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Thread: New RETF Owner

  1. #1
    Danish
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    Default New RETF Owner

    So I've been researching how to care for a red tree frog for about 2 months now prior to getting the frog so I can know what I'm doing. I've just started setting everything up but cannot figure out how to raise the temperature during the night/day. Also I'd like your input on the general set up. I've spent around $300 on the set up alone and want to stay economical from here on out. I'm on the east coast so it can get kinda cold in the house. I have a 18x18x24 exo terra with drainage, barrier, and joshs abg mix. I have 6 live plants that I also got from Josh but they're still small and haven't reached their climax yet, so not much there for the frog. So I have 2 big fake plants for the frog to climb on.

    After I put in the substrate I moistened it with cold water and also mist with cold water. I got an exo terra compact top that only fits 40 Watt incandescent bulbs, so I've been using 2 exo terra 40 Watt daylight lamps. My temperature stays in the low 70s and I wanted to get it higher.

    Also noticed the humidity tanks with the bulbs on.. Can get to low 40, but with the lights off it stays in the high 70s. So what's the best way to heat up my vivarium? Also the bulbs I'm using only emit UVA, is that good enough for plants? Or do they also need UVB? They get no sunlight.

    Im also trying an under tank heater but so far it doesn't seem to do much. I'm using the exo terra digital for readings. I wanna have everything under control so I can finally get my frog! Sorry for being all over the place and having no organization with my questions lol. Thanks.

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  3. #2
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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    Danish welcome to the forums!

    I have the same exo terra you have and had near the identical setup you have with it when i first got my 2 Red Eyed Tree Frogs. I had the same issues with the lights killing the humidity. I switched to using a Ceramic Heat Emitter <CHE>. I bought a 100w one so it could easily heat the 18x18x24 without needing to have the CHE on 24/7 and without it struggling to recover from heat drops. I also purchased a ZooMed HydroTherm to control the CHE. The HydroTherm also allows you to program daytime and nighttime temps. This allows you to simulate night time temp drops. The CHE also does not kill the humidity in the tank.

    I then got rid of the eco terra light hood and replaced it with an LED light system. I got mine on sale at Petco, but you can get them cheap from this website also. The LED lights provide deeper light penetration in the terrarium and honestly make all the colors in the space more natural. The LED lights also do not hurt the humidity in the terrarium.

    The Zoomed Hydrotherm can control humidity as well, but I do not use that feature. I have my misting system setup on a timer and through trial and error have the misting schedule nailed down.


    Hope this is helpful in some way

  4. #3
    Danish
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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    Thanks. The only reason I haven't tried a CHE yet is because I can't put it in the top due to high wattage and I already have a night bulb in an independent lamp with its own switch. Unless the CHE maintains temperatures along the night? Then I can get rid of the night bulb.

  5. #4

    Default New RETF Owner

    First off, welcome to the forum!!

    You can always modify the top by removing the screen and replacing it with plexiglass to keep humidity in. Start with two panels and check. Also, if you are using a dial style, analog hygrometer, throw it out, they are rarely, if ever, accurate. Get yourself a digital one with probe, then reevaluate. You'll probably find your parameters are not as bad as you think they are.
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  6. #5
    Danish
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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    Quote Originally Posted by deranged chipmunk View Post
    First off, welcome to the forum!!

    You can always modify the top by removing the screen and replacing it with plexiglass to keep humidity in. Start with two panels and check. Also, if you are using a dial style, analog hygrometer, throw it out, they are rarely, if ever, accurate. Get yourself a digital one with probe, then reevaluate. You'll probably find your parameters are not as bad as you think they are.
    I'm using a digital exo terra with probe.

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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    Quote Originally Posted by Danish View Post
    Thanks. The only reason I haven't tried a CHE yet is because I can't put it in the top due to high wattage and I already have a night bulb in an independent lamp with its own switch. Unless the CHE maintains temperatures along the night? Then I can get rid of the night bulb.
    The CHE produces radiant heat with out producing any light so it can be used at night as well. RETF hate any sort of light at night. I have been trying to get mine to be ok with some Blue LED lights to simulate night time, but they just go right back to sleep.

