Here to learn and get support

[RBKfrogger]

Hello all,

I'm here because I'm a new frogger. I've always loved them and for mother's day my hubby and son bought me 2 Whites and the terrarium for them.

I was thrilled, I'd done over a month of research before finally deciding one them. Wanting to ensure we got the best advice and frogs we bought them at a specialty store. Attached are the picture I took of Lucy and Desi the day I brought them home.


Unfortunately, the store did not warn me about younger frog care and didn't warn me about food sizes. The smallest wasn't eating, so I consulted with the store and was given bad advice that just stressed the poor thing out more. WIth the stress and crickets that grew to big for the smallest to eat, my small Desi died of starvation just a couple days ago. I was heartbroken, he was so beautiful. I only found out two days ago about cup feeding and from an employee at another pet store, if only I'd known.

I'm determined to make sure that following bad advice is never the cause of a pet's death again. I've joined a number of furums including this on to get a wide variety of knowledgeable advice, and I'm going to make sure that my pretty Lucy is as happy and healthy as she possibly can be.

I like the interaction here, I hope I've found a good forum for my future froggy years.

Renee

[Alkaline8214]

Welcome and sorry to hear about your frog. My name is Mike. I too have just recently joined this forum and find it to be one of the best out there. The information here is so great and the responses are fast. Look forward to seeing more pics of your frog.

[Jace]

Welcome to the Forum. I am very sorry to hear about Desi. Unfortunately, bad advice can come from anywhere, even specialty stores. However, this Forum has many great members who are not only obsessed with frogs and toads, but are here to ensure than anyone who comes upon this site can find great-and trusted-information to properly take care of their pets. I am sure that you and Lucy will be very happy here.

[missclick]

im sorry for your loss
welcome to the forum
I'm sure you will find a lot of good info here
here is a link to the care sheet for white's tree frogs: FrogForum - White's Tree Frog Care

[Kurt]

Sorry about your loss. I don't think the frog starved to death if you received it for mother's day. That is, unless Mother's day is on a different day within a different month in Canada than it is here in the US. I suspect it may have been sick when you bought it.
I would have the survivng frog brought the vet for a check up and a deworming, just to be on the safe side.

[scribbles]

Welcome to the forum . I'm sorry to hear about Desi.

[Ebony]

Welcome to the forum Renee, Im so sorry for your loss. As Kurt said, it would be a good idea to get Lucy checked out by a vet. It looks like you have set up a lovely home for her. You have definitely come to the right place.

[Paul Rust]

Welcome aboard Renee. That is a great setup. I suggest what the others have already, get it checked for parasites and treated. It's likely what killed the other one.

[RBKfrogger]

Thanks everyone I really appreciate the feedback. I went looking though past forums about worms and parasites and the more I read the more I fear you may be right about Desi. I'm boiling mad.

Lucy has been actively hunting, and the first couple days after Desi died she looked fantastic. Her colour was beautiful her schedule like clockwork, I even saw my first jumpa attack on a cricket. It was awesome! I figured being in a tank with a dying animal couldn't be good stress wise.

Anyways for a day and a half now I've noticed that she's not climbing to the top of the tank to sleep like she has in the two weeks I've had her. She's taken Desi's spot at the bottom under a fern. She's never slept down there before, I have to admit your comments have me pretty worried now.

I've been reading so much over the last couple days. I also read about Pancur-C and I'm considering giving her a three day treatment. I wish I could afford a vet but the honest truth is I really really can't.

This has been a very discouraging experience.

[Kurt]

Sleeping on the ground is not normal for a treefrog. It may or may not be gastrointestinal parasites. Whats the current humidity level & temperature of the enclosure?

[Tropicok]

Sleeping on the ground is not normal for a treefrog.

Oh Oh....I just learned something. My Dumpy does both. Something about him has been bothering me lately but can't quite figure out what. Tonight after eating two crickets I noticed he has red nostrils. Not bleeding, just red. Any clue?

[Kurt]

Not really. Any pictures?

[RBKfrogger]

Thanks Kurt,

I'm attaching a picture of Lucy. She hasn't been sleeping on the bottom (substrate) she's sleeping clinging to the bottom of the cork bark under a fern. But like I said it isn't normal for her she's usually way up top.

