URGENT - Sick Leopard Frog - Please Advise!

[salbertsweber]

We have two leopard frogs. Both were caught from the stock dam at my step-dad's farm in summer 2012 (boy-child went to visit grandpa on the farm & came home with frogs, garter snake, etc.). Both have been no trouble at all - they eat well (crickets from the pet store, loaded with cricket cubes, plus grasshoppers, flies, millers moths, etc., on occasion). They took a nice semi-sleep this winter, but have been quite active happy froggies for the past 2-3 months since waking. We started feeding from a new batch of crickets from Petco today, but no more than usual, and both frogs ate well.

Our larger frog (with round, rather than oblong, spots), has suddenly become ill this evening. He is always chubby, but seems a bit bloated in the tummy. His movements are spastic (more so than usual) and uncoordinated, and his rear toes are twitching uncontrollably. I have put him in a dish of fresh spring water, and he is settling down but still twitching. Color is fine, as are eyes. The other frog seems quite well & normal.

Any advice is greatly appreciated.

[Heatheranne]

It sounds as though your frog has tetany.

Tetany is a group of symptoms caused by low blood calcium levels. Low blood calcium levels that persist can lead to Metabolic Bone Disease or MBD. It can be treated and symptoms resolved if treated quickly.

Signs of tetany include: numbness, tingling, twitching or spasms, lack of muscular coordination, slowing or lack of smooth muscle peristalsis in the intestinal system, progressive inability to catch food related to lack of muscular control and difficulty swallowing due to lack of smooth muscular control, heart dysrhythmias due to cardiac muscle irritability, and can progress to seizures and death.

To stop this progression you will need to get a calcium with vitamin D3 supplement that is safe for frogs. These can be found in the reptile/amphibian section of a pet store or online at amazon, joshsfrogs, etc. I will add a link. However, to not waste time, I recommend you pick up the supplement as soon as you can. Both Petsmart and Petco carry the supplements. There are many brands. I myself use Repcal calcium with vitamin D3.

The calcium supplement needs to have vitamin D3 in it for proper absorption, especially if a UVB light is not used. Otherwise it passes through the gastrointestinal tract with limited absorption making the treatment ineffective.

You should also get a multivitamin supplement such as Repashy plus. Do not use the vitamin yet though. Wait until the tetany issue is under control.

To use the supplement, use a baggie or tall cup and add a small pinch of the calcium. Then add your crickets. Give the cup or baggie a gentle shake to lightly coat the insects of choice. They just need a light coating. Use the supplement daily until symptoms resolve. Then slow the calcium to every other day. For now, use smaller crickets or worm pieces so his belly does not bloat.

If your frog is not eating you will need to do a soak or take him to the vet for a calcium gluconate treatment. Flukers makes a liquid calcium treatment. It is not as effective as an oral supplement for routine care, but it may help in situations like this. Prepare the soak as per box instructions and let him sit in it. The liquid calcium is not the same type of calcium as the oral supplement. Calcium carbonate, as in the oral supplement, is insoluble and will not dissolve or absorb by soaking.

If your frog can no longer hunt or eat his prey, do this treatment quickly. Do not add extra to the water or you may make him toxic. It is better to do a treatment each day than to add extra at the time of treatment. If he starts having seizures or uncontrolled twitching that does not stop, he needs a vet asap. They can do a carefully dosed injection of calcium gluconate. The injections are weight and animal based.

Start the calcium/D3 for both frogs. For the frog with no tetany, do the calcium every other day. He may start his multivitamin one day a week also. The multivitamin should not be given on the same day as the calcium or it may decease the absorption of the calcium. One day a week for MVI, every other day for the calcium/D3.

For the sick frog, you can also pick up some unflavored, plain (clear) Pedialyte. He may be lacking other vital nutrients or electrolytes. I will guide you with this as needed. Just keep it handy in case he doesn't eat.

For the spring water... Do you know if it has heavy metals in it? If you can have it tested at the pet store or if you can get aquarium water test strips, you should test it for chlorine, chloramines, and heavy metals. All are toxic to our frogs. Many aquarium shops or sections at the pet stores will do a free water test for you if you bring in a water sample. If your water tests positive, you will need to use a dechlorinator solution that also detoxifies heavy metals. The easiest way to mix up a dechlorinated water batch by making a gallon of it in your water jug. The bottle gives instructions on how much dechlorinator to add.

Please keep us posted. Good luck! We will continue to follow along and guide you.

Repcal calcium with vitamin D3



http://www.joshsfrogs.com/rep-cal-ul...itamin-d3.html

Repashy multivitamin plus calcium



http://www.joshsfrogs.com/repashy-ca...-3-oz-jar.html

Fluker's liquid calcium



http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B006HX...110_SY165_QL70

You can get the liquid calcium at Petco also.