    The CHE is the best method I have tried to heat the terrarium the RETF are in, I love it!

    As bill said it is also a good idea to cover most of the screen top up with some glass or plastic. On my 18x18x24 I have the back part of the screen covered with glass and then the front part has glass on it except for a 4" wide section where the CHE is sitting

    This will help lock in Humidity and heat.

  8. #7
    Danish
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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    I ordered a CFE. How long do you usually keep it on a day and around what times? Thanks a lot for your help.

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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    Mine turns on off and on throughout the day automatically. The ZooMed Hydrotherm turns it on and off when it hits the ranges I programed into it. The Hydro therm is a bit pricey but prob the best purchase I made for the tank initially.

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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    I guess I could elaborate some lol. I keep my terrarium at 77F during the day. At night I allow the temps to drop to 73F. I have the temp sensor on the opposite side of the tank from the CHE and about 1/2 way down the side. I put the sensor there to ensure the desired temps were being maintained across the terrarium. This does create some cooler and warmer spots in the enclosure and allows the frogs to move around based on what temp they are looking for at that time.

    Now if I could only find a way to stop them from always pooping in their water bowl and food bowl lol.

  11. #10
    Danish
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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    When do you have the lights to turn on/off? Currently mine are off between 11pm-8am

  12. #11
    GreenTree
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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    12 hour on/off light cycle. 6 am turn on 6pm turn off. Its all up to you really. I found timers are an extreemly usefull investment. In case I am away for a day or two.

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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    As Greentree said. 12hr night/day cycle is good enough. I have mine set for 7AM - 7PM

  14. #13
    Danish
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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    Thanks. I think I'm finally all set lol. Only problem is - almost every website seems to be out of stock on cb babies! Where are some good places to get retfs?

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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    I bought my first 2 from a local pet store. They had to order them in. The next 2 I bought from LLL Reptile they were 1 month out of water. I don't see any on their site right now. There was a user on the forums who has a whole mess of baby Reds. He might be up for selling a few of them.

    I can't stress enough how important it is to do a 30 day quarantine period for new frogs. It allows them time to adjust and allows you time to observe them and make sure they are doing good (Not sick, eating good, pooping, and all the normal things).

    I don't know of any CB babies that are available. Pickings will be slim until winter is over I am afraid. I'll keep my eyes open and will post a link if I find any.

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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    Here is one. I don't have any experience buying from them, but I have seen their name tossed around a bunch.

    Red Eye Tree Frog for Sale

  17. #16
    Danish
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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    I've seen really bad reviews about backwater reptiles.. So I've been trying to find other places. I'll try and find the user selling them.

  18. #17
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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    Your daytime and night time humidity levels are fine with those heat bulbs. Don't worry too much about high humidity with these guys that's where people end up having problems with them. Too much can be more harm than good. They always visit the water dish at night to rehydrate anyway so don't worry about them drying out during the day. I had a sick red eye once that was being treated with baytril and was in a dry tank. The baytril dries the **** out of their skin it literally looked old and wrinkley but after it soaked in its dish at night it was completely reversed. Just check that no frogs are sleeping up at the top of the tank directly under the bulbs as 40 W could possibly burn them if they're are exposed to it all day, easy thing to do is just bring the light canopy forward away from the area where they are sleeping.

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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    I've made some comments below. Due to frog breeding cycles sometimes you have to wait a bit for their availability. It's a far better choice to wait than to get them from a questionable or unknown source. Many experienced members in here have nightmare stories when they started with unhealthy RETFs. From your description see that you are setting a vivarium for them. Do you have a separate quarantine enclosure available? If not and the RETFs contaminate the enclosure; you will have to get rid of everything that can't be sterilized. You can read more about quarantine in here: http://www.frogforum.net/general-dis...uarantine.html.

    By the way; have you ever thought of keeping lower temperature frogs in there? That would reduce/eliminate your temperature issues. Some of the hardier Dart frogs or more temperate tree frogs come to mind. Good luck !