Temp and Humidity
The temperature is consistently between 78-82 during the day and around 70-73 at night. I have a 18x18x24 ExoTerra terrarium with screen lid, there is a medium sized warming pad on the bottom left hand side, and a 75w basking light in the same corner on for the daylight hours (12 hours)

The humidity is consistently between 50 and 70, I mist in the morning and at night.

Feeding ans Water
I change her water bowl every morning using reverse osmis water from a water store, I also left the lid of the dispenser open to air for 2 days before using.

She's been consistently eating 2 crickets per night. The crickets are gut loaded with Nature Zone Nutra bites, and every 4 days or so I've been dusting them with calcium powder.

Stress
When I first got them I held them for about 2-3 minutes a day, checking them. I didn't realize this could worsen any condition they had, I did try to keep it minimal. But it's been week now that I haven't touched Lucy wanting her to adapt, destress and get comfortable.

Does that help?

[Kurt]

I would use either dechlorinated tap water or spring water for your frog. Distilled or reverse ossmosis water can be used for misting. Cut back on the heat a little. I have no heat pads or basking lights on my treefrog tanks and I have had my White's for 5 years now.

[RBKfrogger]

Thanks Kurt,
I bought spring water today and replaced what was in the dish.
She's still sleeping low on the trunk today, but I didn't use the basking light. So her tank is a little cooler, between 68- 70 and that's with the heat pad still on on the bottom of the tank.

I also spoke with the specialty store owner and asked if others had died. He said no. He is willing to replace the one I lost but he doesn't want to do that until we figure out what's going on with Lucy. He doesn't want the other to perhaps get sick too. I'm sending him pictures of Lucy and her set up. They have a good reputation in the area, so I'm really hoping they'll help the best they can.

I'll keep you all posted as to the progress. Thank you all so much for all the help you've given so far!

Renee

[Kurt]

You're welcome.

[RBKfrogger]

Thank you everyone for your replies, and special thanks to you Kurt for helping me figure this out. Lucy is officially getting better

It was a matter of heat, too much heat. My thermometer is either defective or she just likes it cooler than the average white. She seems to be happiest when the day time temp is around 65-70 any higher and she starts to hide and act oddly. I've turned off both the warming pad and the basking light. She likes the room temp.

Her colour is back, she's starting to sleep higher up, and she generally looks calm and at ease. I am SO relieved!

Have a great day everyone!

[Deku]

Welcome to the forum. Sorry about desi. I dont think your frog died of starvation just from not being fed a couple of days.... If I may say, frogs can last up to a month(ussually) without food in the wild. Soooo. I would highly doubt they died from starvation. Did you look into the care they were giving them? Ussually petstores even specialty ones tend to give bad care to their animals. You may need to take that animal to the vet and check its health. Just to be safe. Other than that, if you do want a another frog you could buy them on certain good online sites or just go to a reptile expo. Ussually both have good ones. I say this because I sympathize with you. Ive had similar experience with petstores. But anywho. If the dumpy is below 3inches feed pinheads. If its 3inches feed mediums, if its a "large" dumpy well now you can feed them these:
Crickets<--dusted weekly
Waxworms<---they love these
Butterworms<--If you find them they're also good
Earthworms<---good to get the frog a tad fatter(alot of meat)
Locusts<---very rare but nutritious
Grasshoppers-same as the locust
Moths<---frogs and toads absolutely love these!

For the most part I would feed insects that are "captive" rather than catching them. For moths what you can do is you can either just cultivate your own batch by grabbing a few moth eggs(try as many). Then try getting them to reproduce. I dont know how hard it would be. But yeah. I remember seeing some places that sell them. But I forget their names. Anywho good luck with your white's treefrog(s). These lil buggers are cute as a button and easy to care for.

[Kurt]

Thats great news and I am glad I could help.

[RBKfrogger]

Hi Everyone,

Just an update, Lucy is doing great! She's now reclaimed the very top corner of her tank. Hoorray!

I took much of the advice given. The thermometer was in fact defective, so I turned off all extra heat sources. I removed her ornamental cork bark backing (it was hard to clean) and placed on the outside of the tank a dark black towel to shade the back panel. She loves it

She's eating really well, gaining weight and looking really healthy. My hubby is now a fan, and we love to feed her and watch her hunt her cricket prey.

Thanks for the help, I've begun looking up vivarium set ups. Any links you'd liek to recommend would be appreciated.

Renee