Stubborn Pacman

[Murphy]

Hey guys. Just wondering how to get my pacmans feeding response up. He refuses to eat unless I rub it in his face for a few minutes which I doubt he particularly enjoys. Any thoughts?

[chibikaie]

What's on offer? Are there some foods he'll eat more readily than others? I think they do have preferences.

Is there any chance that he's not really hungry and is only striking to get rid of the annoyance?

[limnologist]

try a large, live prey item. Though, Thats how I feed mine, I keep a lot and dont have time to make sure each one eats, so I hand feed each one. It doesnt seem to bother them at all.

[GrifTheGreat]

It doesn't stress the frog if you rub the food and he takes it, but if he starts to go into a defensive posture then you need to worry. Some are just lazy like this. Its their nature.

[limnologist]

I concur haha

[Murphy]

try a large, live prey item. Though, Thats how I feed mine, I keep a lot and dont have time to make sure each one eats, so I hand feed each one. It doesnt seem to bother them at all.

I put crickets in his tank but he doesn't even seem to notice them even when they walk right in front of him. He eats nightcrawlers when i rub them in his face as well as crickets.

[GrifTheGreat]

I put crickets in his tank but he doesn't even seem to notice them even when they walk right in front of him. He eats nightcrawlers when i rub them in his face as well as crickets.

Just keep doing what you are doing.

[Bast3rd]

I try rubbing food in my guys face. The turns away and backs up. You say you need to worry about defensive posture. Should I be worried? Why? what does this mean?

[GrifTheGreat]

I try rubbing food in my guys face. The turns away and backs up. You say you need to worry about defensive posture. Should I be worried? Why? what does this mean?

That means he's stressed. Try letting him catch food on his own.

[limnologist]

In the end, as long as there is food in the tank, and if he isnt deathly sick, he will eat. He will eat when he wants to.

[123nave]

that's how my pacman and bearded dragon are too!!!

[Lecroixe]

My Keropi generally won't eat if I have to resort to rubbing it along his face. However I do cut my long nightcrawlers down into 2-3 segments and try to drop them right in front of him. Today I went to feed him (Approx. two and a half days since last feeding), just kinda floated the squiggly worm in front of him above him about an three inches before just immediately dropping it on the surface for him, he just bolted for it with his face and snatched the worm piece. He was hungry, I could tell :3

----
On a side note, I don't think I've read anywhere but:
Now I know that a lot of people say that food should be no bigger than the width of their eyes, but does food of any larger sizes pose any health threats or dangerous conditions? Keropi does sometimes recede his eyes into his body when I guess he swallows for about a second or two while he does his big gulp but I usually give him a few minutes in between each worm piece to let him fully swallow each piece.

[Murphy]

My Keropi generally won't eat if I have to resort to rubbing it along his face. However I do cut my long nightcrawlers down into 2-3 segments and try to drop them right in front of him. Today I went to feed him (Approx. two and a half days since last feeding), just kinda floated the squiggly worm in front of him above him about an three inches before just immediately dropping it on the surface for him, he just bolted for it with his face and snatched the worm piece. He was hungry, I could tell :3

----
On a side note, I don't think I've read anywhere but:
Now I know that a lot of people say that food should be no bigger than the width of their eyes, but does food of any larger sizes pose any health threats or dangerous conditions? Keropi does sometimes recede his eyes into his body when I guess he swallows for about a second or two while he does his big gulp but I usually give him a few minutes in between each worm piece to let him fully swallow each piece.

Thats how all frogs swallow. They recede their eyes to push the food down.

[Mentat]

...On a side note, I don't think I've read anywhere but: Now I know that a lot of people say that food should be no bigger than the width of their eyes, but does food of any larger sizes pose any health threats or dangerous conditions? Keropi does sometimes recede his eyes into his body when I guess he swallows for about a second or two while he does his big gulp but I usually give him a few minutes in between each worm piece to let him fully swallow each piece.

