sHEila Prolapsed Again :(

[irThumper]

I just heard a strange noise so went into the frog room to check on them. I saw a normally formed big frog poo in sHEila and Jelly Bean's tank and then I found sHEila under the leaf hide with a small (at the moment) prolapse I got the sugar slurry out of the fridge (kept a syringe prepared of it just in case) warmed it up some but it was still a little cool when I dripped it on him... that made him kick at the prolapse though and act all distressed, so I'm worried that's going to make it worse. I then put dry sugar right on it and he kicked that off too... I'm going to keep him in his own tank at the moment because last time I moved him he really wigged out and I want to keep him quiet and unstressed as possible. Jelly is still in there but he just shed and is being quiet. I took out the main plant and pot, just leaving the leaf to hide under, and I took out the small pond with the rough edges... I have the small Kritter Keeper prepped and ready to go if I have to move him. Will go check on him and reapply the sugar slurry or dry sugar in half an hour if I need to. The paper towels are very moist so his membranes won't dry out. *Sigh*....

[irThumper]

Actually Jelly Bean is STILL shedding! He's been trying to shed over the last few days. Think the drop in general humidity might be the cause, but I've been spraying them 3-4 times a day until bedtime, so don't know there. He seems normal otherwise, but he's just next to the water dish at the moment, sitting in the wet paper towels and doing the shedding thing. Poor sHEila knows the guys next door got fed, even though i have a barrier between the two tanks so they can't see in. I hope this freakin prolapse rights itself as easily as the first time... it didn't look as bad as last time, but he keeps messing with it. If he'd just calm down and stop kicking it it would help. Last time I put organic extra virgin coconut oil on the tissue as well, might have to do that again this time too. It did help lube the prolapse so it withdrew easier...

[irThumper]

Just sprinkled some more dry sugar on it (1:35 AM) no change yet. Don't think I can stay awake much longer, was up at 5:45 AM yesterday and have had next to no sleep... exhausted and feel sick to my stomach Have to hope and pray the prolapse will correct itself again. sHEila's calm now, and Jelly Bean is not interfering with him at all, so I'm going to leave sHEila in their home tank tonight. He calmed down the first time he prolapsed after I applied the coconut oil too, so hope that is soothing the area and helping that way.

[LilyPad]

Awww I'm sorry thumper, I hope he gets healed up and stays healed. It sucks to have sick babies.

[irThumper]

Awww I'm sorry thumper, I hope he gets healed up and stays healed. It sucks to have sick babies.

Thanks, Amy. He's not any better I put more stuff on him before I went to bed around 2:30 AM, woke up at 8:30 AM and rechecked him, same so added more sugar. Was going to lay back down for half an hour (I turn the lights on at 9 AM and off at 9 PM generally) but I didn't even hear the clock and woke up at 11:30 AM! No difference... I finally put him in the Kritter Keeper to prepare him for his Pedialyte bath, and as I knew he would, he flipped out! I made up a 10% solution of Pedialyte and spring water and put that in with him in a dish. He didn't get in so I slowly dripped the rest of it down his back then applied more sugar slurry and coconut oil to the prolapse. Now I'm finally getting something to eat for myself, I'm diabetic so if I don't watch it sHEila won't be the only one in trouble I'm still getting over this blasted cold 1 week and a half later... why does this have to happen!?

[irThumper]

He's a lot worse since I put him into the small kritter keeper this morning He's so swelled he won't be able to retract unless it goes down a lot more. I'm confused because I tied the sugar first this time and it should have worked like last time (he wasn't as bed when I put it on him) but he just kept kicking it off... should I try a honey bath? I'll have to go to the health food store to get some natural organic honey...

[LilyPad]

I don't have the slightest idea how to treat a prolapse other than what I've read on here recently I have heard that sometimes it requires a vet visit.

[irThumper]

Unfortunately the vet is not an option. Maybe if we had a competent herp vet closer than an hour away... and I had the money to do so... very fixed income (caregiver for my senior folks) and lots of ongoing medical bills What would a vet do that I can't try here is the question, and the way sHEila freaks out just being in the small keeper, what would a trip in the freezing cold in the car with a malfunctioning heater do?

[elly]

Wow, sorry about that.

[Strider18]

I think a honey bath would work. I'm really sorry and I hope he feels better Keep us updated.

0.1.0 Psuedacris regilla

[irThumper]

Well, I've done everything I can. He wouldn't stay in the sugar water bath, kept jumping and climbing the walls of the keeper (I flooded the floor of it and took out the paper towels). When I kept him from climbing the walls he puffed up so he was floating ON the water and stuck his butt up so it wasn't under! So I put a finger on him and gently pushed his butt under(did not touch the prolapse) but he didn't want to stay down. I kept sprinkling dry sugar on top of the prolapse since he wouldn't keep his rump submerged... he's going to wind up diabetic like me from all the sugar! I'm exhausted and feel like I'm going to turn into a bawling mess any moment, and I'm usually the steady one in the family Since he wouldn't stay in the water, I tried for 20+ min but don't know how long it really was, I just took and put the paper towels right back into all the sugar/Pedialyte water, so he has a very well padded very wet squishy floor. it's 77 F in the room right now, so hope he's warm enough.

