Problem with some squirrel Frogs.

[daydreaming]

what was the temp of the tank?

what was the humidity level?

are you sure that when you cleaned the tank all of the cleaning product was washed out as well?

was there any signs of stress? if they had been kept in the same container for 7 days maybe it was too much exposure for them.

otherwise there are still a few reasons why but maybe the frogs were just not as healthy as they had appeared to be.

also if the shop is dirty and unclean because he spends so much time looking after his animals what about cross contamination, dust. i do understand what you mean, but a less clean shop dosent always mean healthy animals.

[Iceni]

No the shop is very clean, It just looks like a mess! he stacks empty tanks in a corner, has limited storage space ect. But all of his animals are spot on. He doesn't normally stock frogs, But he does keep them at home. I think he keeps albino clawed, Firebellys, and a packman.



Temps could be an issue, I Keep my whites and these frogs on top of the fridge, The whites tank is normally between 21 and 26 degrees. But on the hotter days it has been up to 28 degrees.

The tanks is a sealed tank. with small vents in the top. It's actually a converted fish tank, with a black plastic canopy, The humidity levels upon them been added to the tank were very high, I gave the tank a full 1/2 litre of misting before the frogs were introduced, and they received more misting later that evening. There is enough humidity to cause full condensation in the tank when the evening temps drop.


As for the stress I'm thinking it could be a factor. It's hard to tell if a nocturnal animal is stressed in a shop as there normally sleeping in opening hours. I'm just wanting to be 100% sure I'm not doing anything grossly incorrect before I take this back to the shop.

[Kurt]

The tanks is a sealed tank. with small vents in the top. It's actually a converted fish tank, with a black plastic canopy, The humidity levels upon them been added to the tank were very high, I gave the tank a full 1/2 litre of misting before the frogs were introduced, and they received more misting later that evening. There is enough humidity to cause full condensation in the tank when the evening temps drop.

Treefrogs require good ventalation and this set-up does not appear to provide that. Also, you mentioned they had been kept in small containers that they had arrived in at the store. I assume we are talking about dehli cups, which also do not provide much ventalation. In my experience, treefrogs that are kept enclosures without proper ventalation have a tendency to wither away and die. This usually takes more than a week to happen.
I am guessing that stress, along with poor ventalation, and quite possibly an increased gastrointestinal parasite load due to the previously mentioned conditions, may have killed these frogs, but I can't say for sure. I would've had to observe them or examine them to be certain. Just FYI squirrel treefrogs, Hyla squirrela are wild caught, which would play into what I had just mentioned.

[John]

It's a tough one to guess what's going on here. Kurt may be right, and Daydreaming may be right too - both are equally likely. Another possibility is that they picked a disease at the pet store and you taking them home was the final nail in the coffin.

In any case, sorry for your loss - Squirrels are a nice little frog. I hope the last one makes it for you.

[Iceni]

Yeah that probably makes sense. I'll go in and have a word with the store owner and see if he can come up with a solution. chances are he will be able to have a word with the supplier and get the facts for me!

I'm almost certain these frogs haven't gotten a disease from the store, they were keps well away from the other frogs. The small container may well have been the problem tho, The first thing they did upon been relesed into the bigger tank was jump arround like looneys. They didn't seem to settle for about 45 minutes, i was fully expecting them to stay asleep and explore later.

[daydreaming]

also be aware that is your existing frogs have had any contact with the new frogs you may have a problem with your existing frogs esp if there was an underlined illness.

i would also say the vibrations from the fridge may not be such a good thing either they do normally prefer quiet areas. i keep my 3 wtf away from anything that invloves too much vibration. i know in the uk we have to dispose of fridges/freezers properly as they can give off chemicals and they do tend to be very hot where the pipes are.

[Kurt]

Dawn, you keep impressing me with your knowledge.

[Iceni]

The good news is we have ruled out any illness. The frogs are captive bred due to some laws in the uk that make it hard for wild caught frogs to be sold. I went into the shop and he admitted that upon arrival at his store 2 of the 8 he had ordered had died just like mine in 24 hours. There is apparently an illness that has been spreading that has caused a lot of problems and the shop i use actively endorses all measures to prevent the spread of this illness. He also will not trade in any animal that he suspects of been wild caught.

He has put it down to stress, and has gone so far as to place another of the same species, and replace the deceased. He also told me that it's nothing to do with the setup i was using just these frogs been skittish and susceptible the been stressed.

As for the fridge its a big heavy old kelvinator, As far as i have been able to tell it is almost silent and gives of no vibration i can feel when the compressor is on. I'll keep an eye on the 1 remaining STF to see if it stop eating. I fed him a minute ago after getting in from work late at night and he seemed active and feeding.

I've also placed an order for a pair of wire tops for the tanks to improve ventilation, there going to take a few weeks to arrive so in the meantime i will dremmel the tops of the existing lids and use some fruit netting we have for the raspberries! It should provide an imediate solution to the ventilation concerns that were raised

If i think the fridge is stressing the animals i will make provisions to have them moved to a quieter part of the house, I already have space upstairs but i like the see the frogs on a morning in the early morning sun! Makes me all happy to see the dumpys cute little face peering at me making the coffee!