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Thread: Frog Forests

  1. #1
    100+ Post Member Larry Wardog's Avatar
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    Default Frog Forests

    I am working on a project that will display two very different enclosures focused on two different needs for the specific animals. The direction I am moving next is centered about creating a biome. The first (or second reveal if you have been following my "Woods" build) is the construction of two Forest vivariums.

    I have put a lot of thought into this decision and I believe it is very necessary with what the other two enclosures will offer to have these two enclosures compliment one another, and to both be the design of a forest.

    These are polar opposite enclosures and animals that are from different continents. I am anticipating these to be the least problematic enclosures as well.

    So let's introduce the animals that will be in the next series "Frog Forests"




    The group I will first introduce is a group that has been around since I have gotten back into the hobby a while ago. They have appeared in many videos and photos and are a familiar face to everyone who has read my updates in the past. They were a part of a specific group once called the Five Lined Dumpy Family. I am going to disband the grouping of this and will be including the Dumpy Family (White's Tree Frogs) as members of the forest biome. White's Tree Frogs are a great pet and they are native to Indonesia and Australia. These frogs are an incredible and calm pet. The Dumpy Family has been very typical with no real problems and are very fun to feed and work with. They have a build coming up soon. I will be upgrading them from the Exo Terra 24x18x36 to the largest 36x18x36. It's only a foot but I think they need the length. This will be around 100 gallons for the three tree frogs. Max is the only female and will be the animal from this enclosure that we focus on the most. She is the biggest and she is the leader of the Dumpy Family. Max will be an important part of the forest. She will display the importance of protecting the environment because she uses it to survive. She is the same color as the leaves high in the forests. Without them she wouldn't be able to have stealth and their species would be in trouble. The Dumpy Family is going to be a familiar face and will be a very interesting addition to the forests.

    The other forest enclosure is from another familiar face. Wellsboro the "Golden Toad" will be getting an Exo Terra 36x18x24. He will be the ambassador for the temperate forest of North America. Wellsboro is going to be the leader of his enclosure which will have most likely two or three toads. We could have the Dumpy Family and some nickname for a toad family, but it might take some time to figure it out. The toads will be a reminder of protecting the environment. Toads are the color of the forest floor and need to have soil to hide, dig, hunt and hibernate in. If we pollute or deforest many areas then these among other animals would be without a home. Wellsboro will be a very different leader then Max. He is not interested in company like the semi social tree frogs. He has lived alone and appears to be a very good predator who might outcompete other toads to the point of starvation. He and his toad sociological warfare will be another high point while showcasing life from inside the Frog Forests.

    Two enclosures

    White's Tree Frogs (Max, Spurgeon, Jeremiah)
    Fin (Male Betta Fish)

    American Toads (Wellsboro, Unnamed Toad)

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    100+ Post Member Animallover3541's Avatar
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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    This sounds really cool! Especially the temperate forest one; I've been wanting to make one myself. I'm curious though, how do you plan to simulate a temperate forest in a vivarium? Are you planning on finding plants similar to those found here in North America, or are you going to try and find native plants that can survive in a vivarium year-round?

    Can't wait to see how this turns out. I think everyone likes a good viv build...
    "If having a soul means being able to feel love and loyalty and gratitude, then animals are better off than a lot of humans."
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    100+ Post Member Larry Wardog's Avatar
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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    Quote Originally Posted by Animallover3541 View Post
    This sounds really cool! Especially the temperate forest one; I've been wanting to make one myself. I'm curious though, how do you plan to simulate a temperate forest in a vivarium? Are you planning on finding plants similar to those found here in North America, or are you going to try and find native plants that can survive in a vivarium year-round?

    Can't wait to see how this turns out. I think everyone likes a good viv build...
    The other enclosure that I will have in the same room needs to be temperature controlled because of many different variables. I am planning on doing a captive breeding and potentially releasing offspring back into the wild so I'm going the extra mile to make sure I have accurate weather and climate conditions to where the animals are from. So the temperate forest for this project is going to also have the benefit of at least experiencing the same conditions with temperature and humidity fluctuations.

    I used to work for a plant nursery for almost 10 years so I know of plants that exist in the specific zone that my toads are from. I have a few projects on the forum already talking about some of the native plants. They are more difficult than some would think but they are worth it if given a shot and if they are given the right conditions.

