Pyxicephalus Differences

[John]

The frog in Jeff's picture is more like what I know as edulis. Terry, do you have any of Carruthers or Passmore's books to hand? I know the book they wrote together in the late 90s has both species pictured extensively.

[tgampper]

The frog in Jeff's picture is more like what I know as edulis. Terry, do you have any of Carruthers or Passmore's books to hand? I know the book they wrote together in the late 90s has both species pictured extensively.

Hi John,

I have several books by Carruthers and Passmore as well as Mark-Oliver Roedel and Margaret Stewart. I have posted some description information on P. edulis on the Edulis? thread. Interestingly enough, it was Stewart that alerted me about the several other species of Pyxicephalus that are now assigned to Tomopterna.

[onedge30]

Hey Terry,

Sorry about asking you for this book page. I forgot that it is from Buck Rogers.


I don't know the book this came from, but these pictures are what I am leaning toward as adspersus and edulis.



This picture was sent by a field research professor from South Africa. She worked on a study of Pyxicephalus. This is her study photo for P. edulis. This picture is from the Timbavati area near Kruger National Park, South Africa.

I have sent her some of the images that we are calling edulis. I am waiting for a response.

[onedge30]

With the email from South Africa. The researcher sent these descriptions.

Adult P. adspersus
Mass: 90 g to 1.2 kg (some say up to 1.4 kg)
SVL: 90 mm to 230 mm (some say up to 250 mm)
Colouration: light green or brown-green or dark green
Other:
Banding above mouth is absent or feint.
White spot on tympanum is absent or small.
White stripe down spine is absent or thin and feint.

Adult P. edulis
Mass: Guestimate: up to 400 g?
SVL: Guestimate: up to 150 mm?
Colouration: yellow-green or brown
Other:
Banding above mouth is prominent.
White spot on tympanum is prominent.
White stripe down spine is prominent.

[Kevin1]

I'm anxious to hear what she says about our "Edulis". They're clearly very different from those pictures. Those pictures look like specimens I used to call the Tanzanian subspecies of Adspersus.

Thats a handsome Adspersus in that book by the way.

Thanks for posting.

[tgampper]

With the email from South Africa. The researcher sent these descriptions.

Adult P. adspersus
Mass: 90 g to 1.2 kg (some say up to 1.4 kg)
SVL: 90 mm to 230 mm (some say up to 250 mm)
Colouration: light green or brown-green or dark green
Other:
Banding above mouth is absent or feint.
White spot on tympanum is absent or small.
White stripe down spine is absent or thin and feint.

Adult P. edulis
Mass: Guestimate: up to 400 g?
SVL: Guestimate: up to 150 mm?
Colouration: yellow-green or brown
Other:
Banding above mouth is prominent.
White spot on tympanum is prominent.
White stripe down spine is prominent.

I have the book that Darryn (Buck) sent you in your last post. It's called The First Field Guide to Frogs of Southern Africa, by Vincent Carruthers. He also wrote a companion guide called Frogs and Frogging in Southern Africa (includes CD). They are both available from Amazon.com. I recommend both of these books if you have an interest in African frogs. The researcher's description matches the books. I'll be compiling all the information for the guide soon. Thanks

[John]

This bears out what I suspected, and that is that we rarely see edulis for sale. Therefore, what are we seeing for sale really?

And related to this, is this frog Pyxicephalus edulis? The photo is from my African Bullfrog article:


It seems likely to me that it is.

[tgampper]

Jeff,

Do we have permission to use her photo on post #45? If so, that would be perfect.

John,

The photo you just posted is P. edulis. I was confused at first with the coloration and markings and thought it would fit perfectly in the genus Tomopterna, but the spot in the tympanum identified it as P. edulis. Also, the other features like the bars on the upper jaw, the distance between the eye and the tympanum and also the faint interorbital or interocular bar. We could use that photo also.

I would say that the individuals in both pictures are females, am I right?

[tgampper]

This bears out what I suspected, and that is that we rarely see edulis for sale. Therefore, what are we seeing for sale really?

IMHO, I think many importers/sellers of frogs and toads are just taking the word of their supplier and not really finding out for themselves what species they do have. Popular names seem to be a problem. If you notice the excerpts from the book that Darryn supplied a few posts earlier - Carruthers list P. edulis as African Bullfrog. In most other places, the African Bullfrog is P. adspersus. So when some suppliers list P. edulis as African Bullfrog, technically they are not wrong. We as buyers need to be more aware. That's why I thought putting together a Pyxie guide would be most helpful.

Also, many frogs and toads have been assigned new genera or even families. This no doubt leads to confusion. I noticed that some ads list frogs using old names or synonyms, for the example we had earlier, Pyxicephalus delandi, actually in reality it's Pyxicephalus delalandei, now Tomopterna cryptotis. Sand frogs in the genus Tomopterna are also known as "pyxies".

I think we are probably getting more P. edulis but being sold as P. adspersus (which may not be misleading either, since some scientists do not make the distinction between edulis and adspersus). In fact, I kinda like edulis, they are smaller and more colorful. (Please excuse my ramblings )