Need some serious help whites tree frog (pics)

[elura]

First off I'm not here to listen to people tell me I'm a bad frog parent. I know something is wrong and want to do what's best by my babies. Thanks.

I have this problem where my one whites is constantly prolapsing. Typically two-three days after feeding. They are kept with two others. They all get along great.
The humidity is right where it should be.
The temps are great too.
Their enclosure is below.
They eat small ( like baby baby sized) crickets
They are dusted with a vitamin mix for tree frogs.
I have been caring for whites tree frogs for almost two years and by no means an expert. But I try my hardest and I know there are lots of strong ideas on who should and shouldn't own pets out there. I'm looking for help.
Some theories in my house are:
My frog isn't actually a whites for some reason.
This is just normal ( I doubt this is the case)
Something is wrong.
Suggestions would be great.
The light is off for the night in the big tank with over night heaters. And you can just see my med tank to the left




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[DigitalPunk]

Couple things I would do while we wait for the experts to show up and help offer suggestions.

1. I would move him/her out of the communal tank and into a small QT/Hospital type setup. Damp paper towel for substrate, water bowl and maybe a plant clipping.

2. wait for the experts. I have a few suggestions, but I am not the guy you look for when you need advice on caring for a sick frog. I will see if I can find another Mod to jump in here and help out though.


We never Aim to call people bad Frog parents. We are only here to help and offer advice. It's up to you to take the advice (and sometimes loving criticism) and do something positive with it

Paul

[elura]

Thank you for your kind words. Criticism I can handle. I've just had people flat out tell me to just kill my frogs because I was doing that bad of a job and cant afford emergency medical care.
I moved them into the med tank in the picture I didn't put any sticks or anything just a water bowl and the damp cloth.

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[Heatheranne]

Hello Elura,

I will try and help.

We can worry about how to improve things later. Let's just worry about how to save this little one right now.

Prolapses are most often caused by constipation/impaction, intestinal infection, or parasites. Too large of food can lead to constipation. Dehydration can also be a factor. Infections can be caused by a number of things.

The easiest thing to do at this time is to sprinkle graduated sugar right onto the prolapse. You can also do a sugar water soak. Dechlorinated water or spring water, lukewarm and add the sugar to it. Soak his butt in the water for about 15 minutes. Keep the water shallow. This prolapse is severe. I would actually do the soak and sprinkle a little over it too. Just a light sprinkle is all you need. Adding more doesn't help more. Focus only on the prolapse when sprinkling.

The sugar will help to draw water out of the prolapse and shrink it. When a prolapse occurs the intestines can swell and lose circulation.

The next best answer is to get him to a vet asap if possible. A knowledgeable herp (amphibian) vet can reduce the prolapse and gently add a suture to help close the prolapsed opening some to prevent reoccurrence.

If the frog lives, his poop should also be tested for eggs and parasites. If it is positive, depending on the infectious agent, he may need Metronidizole, Panacur, or Ivermectin prescribed only by a vet and by the weight of the frog.

You will also want to rehydrate the frog if the prolapsed cloaca goes back in. If this happens. Give a second soak of lukewarm dechlorinated water or spring water for another 15 minutes.

I hope this works for you. It's a bad one.

Good luck!

Will you keep us posted?

[elura]

Hello! Your advice is wonderful and something I have actually done with great success before! I was wondering if you had any theories on why this happens so frequently. If not I totally get that. I feed my gals/guys (I really need to get them sexed &#128518 these very tiny crickets. The problem child refuses to eat soft things like worms. One last question would be if you zoom in on the images I posted there is a grainy black and white substance in there. Could that be infection? I use frog dirt that comes in those compact bricks, and I push it down enough so they wouldn't randomly eat it. Ugh. But again that you for your help. I have a stool sample. And already since I've posted this the prolapse is already shrunk by half.


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[Heatheranne]

It is very possible that he is investing substrate when he eats of the crickets roam free. He's the only one that prolapses?

You could try bowl feeding?

Once a prolapse occurs it puts him at risk for another. They often need a little suture.

How's your humidity in the tank?

[elura]

He's he only one in my tank having this problem. They normally free feed. But since this has started up again ( I say again because I inherited this frog from a friend who also always had this problem, then it stopped for a while. And here we are again) I can try bowl feeding. I have been hand feeding with mixed success. Do you know of any online sources that help you locate a good herp vet? I'm from a small town and highly doubt that they will be able to help (they specialize in horses mostly around here)


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[elura]

The humidity currently is at 75ish (-+2) so after an hour of bugging out on my end he has solved the prolapse on his own and is enjoying a warm soak. I will keep posting as answers keep arise. Thank you for all you're help.


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[Heatheranne]

Great job!

[elura]

On a happier note these are my boys when we are all healthy and happy. Thought the share would be a good positive here


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[Heatheranne]

You're welcome. Let him rest tonight. Avoid any food. You'll need to let the swelling come down.

I'll check back tomorrow.

Frank once showed me a list of vets. I will look for it for you.

[Heatheranne]

75% is fine for humidity. White's should be 50-70% or so. It doesn't sound like a humidity issue.

[Heatheranne]

How is your frog today?

[irThumper]

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I've dealt with a prolapsing frog before. In fact I lost him to it (had to make the decision to put him down)

You say this frog is a constant prolapser? How old is this frog and is it a male or a female? (Look for a brownish/greyish colored throat and thumb pads) Thumb pads pic:
Photo 63 of 185 from White's Tree Frogs by irThumper

I recently has an issue with one of my females, who I believe might have been gravid (with eggs), dump a bunch of whitish looking things in a bloody jelly-- those whitish things look a lot like what is in your frog's tissues. I'm wondering if the things could possibly be ova and your frog is egg bound.... A fecal test on the matter from my frog proved to be inconclusive and negative for parasites. This definitely needs more research, and I highly highly recommend a veterinarian at this point.

Good luck and keep us updated!

[elura]

I honestly don't know how old she is. I feel like this frog is a she. I am currently away from home for school, so I can't confirm that..today they were bright eyed and the prolapse was back to normal.i picked her up and she was climbing all over the place, and seemed alright. Is there anything I can try at home to loosen up the ova (if that's what it is?)


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[Lija]

You don't need to do anything about the eggs.

what you need to do is:
- do a fecal test, if positive, treat accordingly
- food - is s/he eating from tongs or hands? If not you need to try to teach him how to. Meanwhile stay away from crickets, try something softer, like hornworms. How he is pooping? How the poop looks like?

that is pretty advanced prolapse and if this is reoccurring and after threading for parasites ( most likely the test is going to be positive) you will need to find a vet comfortable fixing this surgically.

[Heatheranne]

I was thinking that as well. Likely needs parasite treatment and a stitch.

[Heatheranne]

If she does have parasites, you will want to treat her tank mates as well and clean out their home.