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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    Here is the first video from Frog Forests

    https://youtu.be/dnWzMvLgrRs

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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    Some good news for the animals in the Frog Forests...

    I got the results back and Wellsboro was negative for any parasites! This is the first time I have owned him that he is clean. It's been a long battle for him and he seems to have won. With him being clean I am going to begin preparing him for hibernation soon. Because of unforseen circumstances that I will talk about in my other thread, now Wellsboro will be first to hibernate. This is to insure that he is far away and out of the grasp of the parasite as I begin to finally eradicate it. The next video will talk about him and his battle for survival to now getting to be the first to hibernate and then to in the spring get his first home prepared for him. He's earned everything so I'm happy for him.

    The Dumpy Family is doing well. They will still be in the video coming next. Everyone is doing well here and they are living life as usual. The Dumpy Family will be the first to move into a new home this winter. I'm hoping around Christmas to be able to build the home. Probably sometime around January. After the enclosure is done and moved into place I will let it settle for a little bit. During that time Max, Spurgeon and Jeremiah will all be dewormed and thoroughly examined to be sure the parasite is eradicated from the Dumpy Family. So as Wellsboro sleeps and then the Dumpy Family is isolated away from the parasite I will be hoping to finish it off on working on the last enclosure. That is another story.

    If you couldn't tell by now the next episode will feature the battle with parasites. This has been almost the death of all the frogs and toads and it still is alive and attacking them now. I have a strategy to defeat it that is very unorthodox. Hibernation of the native animals and quarantine and movement of the exotic animals. The battle for Wellsboro and the Dumpy Family will be highlighted. The sad news is the war still continues, buy there is a hope to finally win and move on to the next chapter in the lives of the animals and especially those who live in the Frog Forests.

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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    New video coming tomorrow and I'm about to give some details...


    So the new video is coming tomorrow morning and there is something that is going to shake up the rest of the PA Woods Community. Before it comes out I'm exclusively sharing with the forums more in depth of an explanation then the video. So because I found the parasite still living in everyone basically of the Gray Army, they are going to have to vacate their place in the other series called The Woods. This was going to be a 125 gallon home for them along with living side by side my toads. This didn't work out and now they will have to live in their own setup. I also factored in looking at the 125 gallon and it was more so made for a terrestrial species. So I'll give the Gray Army their setup now. Basically Wellsboro and the Unnamed Toad are going to switch the Gray Army with homes. The toads will all live together and the Gray Army will be together. I am not going to spoil every surprise about the situation though. there are a lot more surprises whenever it comes to the toads and their home.

    To give one of the most important details about this whole video and this whole post the main thing I want to get across is now the Dumpy Family and the Gray Army will be in the same series and they will be making up the Frog Forests.

    The video will feature all three groups meaning the toads, the gray tree frogs, and the whites. You will get an opportunity to hear more about what I was just commenting on but I also want to get everybody excited because it will be the first-ever series featuring only tree frogs. So if you are a huge tree frog lover this is going to be your series!

    I just wanted to give a small update and give a little bit more detail on the video and also about the future for these three groups of animals

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    100+ Post Member Larry Wardog's Avatar
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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    Checkout the video discussing the parasite and more on the future of the Frog Forests

    https://youtu.be/tIcka7E33TQ

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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    Frog Forests has become an all tree frog story...

    Finally for tree frog lovers of all kinds there will be a story highlighting these awesome animals and the unique abilities they have. Already we have looked at the animals being featured in this story as well as a look at the battle with parasites. It's been hard finding something to really talk about next because the Gray Army is fighting the parasites right now and there is not much going on. I am very excited that sometime soon when the native frogs and toads sleep for hibernation the Dumpy Family will get dewormed and be given their new home.

    They will be heavily featured during the move and it's going to be a lot of fun showing their build. The Gray Army will be getting some allies in their home who will not hibernate so their tank will be active all year also. This will be a very exciting build taking place after the Dumpy Family get their setup. So over this winter we will be seeing something very unique with all the tree frogs getting final homes, dewormed and we will explore more into their lives.

    I'm not giving away who the allies are for the Gray Army, but it will make the enclosure more interesting and the fact that it will be active all year will make the Frog Forests more enjoyable. I have some great first encounters for the tree frogs and new feeders.

