Purchased 2 new P. Terribilis, but they don't look like the ones that I already have

[Carisab]

Hello,

I currently have 2 juvenile P. Terribilis Orange. They don't seem very friendly with each other. I thought that I would get two more and have 4 total.

I purchased 2 P. Terribilis Orange from a large frog supplier online - one that has been mentioned here many times, so I don't want to say the name.

The two new froglets are a week apart in age from the ones that I already have. I was thinking perfect. They are in quarantine for 30 days before I introduce them all together into the vivarium. I have had them one week and they are definitely strong and healthy. The shape is different. They have more of an arch than the two I have already (not so visible in the pics). They sit more like a tinc. I know that I am new to dart frogs, but since I have gotten into this I have looked at many pictures and have been to many pet stores looking. The big ? is the green on the legs. Both of mine have black legs that got orange spots and filled in. These guys are definitely different looking. I am worried that they are more Phyllobates bicolor. I called and was told that they are P. Terribilis, no question about that. I read that the Phyllobates bicolor are smaller than the P. Terribilis. I would have preferred to buy and choose from a show, but there is only one show a year in Vegas.

Anyone have any ideas???? The first two pics are of my first 2 (no green). The second two pics are of the new frogs.

[moghue]

Im sort of new myself so i may be wrong but they look more like the bicolor then the orange terribilis to me. hopefully some one else will chime in and have a better answer.

[DigitalPunk]

I will have to agree based on these pictures they look like Phyllobates Bicolor... lets see what others think. They may not be done coloring up yet.. Do you know how old they are? Got any additional pics?

[Mentat]

Sorry; but you are not doing any seller a favor by not identifying name, because now all are doubtfully guilty of sending you the wrong frogs .

I'm looking at my frogs and their orange color does no look like any of yours. Could be the light used for pics or my laptop rendition of them; but my P. terribilis "Orange" are really orange with some black specking that will fade off as they grow. You got the tadpoles at a show from Dartfrog Connection right; did you bought the newer frogs from them too? Strange but the first two pics look more like this frog !

Main sellers in here keep accurate records of their live inventory. My recommendation is to send them a nice email with the attached pics of the frogs you bought, so they can check their records and see if there was a mix-up at their end. .

[Carisab]

Okay, I don't want to taint any sellers. And I also have to say that I am not unhappy with any of my frogs. The first two are from Dart Frog Connection and are 9 and 7 weeks. They did start out a bright and dark orange but as my little Polly has filled in she has gotten lighter. Her (just guessing) legs fill in more every day. Little Wally is 7 weeks and still small. These two are not very bold. They are even afraid of small pin head crickets.

The second two came from Black Jungle, they are the only ones that have stock right now. They were so nice and helpful. Very accomidating with shipping. The frogs are bold and hearty. Not fearful at all. I was told that they are 7-8 weeks. The arch seems to not be as pronounced since they have been eating well and growing. Maybe as they have been getting more comfortabe they have stopped sitting on their toes ready to escape. These guys will eat pin head crickets. They are just a bit bigger than my 9 week old but aren't full color yet (or as chunky).

I would be afraid to send them back even if they would take them. I like them and I guess I just want to identify the differences. Will it still be okay to put them all together? They are of the same family of Phyllobates. I am not looking to breed. I know that P. Terribilis takes almost 2 years to mature and lay eggs. I just want a happy family of frogs. With that said, I will allow them to breed if they do and I will raise the froglets and most likely give them to friends.

I have added more pictures but I have to say that my new guys did not cooperate and stay still very long for me. The first two are the DFC frogs. The rest are the new guys.

[Mentat]

... Will it still be okay to put them all together? They are of the same family of Phyllobates. I am not looking to breed. I know that P. Terribilis takes almost 2 years to mature and lay eggs. I just want a happy family of frogs. With that said, I will allow them to breed if they do and I will raise the froglets and most likely give them to friends...

It's not OK to mix these frogs, if they turn out not to be the same species and morph line (i.e. P. terribilis "Orange"). First reason is they could not get along and the bolder ones stress out the shy ones. That could in turn develop into chronic stress and then an opportunistic pathogen could set in and wipe out the frogs .

Second reason is that there is always a possibility that they could breed. Once you let one hybrid or mixed morph frog out of your control there is no telling where it could end up. And if passed as a true species or morph down the line to unknown persons, it can contaminate the captive breeding pools that supply our hobby. That is a serious issue and it brings unwelcome responses all across the dart hobby .

[deranged chipmunk]

I agree with Carlos. While I think they are just different bloodlines, I think they will color up over time, I would still raise them separately until you know 100% what each pair is. Better safe than sorry.


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