Sick ATF frog? Help!

[karikatzi]

So our little froggy friend changes from dark green to kermit green pretty frequently, especially when he's hunting crickets or generally excited. But I've noticed him doing this strange mottled thing a couple of times now. The first time it happened (Wednesday) I cleaned out their tank really really well and then he went back to his normal color changing.

Yesterday I was so ill with a tummy bug I wasn't able to get out of bed all day and so didn't get a chance to check on him or mist them at all Then this morning he looks like this again.



The little yellow spots are new too. The other frog is perfectly fine, but should I separate them?

Also I just got a heater for the tank (arrived today haven't installed it yet) as it's been getting cold at night. Could that be it?

[irThumper]

Wow.... I've had my Whites Tree Frog, Jelly Bean, transition from brown to green and be in between, and he naturally has little spots, but I've heard lemon-lime spots like on your frog can be a sign of some sort of infection. Read this post, copy and paste the question list here, answer as many as you can, and I'm sure more folks will show up to help soon! Wish I could be more help http://www.frogforum.net/tree-frogs/30850-trouble-enclosure.html

[Mentat]

As weather season transitions it's very important to ensure our enclosures meet the frog's parameter requirements. WTFs should have a basking spot that reaches 85F and myself would keep night temps no lower than 75F. Even if they can tolerate lower night temps; IMO, large fluctuations are harder on them frogs. Also, it takes longer to bring a large White's enclosure to day temps if night went very low. More information on their care in here: Frog Forum - White's Tree Frog Care - Litoria caerulea.

[irThumper]

I've read some other posts with similar situations, and it could be anything from the frog being dehydrated, to too cold, to a fungal infection. I'd get this guy into a quarantine tank with plain white DAMP paper towels on the bottom, a soaking dish and maybe a few fake leaves to hide under. You can also give him a bath of dechlorinated water mixed with 10% pedialyte (unflavored/no color) and have him soak in that for 20 minutes or so. Here is a care sheet for these frogs- hope it helps as far as heat and humidity recommendations go http://www.frogforum.net/care-sheet-...atives-re.html

[karikatzi]

QUESTIONS

1. What 'kind' of frog is it (what species)
American Green Treefrog

2. Current photo of the frog

Attachment 75730 This is Hopkins (male)

3. Photo of the frog's current enclosure

I just added a moss mat (Wed) but it has the Atlanta garden soil mix stuff underneath for the live plants. I didn't wash it too thoroughly before putting it in, could that be it?

4. Size of enclosure ( W" x D" x H" )
12"x12"x18"

5. Number of inhabitants (if there is another frog, is there a size difference?)
2 frogs in enclosure, male & female, yes female is a little larger

6. Has or was the frog kept with a different species or with any other tank mate
Just Beryl, the female ATF

7. Is there a new tank mate, was the new tank mate quarantined
No new tank mates

8. what is the typical humidity level
I try to keep it over 60% manually but it dips below that frequently as it's cold out and the heat keeps kicking on

9. what temperature is maintained
again it's not been too consistent but it gets down to 65 at night sometimes. I try to keep it at or above 68 though. Right now it's 73

10. What is, specifically, being used to maintain the temperature of the enclosure
Nothing yet, but just got in the mail an 8x8" under tank heater (exoterra Heatwave Rainforest - small)

11. Describe the enclosure lighting ( very specifically)
Attachment 75732 + Attachment 75733
on a timer set for 10 hours a day

12. Describe enclosure maintenance (water changes, cleaning etc)
I rinse out the soaking bowl every day in hot water and dry with a paper towel. Then refill with bottled distilled water
Every 7-12 days I take out all the rocks & ghost wood put into a bath of just boiled water and then let dry. The ghost wood I dry in the oven on a low heat.
I clean the walls of the tank with hot water and then dry with paper towel, then heavily mist with distilled water
I just took out the

13. What kind of water is used for misting & soaking dish? Is de-chlorinator used/what brand
Bottled distilled water, no de-cholinator

14. Material(s) used for substrate - be very specific
2 1/2" of clay balls, with a few pretty rocks at the front.
Then a grid with felt on top, then the Atlanta Garden soil mix,
then the new moss matt >>>

15. Enclosure set up: plants (live or artificial), wood, bark, background materials
Live plants: snake plant, pothos & not sure? Cork background. Ghostwood climbing branch

16. when is the last time the frog ate?
Wednesday evening, about to feed them again when I'm done writing this epic tome

