First post

[tadpole]

Hi all, i have a now 16 year old african bullfrog i got at at herp show. its the lone survivor of a number of frogs(budgett's and horned) i had mostly in the 1990's. that's a testament to it's hardiness.

i may be getting frog fever again. i am thinking about setting up a 30 gal tank with half a dozen albino clawed frogs. they are beautiful as adults, completely aquatic, and extremely easy to maintain, and just like a tank of fish, very relaxing to watch.

i might get back into horned frogs again, but i learned the space/maintenance requirements for these requires a greenhouse, no way around it. aquariums are simply the wrong way to house these larger frogs. ideally, my next house will have a greenhouse addition i can simply open a door and walk into.

i used read all the mags, but the internet has blown that source of info into the past. i look forward to conversing with an experienced group of hobbyists to get correct info and culture tips, and maybe share what i can remember from my past mistakes.

[Ebony]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

A green house sounds really cool. I dont know about or keep Horned frogs.I guess you would have to watch that it doesn't get too hot. I have an outside froggery.

[Kurt]

Welcome aboard.

[John911]

Why a greenhouse? Just curious cause we have one.

[John]

Welcome to the forum . These guys have been documented to live 20 years or more, but you rarely hear about it. Well done!

[tadpole]

hi john, a greenhouse becomes a necessity as these guys require fairly large pens with very good drainage so they can be hosed down daily. frogs need a very, very clean environment. you simply cannot keep them for very long in glass tanks, unless you don't mind spending hours upon hours of tank cleaning. if i lived in florida, i still wouldn't put them outside without the protection of a greenhouse, due to raccoons, etc.

[tadpole]

i am going to keep this blog going, if for no other reason than to keep track for myself what i am doing with frogs. kind of an online notebook.

i went to the mars herp show in balt md, sept 18 and brought back 2 budgetts, 1 ornata, and 2 albino acf's.

the wierdest thing, i went to show my 16 yo pixie to a new neighbor the next day, and it was missing out of the enclosure! i was speechless as it sunk in the frog was actually gone. i have marauding raccoons which come every night, they are at the top of the suspect list. those dam things can break into everything. i thought my frog was safe as i have used the same set-up for years with no problem. the real weird part is this was on the 16th anniversary of when i got her, at one of the first mars balt. shows. it's a shame, she was doing excellent. (this forum prompted me to take a few pictures of her, otherwise i'd have nothing. you can click on "my albums" to see her.) so if you keep your frogs outside, they really need to be locked up tight.

anyway, these budgetts seem to have doubled their size since then, they almost seem to be adults. i forgot how fast they grow! here are some photos of the newbies:

[Jace]

So sorry to hear about your Pyxie!! I would be devestated if I lost one of my three. I hope you're doing okay.

Thanks for sharing your pictures of the new additions. I hope to one day have a Budgett's frog myself so I really enjoy seeing other members and hearing their stories.

[tadpole]

wow i didn't think anyone else would ever see this thread again. there must be some feature i don't know about that shows all the new posts regardless of how deeply buried they are.

anyway, thanks jo-ann. i do feel sorry for the frog, and have only my own stupidity to blame. it seems a frog will live until murphy shows up. i posted earlier about what happened to my first bunch of budgetts. (they froze to death on the 4th of july.) well, these lessons certainly leave an indelible impression. you just cannot leave anything to chance.

for instance, this AM i collected a half dozen nice big fat black crickets on my walk, fully intending to gorge the budgetts on them. i wanted to try giving them live food as i had justed discussed with another budgetts owner here on the forum.( i normally feed raw beef, but have read negative things about that as a food item, regardless of the fact my pyxie had done well with beef as a staple for all those years) he said he fed yard crickets, and his frog is 14 yo.as i walked along, it occurred to me crickets feed on animal feces as a staple. then i thought what parasites they must pick up from that disgusting habit. then i found myself releasing those crickets back into the brush. why take that chance?. i'll stick with the beef for now, although fish might be a better choice.

anyway, the budgetts are growing like crazy right now, i don't think a little fat makes a difference at this stage. perhaps when they are sedentary adults they can go on a lower fat diet. and perhaps people are prone to overfeed their frogs and that is the problem. i know i let the pyxie go a week or two between meals, and that may be why she was doing so well. it's all a grand experiment for now anyway. someday we'll have everything figured out. or not....

