Frog Lethargic, Discoloured and not eating.

[Mentat]

Hi Gaby! Sorry for Treecko's death and the new sick one . Is there a local herp vet or lab that could conduct a fecal exam for you? Might as well answer the enclosure questions to see if we can narrow down issue. Thank you !

“Trouble in the Frog Enclosure”

The following information will be very helpful if provided when requesting assistance with either your frog or enclosure. To help with your questions, please utilize the below list and post the information in the proper forum area to get advice from FF members that keep the same frog. This will allow for little confusion and a faster more informed response.

1. Size of enclosure
2. # of inhabitants - specifically other frogs and size differences
3. Humidity
4. Temperature
5. Water - type - for both misting and soaking dish
6. Materials used for substrate
7. Enclosure set up i.e. plants (live or artificial), wood, bark and other materials.
- How were things prepared prior to being put into the viv.
8. Main food source
9. Vitamins and calcium? (how often)
10. Lighting
11. What is being used to maintain the temperature of the enclosure
12. When is the last time he/she ate
13. Have you found poop lately
14. A pic would be helpful including frog and enclosure (any including cell phone pic is fine)
15. Describe frog's symptoms and/or recent physical changes; to include it's ventral/belly area.
16. How old is the frog
17. How long have you owned him/her
18. Is the frog wild caught or captive bred
19. Frog food- how often and if it is diverse, what other feeders are used as treats
20. How often the frog is handled
21. Is the enclosure kept in a high or low traffic area
22. Describe enclosure maintenance (water changes, cleaning, etc)

by Lynn(Flybyferns) and GrifTheGreat.

[flybyferns]

Gabby,

Try to answer the questions (in post #7) as best as possible

Sorry for the troubles you are having and very sorry you lost a frog

I would separate each remaining frog.
A frog this size should not be eating fruit flies. FF should NOT be a regular feeder.
The ff are much too small ! Continue to feed the the dusted worms and small crickets.
**The worms ---if they take them --- is a feeder that is easily digested for a sick frog.
You are better off feeding them a few dusted crickets daily vs a lot of crickets all at once.
The frog in photo # 3 is very thin

Housing for frogs should be 1 frog per 10 gallons. "Cramped" could be causing the "skinny" !
The small quarters are likely causing tremendous stress -----> setting yourself up for a spiral downward ... of issues. It's imperative they have a larger tank -- ie 40 gallons if they are to remain together ( or 2 -- 20 gallon )

Get rid of the sphagnum moss--- as they can swallow it by accident.
( Use dampened paper towel for now ---dampened with properly prepared water - NOT distilled)
Change it every day. Wash your hands ( or use disposable gloves) between each little hospital enclosure.

As mentioned, if any of the frogs have diarrhea you will need to find a vet to do a fecal ( poop ) test to rule out the possibility of parasites. You might as well do only one test....since they have been housed together ---and if found to be positive---they will ALL have to be treated prior to be housed together in a MUCH larger enclosure.

You need a solution for the food as it's imperative that availability never be interrupted.
Do everything possible to become very proficient at and keep a few cricket and worm cultures!
Or ....at the very least secure shipments of both from a supplier via the mail ? This sounds like a tough one for you , sorry.

The extra shedding. A frog should be rinsed very well after a honey soak.
Hydration will occur if you use properly prepared water for the frog's soaking dish and simply get him to stay in it with a loose fitting lid with air holes.

If the 'extra' shedding occurred 1st--- has the frog been exposed to any kind of chemicals--- of any kind.
What do you use to clean the tank? Let us know

Please keep us posted

[flybyferns]

Gabby,
How are things going?

[BlueKiwiOca]

Hi, I was at school so couldn't reply earlier. The frogs are so small I really don't think they could handle eating crickets even if I could get them- New Zealand is a terrible place to keep frogs from my experience, as I have issues getting food (pet shop only has mealworms and fruitflies occasionally, and to get feed from the supplier is prohibitively expensive- this is the only reason why I still feed fruit flies). The worms I've has to get from our garden, but I've sorted out the fruit fly supply issue.

Also, there are no vets in Auckland that have experience in amphibian care, and a fecal (according to my local vet) will cost me $80+

Treecko had always lagged behind in terms of appetite and growth, the others dont seem to be as skinny as he was. I got the frogs from a pet shop; I don't know if they were captive bred or wild caught, but either is a possibility.

1. Size of enclosure- 10 gallon Exo-Terra Mini-Tall
2. # of inhabitants - specifically other frogs and size differences- 5 frogs all approximately the same size- but all are smaller than 3cm SVL
3. Humidity - 70-80%
4. Temperature - Winter at the moment, so temperatures are sitting around 18-19C
5. Water - type - for both misting and soaking dish - de-chlorinated tap water
6. Materials used for substrate - Sphagnum moss
7. Enclosure set up i.e. plants (live or artificial), wood, bark and other materials - large plastic water dish, one artificial (plastic) flower, one plastic leafy plant and one silk? leafy plant. One Exo-Terra food dish. Sphagnum moss on top of gravel for drainage.
- How were things prepared prior to being put into the viv - cleaned in hot water with vinegar, then thoroughly rinsed in de-chlorinated tap water. Sphagnum moss was soaked in dechlorinated tap water, then squeezed of excess water.
8. Main food source - fruit flies (see above for reasoning)
9. Vitamins and calcium? - fruit flies dusted with calcium powder every 2-3 days
10. Lighting - no lighting
11. What is being used to maintain the temperature of the enclosure - a heater in my bedroom; I know ambient heat isn't enough to maintain a temperature in the terrarium, but I have to make do with what I can get here. When I'm home, I direct my incandescent desk lamp onto one side of the terrarium; this slowly raises the temperature by a bit (up to 20-21C)
12. When is the last time he/she ate - approximately 5 days ago
13. Have you found poop lately - Froakie did a small poop yesterday in the hospital enclosure.
14. A pic would be helpful including frog and enclosure (any including cell phone pic is fine) - Will attach later
15. Describe frog's symptoms and/or recent physical changes; to include it's ventral/belly area. - Lethargic, reduced feeding response, sleeping a lot, dull colouration.
16. How old is the frog - Approx 17 months old
17. How long have you owned him/her - 16 months
18. Is the frog wild caught or captive bred - unknown; from a pet shop, but wild caught may be a possibility. I've had him since he was a tadpole.
19. Frog food- how often and if it is diverse, what other feeders are used as treats; Wingless fruit flies, occasional worm, housefly and moth.
20. How often the frog is handled - Only when necessary; cleaning tank etc
21. Is the enclosure kept in a high or low traffic area- Medium; on my (large) desk in my bedroom.
22. Describe enclosure maintenance (water changes, cleaning, etc) - Daily water change and poop removal. Deep clean of the terrarium when I have time, every 1-2 months

Again, I am aware that there are things about their husbandry that are not ideal; if I could improve them, I would. If there's something I'm doing wrong, I'd appreciate it being pointed out.

I can't separate all the other frogs as I don't have the resources or space to do so, but I will replace the moss with paper towelling.

Thanks for your help