi]

...i know the pet store sells these small dechlorinating shells, they're small and white, and they just sit on the tank floor. is this what you are referring to?

[Jenste]

not at all...its a liquid.

ask any employee - they will know what dechlorinator is.

You can also pick up Stress coat to help them out since they are a bit under the weather. But definitely get some dechlorinator

[1buscemi]

oh boy am I glad I met you..lol...I would have gotten the wrong things for them, or I probably would have let them be...

[Deku]

oh boy am I glad I met you..lol...I would have gotten the wrong things for them, or I probably would have let them be...

You do realise that its one african dwarf frog per 2.5 gallons? So you NEED to upgrade that tank to atleast a 5gallon. Here is a good site for your questions. I have another one. But this fellow member made it simple to understand.
http://thefrogfarm.yolasite.com/adf-faq.php

search through here.

[Jenste]

No worries. You seem like you have the heart of a great frog owner! When you get back start a new post just for your frogs so we can track their progress in their own little thread

(pictures would be helpful too so we can see if there are any signs of disease starting)

[Jenste]

1buscemi - - any update on your adfs?

[1buscemi]

hey, I am having trouble finding a heater for plastic tanks.

[Jenste]

That falls in line with you really needing to upgrade. A 5 gallon glass tank is all you would need. But as it is winter you desperately need to get those frogs in warmer water if you want them to have any chance at all of surviving

[FrogFarm]

Okay, first thing is first, the set up you have in mind with snails, shrimp, frogs, and multiple fish could work. However, the snails aren't the best idea for a number of reasons. If they are small enough for the frogs to eat them they can kill/hurt the frogs who don't know any better. If they are too large the frog can get a limb caught inside them, this happened to one of Jenstes' ACF (Louie) and she got lucky with it but it could have been much worse. Fish are great, but if the fish are too small, the frogs might eat them. This isn't good for the ADFs as many fish have enzymes in them that are harmful to the frogs. The shrimp they barely notice for the most part, but won't harm the frogs even if eaten. So if you want a small schooling fish that won't get gobbled, maybe go for full-grown guppies (too big for an ADF to eat) or something of that sort.

The betta would probably work (instead of the school fish, of course) as they normally do well with ADF. I have a male betta in with my adult ADF and they're quite interactive with each other but not in a bad way. However, the betta did hunt down the shrimp and eat them.

As for food, frozen blood worms/brine shrimp are the way to go in my opinion. Much easier than feeding live (unless you want to farm your own feed) and just as nutritional. I like the fact that the betta and frogs are on pretty much the same diet, too. It makes feeding time alot easier.

Other bottom feeders, as someone mentioned, aren't the best tank-mates for ADF as there can be food competition. BUT if you choose to go with an algae-eater of some sort you don't have to worry about this as they aren't interested in the frogs' food and vise-versa.

Anyways sorry for going on and on, I just thought I would give my thoughts on the matter.


Deku, I agree with you on the 2 gallon tank matter, buscemi1 definately needs an upgrade but I think he/she knows this now.

[Deku]

Okay, first thing is first, the set up you have in mind with snails, shrimp, frogs, and multiple fish could work. However, the snails aren't the best idea for a number of reasons. If they are small enough for the frogs to eat them they can kill/hurt the frogs who don't know any better. If they are too large the frog can get a limb caught inside them, this happened to one of Jenstes' ACF (Louie) and she got lucky with it but it could have been much worse. Fish are great, but if the fish are too small, the frogs might eat them. This isn't good for the ADFs as many fish have enzymes in them that are harmful to the frogs. The shrimp they barely notice for the most part, but won't harm the frogs even if eaten. So if you want a small schooling fish that won't get gobbled, maybe go for full-grown guppies (too big for an ADF to eat) or something of that sort.

The betta would probably work (instead of the school fish, of course) as they normally do well with ADF. I have a male betta in with my adult ADF and they're quite interactive with each other but not in a bad way. However, the betta did hunt down the shrimp and eat them.

As for food, frozen blood worms/brine shrimp are the way to go in my opinion. Much easier than feeding live (unless you want to farm your own feed) and just as nutritional. I like the fact that the betta and frogs are on pretty much the same diet, too. It makes feeding time alot easier.

Other bottom feeders, as someone mentioned, aren't the best tank-mates for ADF as there can be food competition. BUT if you choose to go with an algae-eater of some sort you don't have to worry about this as they aren't interested in the frogs' food and vise-versa.

Anyways sorry for going on and on, I just thought I would give my thoughts on the matter.


Deku, I agree with you on the 2 gallon tank matter, buscemi1 definately needs an upgrade but I think he/she knows this now.

Lol'd I didn't read the whole thread. Cause someone else posted a ton of questions on my thread. I have low attention span so I only read the first few questions the made, and a few replies. But I didn't see anyone reply to them about the tank size. Obviously that tank is too small. I personally think he/she should have a 12gallon or so and get 5frogs. Because adf are kinda community frogs. They always do better in groups. I remember seeing htem where I used to work at. the one that was alone, just sat there the whole day. While there was a 40breeder with like 20frogs or so. They were constantly active. I remember the guy said he wasnt in with the other frogs because he was brought in as a return. So he didn't want to take a chance.

[FrogFarm]

Oh yes you're definitely right about that!

[Deku]

Oh yes you're definitely right about that!

I decided a while ago that I may set up a tank just for african dwarf frogs, and like 20small fish like danios. I like danios. And this tank would be a 40breeder. Lol id get like 13frogs or so. and 20small danios and 10shrimps. lol

[FrogFarm]

That sounds good to me.

However, I would go with a larger species (like Giant Danios) as you don't want your frogs eating them. They have a lot of trouble digesting full-grown fish.

Other than that it sounds good to me.