    Quote Originally Posted by Danish View Post
    ...After I put in the substrate I moistened it with cold water and also mist with cold water. I got an exo terra compact top that only fits 40 Watt incandescent bulbs, so I've been using 2 exo terra 40 Watt daylight lamps. My temperature stays in the low 70s and I wanted to get it higher.
    One of the limitations of the ExoTerra top; think they built that in to match their compact fluorescent lights.

    Also noticed the humidity tanks with the bulbs on.. Can get to low 40, but with the lights off it stays in the high 70s. So what's the best way to heat up my vivarium?
    It depends on how big is the temperature differential between the room and the desired enclosure temperature. You can use a combination of lamp heat and a side located heat mat/heat tape and a thermostat controller for most cases.

    Also the bulbs I'm using only emit UVA, is that good enough for plants? Or do they also need UVB? They get no sunlight.
    Plants do not need UVB; they need light that peaks at 5,600K color temperature.

    Im also trying an under tank heater but so far it doesn't seem to do much.
    Do not place heat sources below the tank, lights on top and heat mat/tape on the side only. You can leave the ExoTerra with compact fluorescents on top; but be aware those lights are short lived (read an average of 6 months) and might consider replacing with LEDs in future. Bad thing is that LEDs produce even less heat. Would recommend closing all open screen areas with aluminum foil now. When there is a large temperature differential between an enclosure and the room temp the heat loss through any opening is going to tax any heating you apply to the enclosure as it acts as a room heater too. Once you get parameters dialed in you can then replace aluminum foil with more permanent glass or plastic...
    Remember to take care of the enclosure and it will take care of your frog !​

  20. #19
    Eric and Stitch
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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    Hydrtherm is awesome if you're not using a mister for the humidity side of things. after a month of drowning crickets in my bowl feeding method I gave up on the hydrotherm. my current setup has an aquatic section with an over sized water heater and I keep the water temp at about 78*F This keeps humidity up and temps pretty stable.

    Also, Insulate! If you have a side or back, or bottom of the tank that is against a wall, covered with decorations ect, get some insulation on it, like Styrofoam or pink builders foam from Menards. You dont need a supper thick piece, just cover the glass. Single pane glass lets heat escape pretty fast like a computer heat sink, keep in mind you cannot insulate over heat tape/pad/cord and the such, but if you have an overhead radiant heat system on a thermostat, insulating will reduce heat loss and reduce energy loss. Ideally you want a system balanced so that the time the heater is on to the time the heater is off is about 50/50 This way you aren't cooking the frogs when the heater is on and freezing them when it is off. A rheostat dimmer paired with your larger CHE on a simple thermostat will allow you to fine tune the heating needs of your tank.

    LED lighting is amazing, a lot more light for visual appeal and helps plants grow. I had a 'Plant" fluorescent tube and switched to an Aquatic plant LED system, all my plants shot up like mad. It has a built in timer for day light and 'moon' light, the frogs just sleep until everything is off.

    Frog suppliers, Joshsfrogs, LLLReptile, Michael Novy of Rain Forest Junkies, Reputable members of this forum.

    I see a correlation between horror stories of sick or DOA frogs coming from suppliers in Florida. Not saying all FL based suppliers are bad.

  21. #20
    Danish
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    Default Re: New RETF Owner

    Thanks a lot guys. My temp and humidity problems seem solved so far. I'm using a CHE and have some exo terra bulbs for the plants. My nighttime temp hovers around 67 and daytime around 78. I haven't seen a solid range of humidity suggested so I just keep it around 70 with an automatic fogger. I got the baby frogs today from inland sea reptiles in FL. Michael was great and even gave me another frog just because he shipped a day late. The frog are just a bit bigger than my thumb nail! Petsmart doesn't have crickets small enough so I dumped a lot of dead fruit flies into a transparent glass bowl. They haven't eaten yet though. One of the frogs is pink, which is weird. At first I thought it was a leutino but now I dont know. Where's a good place to get more fruit flies or really small crickets? It's funny how If you shine even a little bit of light in there they get all shut-eye. I read about people reversing their nighttime schedules, anyone got any experience?

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