[salbertsweber]

Thank you very much for your informative reply, Heather-the-Moderator! I was not able to find everything locally (not mail-order), but did the best I could until other products can be delivered at the end of the week. I did find "Fluker's Liquid Calcium" and "Fluker's Liquid Vitamin." I had to order the calcium/D3 for dusting, but could perhaps use the Solaray Calcium Citrate with Vit. D3 (people quality - was using to prevent MBD in orphaned squirrel) - it is D-3 (cholecalciferol) and Calcium citrate/calcium carbonate with the addition of Magnesium Stearate, Watercress Leaf, DAndelion Root, and Parsley Leaf. As far as water goes, I normally dechlorinate tap water for the frogs, but did a water change with bottled drinking water last night as that was on hand & ready to go. Here is our current status:

* I did a soak per package instructions today using distilled water, the liquid calcium (calcium chloride & calcium lactate) & the liquid vitamin ( Vit. A, D3, B1, B2, B6, C, cholecalciferol & Nicotinamide/Niacin/B3) - for 5 minutes on sick (larger) frog. He is much less bloated today (practically normal belly), more mobile & less spastic, and the toe-tremor is markedly improved by 6 PM tonight.

* I also bought brand new enclosure, swim vessel, gravel & substrates, just in case the habitat is the problem. I disinfected & set up the new habitat, and will move them tomorrow.

* Upon returning home at 10:30 PM, I discovered that large frog is again very twitchy in the rear feet, although moving around okay & voluntarily soaking in his water. Return of symptoms is concerning AND the smaller frog has now become twitchy in the feet, although no sign of spasticity. Smaller frog is also voluntarily hanging out in the water. Smaller frog did NOT receive a soak earlier today, as was not symptomatic.

* I bought some red wiggler worms today to offer them - they don't usually like to eat them and prefer crickets, but maybe? Have not tried them yet. Thinking to throw away the new batch of crickets purchased yesterday & consumed shortly before symptoms began. Is it possible for crickets to be toxic or contaminated?

* I also learned late today that our veterinarian for our dogs & cats ALSO does reptiles/herps/amphibians & birds - did not know this. Perhaps a vet visit is in order tomorrow? And the exotic pet store about an hour away offered to do a 30-minute Calcium & Vitamin A soak (don't know the cost) - they thought it sounded like Vit. A deficiency.

* I generally make my own electrolyte replacement for animals - is that okay for frogs? It is non-iodized salt (NaCl), baking soda, & cane sugar in sterile water. I have also used the packets from my nasal saline irrigation (neti pot) system with honey in sterile water. I also have non-salt potassium chloride available for same. I will try some different stores tomorrow, as those nearby were out of unflavored pedialyte today. Should this be used as a soak?

* Lighting-wise, the froggies get lots of natural sunlight (so, full-spectrum), as they live in a plastic clear/slightly opaque plastic tub (HUGE) on the floor near the west-facing patio slider door. They have a sunny side & a shady side, to avoid overheating. But tomorrow they will move into glass habitat raised 3' off the floor near the north facing door but also receiving indirect sun from south-facing 4-panel glass slider door.

* We did have frog poo late today - two pellets in the water - I don't know who made them.

HERE ARE THE BIG QUESTIONS:

* Should I take them for a soaking at the reptile store? Should I soak them both myself tomorrow, in what & for how long? Maybe I didn't do enough today - was just concerned about overdosing.
* Should I administer Pedialyte, in what manner (soak or per oral), and store-bought vs. homemade?
* Should I administer Liquid vitamin and/or liquid calcium directly into frog mouth with a dropper?
* Should I try to feed or not? Worms, new crickets, both, none? Should I dust with the people calcium I have, coat with the liquid calcium, or wait to start that until the proper calcium arrives?
* Should I take them to the veterinarian tomorrow?

Thank you so much for your help & advice - I thought we were doing well & on the mend, but now am quite concerned. Frogs, like kids, apparently get sicker after the doc is closed! ALSO - there are some odd, mite-like critters in the habitat now that I have not noticed previously; they are crawling on the cricket cubes & orange slice, floating in the water - not huge numbers, but new to my knowledge.

[salbertsweber]

And I was previously incorrect about frogs' ages - we got them in summer 2013 (not 2012), so they are probably 12-18 months old.

[salbertsweber]

UPDATE on sick leopard frogs:

I think we are in the clear! I have soaked froggies in liquid calcium & multivitamins. I moved them into a new habitat, thoroughly disinfected with all new substrate & accessories, plus heat disinfected rocks, wood, etc. I put a drop of liquid calcium & vitamins on the tips of their noses so some would run in their mouths, hopefully, because they are not eating well yet. They have had small cricket snacks (I put the liquid supplements on the crickets, too), but show no interest in worms. They are moving around well, no longer spastic, no longer twitching. Color is good / normal as well. We had a couple of poo pellets, and they are spending a lot of time soaking in their regular (distilled) water and burrowing in damp moss under their rock. I am waiting for the recommended cricket-dusting powder to arrive via mail. Thank you so much for all the help & advice!

[Heatheranne]

Hi Stephanie,

I'm glad to hear the good news. Can you switch the soaking water to dechlorinated tap water? Soaking in distilled can pull electrolytes from them.

Sorry for the lag in replying. I've just been away a few days. Busy at work and at home.