This was about uh... just over 1 or 1 1/2 hours ago and I just looked looked in on him, the prolapse looks... tilted? Off center kind of, so don't know if that means it's starting to shift, or shrink, or what. I can't tell really, but I'm just going to leave him completely alone and not mess with him anymore because it's stressing him worse Schematically I can tell if I try pushing that swollen tissue back in that I'm only going to succeed in causing him more pain and distress, and I don't want to do that. I'm leaving him in the keeper with it's thick soggy mattress of sugar water soaked paper towels and see if time and quiet will help. If not...

[irThumper]

3:56 PM PST and IT'S BACK IN!!! Ok, ok... should I leave him in the keeper with the soggy sugar water paper towels?? I don't want to move him right now at any rate, but don't know if he should be kept like that all night. I don't know if I should limit his movement tonight or what... I have a second small kritter keeper and I can put him in there with damp paper towels, a couple smaller fake leaves to sit on/hide under, and his flatter water dish... think I'll do that for the night. Oog...

[elly]

I'd leave him unless he's distressed in the small tank.

[irThumper]

He seems calm now, but I put an inverted water dish in there for him in case he wants to climb out of the sugar water stuff. I'll fix up and put him in the back up small keeper tonight before bed. I've only eaten once today and am way too stressed to cook... Chinese to go!

[elly]

Orr actually on second thought, I don't know...sitting in sugar might not be that good. But then I think he definately needs some very damp paper towels wherever he is. I guess after thinking about it it depends on A: how distressed he is in the small tank and B: if he's distressed at all by being picked up and moved.

Edit: Nevermind!

[elly]

Oh yeah, and take care of yourself! This stress will pass.

[irThumper]

I certainly hope so because I'm a nervous wreck! By the way, if this hadn't gone back in I would have taken him to Companion Pet Clinic tomorrow (which is the very closest to us) and begged them to help me and ask for them to take payments, because that is the absolute only thing I could have done. I plan on going and talking to them anyway because this could obviously happen again

Now, I only waited a couple days before feeding him before because everyone was due to be medicated, but he had only one wax worm, then he had two the next day, and then I started giving him just a few small crickets... I've read, however, that they should not be allowed to eat anything for 5 to 10(??) days... I don't want to stretch it out to 10 for worry he will get too weak and then NOT eat. He didn't eat last night, and I'm not going to feed him tonight... for one thing I'm going to look for those doggone night crawlers again, SOMEONE has to have them. I've read, on FF I think, about how someone gave their frog (think it was a Paccy?) some turkey baby food in a syringe... would this be recommended? It's not that sHEila won't eat, he grabbed for a water droplet when I sprayed the tank, thinking it was a cricket no doubt, I just need to be absolutely positively sure about when to start allowing him to eat and how much-- heck I should go read the thread on Pogo again, I know this info is on there! Thing is Pogo is a lot bigger and older than sHEila. Meh, well first things first, I gotta find those night crawlers...

[DEW]

I'm so sorry all of this is happening to sHEila, and you. Glad he is doing better now. I was thinking about if it should happen again the question of leaving him in the kritter keeper or his own tank with the possibility of infection to such a delicate area and wondered if putting the kritter keeper inside his normal tank would help, being able to see his normal surroundings? Just a thought.

Also, have you tried to find a frog rehabber? They might be able to offer some advise, they often know vets who work with exotics and wildlife and are pretty soft touches

Take care, don't make yourself sicker, you may not be able to croak convincingly

[Lija]

Sry, wasn't around.

so what's happening as of now?

[UncleChester]

Sorry to hear this has reoccurred

An experienced herp vet should be able to stitch the cloaca to help keep it in while it heals. They should also be able to advise you on how long you can withhold food. A couple days is probably not nearly enough.

I gave this link last time Amphibian and Reptile Emergencies – Prolapsed Cloaca | That Reptile Blog but it's really worth reading again, especially Frank's replies in the comments section about fasting times. I know it's hard to think in cold blooded amphibian terms, but they do not have the same food requirements as mammals and can withstand fasting for much longer than we humans can.

And yes, do take care of yourself! The Chinese take out I used to get came in low plastic round containers. The short height can be ideal containers to force your frog to chill for a bit when you're giving it a soak instead of using a taller cricket keeper. Or you can probably find a tupperware container of sufficiently low height for your little guy.