17. Have you found poop lately?
On Wednesday, don't see any in there now

18. How often is the frog fed?
Every other day (would have fed them last night but was too sick with a tummy bug to get out of bed)

19. What size feeder is given
Small sized crickets, around 5 each. Dusted with Flukers calcium & vit D AND Rep-Cal multivits

20. What other feeders are used as treats
None

21. what is the frog's main food source
Crickets

22. Do feeders roam free in the enclosure or is the frog bowl fed
Both, Hopkins prefers the bowl, Beryl likes to hunt

23. Vitamins - what brand and how often
Rep-Cal herptivite multivitamin, every other feeding

24. Calcium - what brand and how often
Flukers calcium & vit D, nearly every feeding

25. Was the frog without calcium for any period of time
Yes when I forst got them they had been without vitamins, calcium or a light for a year. Also had been eating just dried meal worms and Beryl was impacted

26. Approximate age of the frog
2 years?

27. How long have you owned the frog
3 months

28. Who cared for the frog before you
A friend

29. Is the frog wild caught or captive bred
Wild caught. My friend's husband found the 2 frogs in the middle of a baking hot parking lot at work, nowhere near any tress or vegetation so rescued them. He told her about the frogs and she decided to keep them and went to town buying a tank and set up. She kept them for a year, they were handled by her kids and fed a lot of meal-worms.

30. How often the frog is handled, are gloves used (what kind of gloves)
The frogs have been handled out of necessity twice since I've had them, no gloves but I wash my hands in hot hot water and dry them, then spray down with distilled water first

31. Is the enclosure kept in a high or low traffic area
Low traffic, front sunny room

30. Has or was the frog properly quarantined (yes or no), for how long?
I've not quarantined him yet

32. Has the frog been treated with any medication: for what, medication, duration, dose, was medication prescribed by a herp vet?
No

[karikatzi]

Read this post, copy and paste the question list here, answer as many as you can http://www.frogforum.net/tree-frogs/...enclosure.html

Thanks I did it. It sounds like an advert for Exo Terra! Hee hee

[karikatzi]

As weather season transitions it's very important to ensure our enclosures meet the frog's parameter requirements. WTFs should have a basking spot that reaches 85F and myself would keep night temps no lower than 75F. Even if they can tolerate lower night temps; IMO, large fluctuations are harder on them frogs. Also, it takes longer to bring a large White's enclosure to day temps if night went very low. More information on their care in here: Frog Forum - White's Tree Frog Care - Litoria caerulea.

Thank you, these are American Green Treefrogs though not whites. I think they're a little more hardy right? Either way I hope the undertank heater will help

[elly]

I can see why there was a mistake though. That picture really looks a lot more like a White's than an ATF. But since you found it in the wild it's an ATF. As a note sometimes heaters have trouble heating through all the substrate. It might work a little better on the side or back, or so I've heard. The frogs are hardy and can tolerate low temperatures, but would probably do best at about 75-80. Sadly I don't know what your frog has. I do know that fungal infections of the skin can sometimes be treated with Melafix, but a more knowledgeable person should tell you whether you should try that and how to do it.

[karikatzi]

Well the heater is installed and both are eating. Hopkins is happily jumping chasing crickets around his bowl and his skin has evened out again, so maybe it was the cold? Fingers crossed, I'll keep a close eye on him

[karikatzi]

I can see why there was a mistake though. That picture really looks a lot more like a White's than an ATF.

Hee hee you callin' my frog fat!

[elly]

Ha! I just meant I couldn't see the stripe behind the eye and the ATF's I usually see are more of a lime green. The frog is a little chubbier than the ones I see in the wild too.

[irThumper]

I think the mix up was because I mentioned something about Jelly Bean, my WTFs, color changes and Carlos read that, lol

I'm thinking perhaps it's the cold too, but I don't know about those little lime green dots... AGTFs don't usually have those, far as I know, and sometimes that can be a sign of fungus like Elly said.

12. Describe enclosure maintenance (water changes, cleaning etc)
I rinse out the soaking bowl every day in hot water and dry with a paper towel. Then refill with bottled distilled water

Distilled water should only be used to mist the tank to bring the humidity up but not used for the soaking dish. Distilled water can leach electrolytes out of the frogs skin Best to use bottled spring water and add a water conditioner like ZooMed Reptisafe... this removes dangerous ingredients like chlorine, chloramine & ammonia and adds electrolytes and stimulates a frog's natural slime coat, which protects it's skin. So try changing to treated spring water and up the temp and see if your froggle improves. Hope he does!