    Currently I have been working on a way to display the Gray Army more and to show what they have been up to. I think the next video will feature more on the maintenance of owning a captive frog and the next part about the parasites. I hope you are as excited as I am to see more of the tree frogs from the Frog Forests.

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    100+ Post Member Larry Wardog's Avatar
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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    We have some Very Good and Very Bad News...

    This week was supposed to be an update video and an update post discussing the care for the Gray Army and Dumpy Family, but that did not happen. Instead of that we had a serious event that has completely changed the PA Woods Community.

    As you know if you've followed my posts about all of my frogs and toads is that they all have a nematode parasite that has continued to attack them for some around 2 years and for others over a year. The medication the dewormer is very strong and can harm a frog just as much as help.

    Bane and Melania both have the parasite. Bane was positive and Melania showed physical signs of having it with a decrease in weight and refusal to eat for over a month. So with them living with the other tree frogs it was in their best interest to be treated. Sadly this didn't help everyone.

    Bane looks to have bounced back from the parasites and newly named tree frogs Dante and Meredith also bounced back. They all look great and may be very healthy right now. Melania yesterday began eating again and looks to rebound. However I have some very very bad news.

    Christian did not make it and he is the first animal to lose the battle to the parasite. This was a devastating reminder as to what time of year is coming and how this parasite is still here. Christian was one of my original tree frogs rescued from a home that was bleached and taken down (he lived by a suburban swimming pool.)

    It's devastating because here was a tree frog who looked so beautiful and I had initially thought was on his way to being worm free. There were high hopes for Christian. He was going to be a huge part of showcasing the Frog Forests. Christian was an ambassador to all Gray tree frogs. His personality and attitude were unique. He was always the little guy being smaller then Bane (gray caught with him.)

    The goal was to hibernate Christian and to allow more little baby Christians to run around having his genes and making some very impressive offspring. This dream will die with him. He was a part of so much and was always a bright spot for me as his keeper. He will be deeply missed and those of us who know him are mourning his loss from the parasites too. Even though he was quarantined we tried to make the best of it for him and he was just singing about 2-3 weeks ago. This is a huge blow as one of the most dynamic personalities is lost.

    While the mourning continues there is a job to be done with the remaining 4 gray tree frogs. Maybe we couldn't save Christian but he will be the reminder of what we are fighting for and why we fight hard. Nobody else should pass on as everyone even the toads are doing well. It's going to be difficult having to plan every month a fecal test for multiple animals, but we are going to do 3-4 tests and then try to hibernate the Gray Army and Toads. When we know they at least appear to be clean we will as I said before treat the Dumpy Family and Skink Dynasty. We will fight all winter while the native frogs sleep. Hopefully we can destroy this parasite and at least rid the exotics of it.

    The next goal will be to chase this parasite like trying to run someone down in a marathon. We will be methodical, patient, but still aggressive. Regardless of the timeframe we know we are still fighting and now we have Christian to dedicate the fight to. Even though he lost his battle we know the war is not over. Now is the time to launch a severe strike to the nematodes. It's hard battling something you can't see and hoping to win. But with having faith and believing in these frogs and toads there is a desire and an urgent motivation to push back and fight harder.

    I'm sorry to the PA Woods Community for this loss and it's a deep blow losing such an important frog. He was truly loved and cherished and he will not be forgotten by me. I have a feeling I let him down, myself, and the PA Woods Community. It's been a very difficult time with this. I will give even more of an effort from here on out.

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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    https://www.researchgate.net/figure/..._fig1_10781663

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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    Just another update on the status of the Frogs in the Frog Forests...

    It's been an exciting week to be the caretaker of these frogs! They continue to give me wonderful moments to record them and to observe them. I am pleased to see everyone's doing fairly well as of tonight. There may be some concerns on the horizon though.

    Let's start with the Dumpy Family. They look like they might have a problem because they look a little more pink underneath then usual. They are eating like pigs so no reason to worry about loss of appetite. The good thing is the Dumpy Family is going to the vets Wednesday to be examined and we will get to the bottom of this. They will have a stool sample go out and they will soon be getting a bigger new home (Exo Terra XL 36x18x36 or 100 Gallon.) When the results come back from the vets office I will make sure to update you on their status. I am willing to make any change necessary to fix the problem.

