Heat mats with horned frogs

[jasonm96]

I've seen so many people say that a heat mat will burn a Horned frog so I thought I'd just correct you...


Reasons why a heat mat could burn a frog:
- It's not being used with a thermostat. Heat mats must always be used with a thermostat, most heat mat instruction manuals actually state this but some don't. The reason for this is that most heat mats will reach temperatures of 100F when plugged directly in to wall. Unlike basking lamps or ceramic heat emitters, a heat mats wattage does not determine the heat produced, it's just more energy is needed to heat a larger area. The thermostats probe should be under the substrate in contact with the glass that's being heated, not above the substrate as this will not control the mat properly and it could overheat.


- The temperature of the mat is not being measured correctly. Next to the thermostat probe you should have a digital thermometer's probe as well, this will measure the true temperature of the floor, where the animal will be. Some people may use a gauge thermometer that sticks on to the side glass, this cannot measure the temperature of the mat and you will not get a correct reading; you could think you're tanks at around 70F because the air temperature is, where as the floor is actually well above that.


Possible problems a mat could cause:
-A heat mat used with a thick layer of substrate could overheat from thermal blocking although if the tank has a raised bottom or rubber feets are used this could prevent this. Do not place anything like a water dish on top of the mat!

-It's not natural for a burrowing frog for it to burrow closer to the heat source. Yes it is not natural, however neither is keeping it in a glass tank is it? The frog will still be able to thermal-regulate by moving away from the mat.

Conclusion: it is not heat mats that burn animals, any heat source could cause problems if it is not understood and installed correctly. If you do not like the idea of a heat mat, then use a heat lamp.

Jason

[Lija]

Have to apologize up front for not being patient here, but I probably telling that for 1K time now lol no, probably more then that....

heat mats are not for frogs! For multiple reasons, unless you attach it to the side you should never use to for burrowing frog with or without thermostat! Never!

[jasonm96]

Most frogs bred in the trade have probably been bred with the heat mat on the bottom. It's proven to work just fine, it's when people don't install them correctly problems can happen. Unless the room is particularly hot already a heat mat on the wall will be any use to the frog and innacurate temperatures are deadly. Heat mats are practical with frogs but not natural, so it depends on what way you look at it and if you want the natural way then simply don't use them and go for a heat lamp

[jasonm96]

Let me just state I'm actually not that big on heat mats but this was just to clear things up, I just hate when people say that they will burn a frog, they really won't it's just people that don't know what they're doing this will happen. I prefer to use the above heat source as it is more natural but I just won't say a heat mat shouldn't be used, as its proven to work... It's just the keepers choice at the end of the day

[Lija]

The only way you should look in relation to frog husbandry - how to create environment as natural as possible and how not to harm your frog or cause it unnessasary stress or illness. The best way of heating enclosure are infrared or centric heaters plugged into controllers.

[jasonm96]

It's hard to create the natural environment, especially in the small tanks recommended for these frogs. In that case it's probably better not using infra red bulbs as light can still be seen from animals but doesn't seem to bother them as much. A ceramic heat emitter is better as it emit absolutely no light. I've found a daylight heat lamp to work in conjunction with a wall mounted heat mat for night time (frog will be able to use it as its above substrate) all I'm saying is it will not burn a frog, this is a rumour and any burns would be due to bad husbandry.

[Shakudo]

Hello,

Interesting thread and thank you for posting.
I found it a good read.

However, if I might give a little tip? Personally, I would prefer choosing the words "informing people" rather than "correcting" them.


On topic,


Out of my own experience with these products I would like to add my view, it might be helpful.
I've been heating animals, f.e. snakes/lizards/turtles/tortoises by lamp and/or mat for more than 13 years now and in most burn situations the heating medium is not properly used according to safety measures.

However, there are exceptions, for instance using a heat rock with a ball python can severely burn them, because they can have the behavioral tendency to curl up around a heat source.

So, looking at the animal, it's behavior, it's needs and the proper safety precautions are guidelines which used properly can make husbandry very simple and successful.


- Most (quality) heat mats are secured in a way they cannot overheat the animal, most of the times this information comes with the product manual/specs.
The maximum temperature range they produce should be in there as well. They cannot go over that max output because they have an overload security and they'll fail and brake. However, if you want to be 100% sure you should use a thermostat not only for correct temperatures, but it adds another layer of security to the mat.

- In a manual, a thermostat is (sometimes) recommended for achieving a specific temperature, and maintain it. That doesn't mean you can't use it without a thermostat.
I've been using it with snakes for over 13 years and have never used a thermostat. I always make sure the animal can get away from the heat source and can thermoregulate.

- Heat mat yes/no with a frog? That has 2 sides, IMO.
I believe they dig down in the substrate in the leaf litter on the bottom of the rainforest floor for their protection, humidity needs, and thermoregulation.
You can use a heat mat, but that's a personal choice. I found it more Natural to use a daylight heat lamp during the day and the mat during the night. A good day and night rhythm, (photo period) is important to many animals.

I have a leopard gecko with a heat mat without a thermostat. My frog doesn't have one either, but will for the frog I will get one in the future.
My frog doesn't have the same needs/heat tolerance as my leopard gecko.
My leopard gecko, can withstand higher temperatures and my Russian Tortoise even higher so it also depends on the animal, then make an informed choice.

For my frog, I've been using a daylight heat lamp during the day, and a heat mat at night, both on a timer and that works for me, in my terrarium and in my house with the temperatures here. My frog has been eating, pooping and displaying normal typical horned frog behavior, and I feel it's going well. So that's something to be grateful for.

Conclusion, there are many factors involved. Try to keep an open mind and find out what works best for your animal and you.


Take care,

Joey