[Jace]

I also give my Pyxies a rest period. Not being active, I don't feel they need to eat as much. They are all doing well and eat when food is offered and molt as necessary, so why mess with a good thing?

Do you not buy crickets? I have honestly never heard of feeding beef. I loved your pics-they definitely looked like happy frogs!! I have yet to come across a Budgett's for sale where I am, but when I do, I will snatch it up in a heartbeat!!

[tadpole]

every frog/salamander i ever had ate stew beef (do remove obvious fat veins), even fire belly toads. in their case, i would use chopped earthworms as a fuse. the toads would gather round the food bowl and feast on the wiggling worms mixed with bits of beef, eating the beef as well. ambystomid salamanders go crazy over a plate of raw beef, as do box turtles. its so rich, you have to be careful of over feeding. i can just take a look and see if the animal is too fat and know when to reduce the meal frequency.

in your pyxies case, simply offer a chunk on the end of a forceps, and blam, down it goes. use very smooth rounded tip as sometimes the animal will bite the instrument. with a little care, you can point it away from the animal and reduce the chances of this.

crickets are a huge mess compared to the convenience of going to the freezer for frog food, although i used to buy 1000/ a month from fluker farms for years when i had my tarantulas and scorpions. i even raised them when my firebelly toads spawned and had dozens upon dozens of frogletts to feed. i had 7 tanks staggered a week apart with cricket eggs so i would have a continuous supply of pinheads.

i would advise anyone who entertains the thought of breeding their frogs to realize it is a very bad idea. they will be saddled for life with frogs they can't even give away(in the firebelly toad case) and can't release in the wild. i didn't breed mine on purpose, it just happened. its best just to siphon away the eggs with the water changes. besides, there is a crustacean they eat in the wild that gives them the red color, which captive bred will not develop, even if you gut load pinheads with color food.

[Malachi]

i might get back into horned frogs again, but i learned the space/maintenance requirements for these requires a greenhouse, no way around it. aquariums are simply the wrong way to house these larger frogs. ideally, my next house will have a greenhouse addition i can simply open a door and walk into.

Why do they need a greenhouse?

[tadpole]

greenhouses are ideal for large frogs. for me is it's the only practical way to maintain them. i would say a 2'x2' enclosure is a minimum for an 11" frog. filled with sphagnum and a wire mesh bottom, rinsing the substrate becomes a breeze and the waste water could water plants growing under the bench. a dozen or so could be easily maintained in a .6'x12' greenhouse, protected from the weather and raccoons/cats.imo, owning frogs should be a joy, not a drudge of tank cleaning chores.sooner or later that will lead to neglect causing the animals to suffer.

[tadpole]

got around to setting up my acf tank last week.( i forgot how much i hate doing water changes!) here's the pix, also some of some baby snappers i've had for past 6 weeks. they actually bask at this age. so far so good. the java fern will eventually fill the tank. the tank sits in a passthru, so you get to see it from both sides. thanks goes to petco for the tank sale.

[tadpole]

update on frog activity with photos.

budgetts have grown to almost adult size. i still have them in tupperware! it's the fastest to clean with daily water changes. they are maintained on a diet of stew beef and raw chicken livers. i have cut back their feeding to once a week. i forgot how beautiful they become as adults.

ornata seems to be progressing ok, same feed as budgetts.

acf's eat every day, frozen worms and a serving of chicken liver or stew beef once or twice a week.

the 2 snappers are still feeding well also, but there are some concerns about them since i am playing it by ear with them. my goal is to have them able to be released in spring, with a head start in size and health.

that's raja, one of my many rescues and fav cool kat. he's a burmese, when he came to me he was on the street and suffering a month old puncture wound to his eye. i had to have it removed that very day.

[tadpole]

a video of budgett frogs in the wild, tadpoles to adult.
the adult frog is quite large so my 2 have a ways to go. i like the habitat photos, shows you what to shoot for if you keep these.
YouTube - Budgett's frog eats Mueller's narrow-mouthed frog

[tadpole]

frog update, group photo, snapping turtles ready for release, individual frogs, my cat squeaker and a red pigeon. i have some concerns about the ornata's size, he/she seems small, maybe i need to feed it more.