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  1. #1

    Default Re: I think my ornate is dieing :(

    Thanks for your reply, I feel a bit better about my decision. It has heart breaking seeing him so lethargic and puffed up. He is in a better place now.

    Now I am trying to figure out if I did something to cause this or is it genetic?

    Is it possible if you give too much calcium and vitamins it would cause this? He was eating Hikari Pack attack pellets which should have all the extra vitamins and calcium he needs, but I was also dusting his food as well.. I am wondering if I over did it and it caused this problem?? My other frogs never had this issue and the only thing I can think of different is I didnt do the pack attack pellets, just dust their food..

  2. #2
    100+ Post Member monster's Avatar
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    Default Re: I think my ornate is dieing :(

    I found this but couldn't find anything on Vitamins, hope this can help a bit.

    I'm going to copy this answer directly from my Amphibian Medicine and Captive Husbandry textbook by Kevin M Wright (regarded as one of the best books in amphibian medicine/research)

    "Horn frogs, Ceratophrys spp., are often noted to have subcutaneous edema with or without fluid reserve for this and other frogs, but often it is linked to a problem such as metabolic bone disease and concomitant hypocalcemia (presumably due to alteration of the lymph heart function), acute bacterial infection, renal failure, hepatic failure (low plasma protein), or exposure to water with low dissolved solutes (often suggested by low levels of plasma sodium and/or potassium and protein). Supportive care should include bathing the frog in electrolyte solutions such as amphibian ringer's solution along with treatment of the underlying etiology if known."

    I'm now editing because I went and got my horned frog book by Phillipe de Vosgoli because I could have swore I had seen something in it about edema and vitamins and I was right, here is what it says.
    Note that over supplementation of vitamin D3 is possible, it can lead to a certain type of MBD as well as cause edema, notably throat edema. All these problems are influenced by metabolism and can be exacerbated by not keeping frogs at the proper temperature range for activity and feeding. If you don't have the book its a great book and recommend it, this info is on page 26.

  3. #3

    Default Re: I think my ornate is dieing :(

    Quote Originally Posted by monster View Post
    I found this but couldn't find anything on Vitamins, hope this can help a bit.

    I'm going to copy this answer directly from my Amphibian Medicine and Captive Husbandry textbook by Kevin M Wright (regarded as one of the best books in amphibian medicine/research)

    "Horn frogs, Ceratophrys spp., are often noted to have subcutaneous edema with or without fluid reserve for this and other frogs, but often it is linked to a problem such as metabolic bone disease and concomitant hypocalcemia (presumably due to alteration of the lymph heart function), acute bacterial infection, renal failure, hepatic failure (low plasma protein), or exposure to water with low dissolved solutes (often suggested by low levels of plasma sodium and/or potassium and protein). Supportive care should include bathing the frog in electrolyte solutions such as amphibian ringer's solution along with treatment of the underlying etiology if known."

    I'm now editing because I went and got my horned frog book by Phillipe de Vosgoli because I could have swore I had seen something in it about edema and vitamins and I was right, here is what it says.
    Note that over supplementation of vitamin D3 is possible, it can lead to a certain type of MBD as well as cause edema, notably throat edema. All these problems are influenced by metabolism and can be exacerbated by not keeping frogs at the proper temperature range for activity and feeding. If you don't have the book its a great book and recommend it, this info is on page 26.
    Thanks for the information, its not a good feeling knowing that I may have caused this. Ill be sure to not dust as much if I am feeding these pellets.

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