    The Gray Army loosely looks good. Meredith is on top and she knows it. Melania is coming for the spot though. Melania actually has eaten the most out of any tree frog from either enclosure. She needs to she is still thin but putting good weight on now. Bane is still slowly recovering from his deworming so he's not as active but I'm monitoring him in case anything looks odd. Dante eats some and calls daily so he's been doing good. Overall the Gray Army looks to be good with a slight watch over Bane.
    The baby Copes Gray Tree Frog who has recently been introduced is also doing great and I have no complaint with that frog either. So 5 frogs from the Gray Army technically are great.

    The concern is with their ally Florence the male squirrel tree frog. He is in a different setup and just seems to be a lot more slower then usual. It could be the weather changing and I've also simulated a dry season inside the tank but he just seems like something is odd so I'm not too sure yet what my options are just because I'm not sure what I'm going to be doing with the Dumpy Family after the vet. If I have to quarantine them then I would not want to have another quarantine tank if I don't have to for Florence at the time. if things start to take a turn for the worse then I will definitely get him fixed up as soon as possible in a quarantine setup, but right now there's a lot of different things that could be the reason why he's a lot slower and when I say a lot slower he's just sleeping more which is most likely because of the weather, but I'm just concerned because he's not eating as much. Florence is supposed to go in with the Gray Army at least that is the goal, so there's not really a lot of danger for the animals of the Frog Forests there is just a bit of concern with some of the smaller details surrounding them.

    There are many amazing things still to come with this storyline of tree frogs so keep checking in for updates as I tried to update the status of these animals weekly if I can.

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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    Some great news for the Tree Frogs of the Frog Forests...

    While the Dumpy Family is being quarantined and the Gray Army looks to rebound from their last go with the parasites we have a lot to cover. There is going to be a shocker at the end of this thread that will hopefully be interesting to you and doesn't effect the health of these frogs in any way.


    So as we left off a while ago the Dumpy Family is doing well and they get their medicine tomorrow for the supposed final round of dewormer. They haven't been happy in quarantine protocol, but who is? I have been working to put solid weight on them as of the past two months. The Dumpy Family is doing well and have been eating regularly many times a week. I think we will have a video coming out that these guys will be featured in. We are going to have to wait to get fecal samples and get the results back sometime hopefully in January. The new build for the Dumpy Family is set to start in March.

    As for the Gray Army they have gained the most weight that any animals have over a short period of time. Melania the tree frog who we thought would die now weighs the most and is the key figure of the Gray Army. She is truly an amazing animal. Along with her success comes a surprise. Meredith is still heavy and in great shape. I said before it's very hard to have animals in the same tank that are dominant, but gray tree frogs seem to be able to make it work. Both Melania and Meredith are on top. It's very interesting to watch but they snuggle up under the light together, and they do not seem to try to starve one another. I think with an even larger enclosure they will be even more personable. So Bane may get more active. He has slowed down I believe because he is unhappy and he looks like he misses the 125 gallon he once live Inside. Bane will hopefully get his new home (the 67 gallon exo terra) and once the parasites are gone he can enjoy his life back in a bioactive enclosure. But for now we all wait. The Gray Army all has gained immense weight since being dewormed.
    Dante is 12g
    Bane is 20g
    Meredith is 25g
    Melania is 26g

    This weight for the three out of four is really good. 20g is a good weight for a gray tree frog. Dante is much smaller then everyone else and he is younger, so if he can get to 15 it would be great. In one month Melania gained 6g which is very impressive.

    As we close this update with patience, optimism, and weight gain we also have one more announcement.

    After meeting with my crew and my team we have decided how we are going to tell the stories of these animals lives. As I am working with and focusing on the Pennsylvania woodlands and forests we thought it would be best to group animals together that were native, and to group the non-native animals together for many reasons. The Dumpy Family will retain the story of the Frog Forests. The Gray Army has plans being the featured group of a different story. I have said the squirrel tree frog and baby Cope's were going to join this storyline and they still are. These two frogs are not going to live with the Gray Army. The Frog Forests will gain a southern setup called the Pine Barrens Frog Forest. Along with the Dumpy Family they will be the featured frogs of the story. But frogs will not be the only animals starring in this story. The Skinks who will be gaining the 125 gallon that will live in a Pine Barrens biome will also join the story. So we will be featuring forests and even a specific forest the Pine Barrens in this storyline. So once the building begins we will close this thread out and will focus on this new storyline focusing on the exotic animals. The Gray Army will hopefully be hibernating for me so they will be unable to star in their storyline. I do not want to ruin the plans for them because they will be a part of something very special and important to the brand.