The rule about food not being bigger than the "distance between the frog's eyes" applies mostly to insects due to their harder part bodies like the head being an impaction issue. When it comes to softer foods like earthworms, it depends more on the mouth/stomach size. For Pacman frogs, babies should get mouth sized pieces; juveniles 2-3 in. can handle body length pieces; and adults 3.5 to 4 in. and up can handle whole night crawlers with no issues. Good luck !

[Lecroixe]

Thats how all frogs swallow. They recede their eyes to push the food down.

Haha, I found out about that just the other day when I was doing more internet searching for curiosity. I think it's kind of adorable that they do that. I always thought he was trying to savor each meal.

The rule about food not being bigger than the "distance between the frog's eyes" applies mostly to insects due to their harder part bodies like the head being an impaction issue. When it comes to softer foods like earthworms, it depends more on the mouth/stomach size. For Pacman frogs, babies should get mouth sized pieces; juveniles 2-3 in. can handle body length pieces; and adults 3.5 to 4 in. and up can handle whole night crawlers with no issues. Good luck !

Sweet. Thanks for clearing that up! Keropi is definitely in the juvenile stage; I can feed him a whole worm and maybe a half more if necessary. He'll usually turn away when I try to give him the second half of a second worm so I generally just feed him one worm, cut into two or three pieces, at a time until he gets a little bigger. I'm also glad many have considered nightcrawlers to be a good staple; I rather have worms wriggling around in my garage in a worst case scenario than have to bring roaches or crickets into the house haha.

[limnologist]

My Keropi generally won't eat if I have to resort to rubbing it along his face. However I do cut my long nightcrawlers down into 2-3 segments and try to drop them right in front of him. Today I went to feed him (Approx. two and a half days since last feeding), just kinda floated the squiggly worm in front of him above him about an three inches before just immediately dropping it on the surface for him, he just bolted for it with his face and snatched the worm piece. He was hungry, I could tell :3

----
On a side note, I don't think I've read anywhere but:
Now I know that a lot of people say that food should be no bigger than the width of their eyes, but does food of any larger sizes pose any health threats or dangerous conditions? Keropi does sometimes recede his eyes into his body when I guess he swallows for about a second or two while he does his big gulp but I usually give him a few minutes in between each worm piece to let him fully swallow each piece.

People who warn not to allow frogs to eat such large food usually have, in-bred, artificially kept, weak frogs. Naturally, pacman frogs are capable of eating prey items a little over half their size. the reason his eyes recede is because he is using the muscle underneath them to push the food down his throat.

[limnologist]

My male brown Cranwelli once ate a garter snake that was exactly 18 inches long. the frog himself was only 5 inches long. He didnt eat for a while after that haha :P

[Lija]

..... I shouldn't probably reply as i dont think i have anything nice to say......
You never feed your frog food items that are too big, ever, not if you care about the frog anyway. Nothing funny about it, it can cause too many problems that might cause death, including inability to digest, impaction, inverted stomach.

[Hypnotic]

While I'm honestly guilty of feeding my frogs worms twice their size, I would never do this with a vertebrate for the reasons Lija mentioned above.
Honestly, these frogs should be able to digest big prey items if all conditions are right, but even then there are exceptions, and I'd rather not be taking risks when it comes to this.
While I overlook the eye rule for mice and other feeders for adults (seriously, if everyone followed that rule, no frog would be eating mice, dubias or worms unless cut up into tiny chunks) I do believe it depends on the prey animal and how easy it digests.
Worms I feed twice the size, my adults all get full grown dubias, the young ones get eye size +-, when it comes to mice, I look at the frogs mouth so it can easely enter and never go beyound the frog's length vs mouse length.

[Lija]

Of course you can do that with mice if not too many, say to give one adult mouse to full grown frog , no problems here, worms no problems either, they are easily digested. Im talking about healthy frogs that would take it on their own.
Babies are different story here.
Common sense is needed and if for experienced keeper it is ok to bend rules, for not-so-much experienced keeper it is better to follow them and that is why i always advise that is better to be safe then sorry.
With a garter snake or any snake for that matter... It is no for many reasons, ethical included. It is very hard to digest prey, long item. Frog cant bite a piece of it when he cant fit anymore but will swallow until is done with very high possibility of having big problems soon after.