    I will post again with the status of the members of the Frog Forests and their weights. Good news to follow.

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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    New video featuring the Gray Army and possibly a video featuring The Dumpy Family coming...

    I set up my camera, I got the bugs, and I handed them to the gray tree frogs! I am happy to say I recorded a feeding video of the Gray Army. I will show myself feeding them waxmoths and black soldier flies. It would be really cool to plan a feeding video where all of the insects are released at once and the tree frogs chase them down, but I don't think it can happen in quarantine. It just appears to be too difficult. With that being said I can use this time to practice on getting close ups and working on my skills with the camera. That's exactly what I did. So you can expect possibly the most clear shots of the gray tree frogs! I caught Bane and Dante hanging out for a little bit and I got Melania all green climbing at the top of the tank with the lid off.

    The best thing for the Gray Army is that they may soon get to hibernate for this winter. While they sleep it will give me time to get the musical tanks situation started. The Gray Army is one of two groups I need to sleep to begin this process of moving and building tanks. The Gray Army is going to hopefully wake up to a well done Exo Terra Terrarium built specifically for them. I really can't wait to showcase them in their upcoming home. These little frogs are going to bring some great content to the channel and on here with hopefully great picture and clips of them in their environment. All of this sounds great, but first they I believe need to pass the next fecal exam in order to accomplish this. Until then I'm building their weight so they can store their fat for the hibernation process. I'm not actually sure if anyone has a weight standard for these frogs, but I'm trying to get Melania and Meredith (females) to 30g which is one FAT gray tree frog, but it may be normal for a wild one to gain weight like this before hibernation. As for the males Dante and Bane I will have to think about it. I think Bane weighing 21-25g would be great because males don't need as much weight because they are smaller. Dante being much younger I am unsure for him because he's a small frog to begin with. I will run this past my professor at school and the exotic vet who sees the Gray Army.

    A blessing could be they all get through the fecal exam and I can begin this process for them.

    A little bit about what they will be grouped with in the upcoming storyline for the PA Woods Community. If you didn't know I am preparing a room for native animals, and I have a hallway next to the native species room for the exotic animals. The Gray Army is actually not going to be grouped with either so to speak. The toads will make their cameos in the story time from time, but actually I am preparing the third part. Outside I am building an artificial vernal pool, but this pool isn't even associated with the Gray Army. I am actually preparing to build a small greenhouse next to the vernal pool. No the Gray Army will not be living in this because it's way too hot for one. But the next group of creatures will.

    I will be keeping Eastern Mason Bees inside the greenhouse! Not only will they pollinate the trees and plants around the neighborhood, but some of the males I will use as a feeder for the Gray Army. These are not just any ordinary feeder because I respect them enough to build them a greenhouse and I will be hibernating the cocoons in the refrigerator over the winter as well! These bees will be documented in their habitat on plants and in the greenhouse. Only a handful will be given up because they are so valuable and they have a large task of caretaking for the trees and the neighborhood! The Mason Bees are a really docile species and the males do not have a stinger. They are solitary but will live in wood holes next to each other. They only live around 2 months as bees, so once their season is done in the fall I will collect the cocoons (bee larvae) and store them in the refrigerator until the next spring. While the Gray Army will be joined by the Eastern Mason Bees this is not the entire group for this storyline. I also do not think I'll have everything to go for the bees this spring, but we will see. I am actually preparing for them and I started a year ago researching for them. As I was saying the Gray Army and Mason Bees will not be alone, but now you know that this storyline goes beyond the glass walls of a terrarium.

    The next update will feature more of the Dumpy Family!

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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    To checkout the new story for the Dumpy Family checkout this link

    https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/top...ink_source=app

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    Default Re: Frog Forests

    Hey guys! Checkout the Gray tree frogs new storyline and thread in the link below
    https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/top...ink_source=app

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