My Waxy Tree Frog Died

[Kay]

I bought a baby waxy tree frog at a reptile show. I had not intended to, but I won a terrarium as a door prize and when I saw the little frog I could not resist. I read everything I could find and complied with all the instructions. I had him for about a year. There was nothing out of the norm. One day he was sitting on a limb and that waxy substance was dripping off of him. It looked like a candle melting. By the time I could get things together to take him to the veterinarian, he was dead.

What does that mean when the wax pours off of them? What would have caused that to happen?

I want to get another one sometime in the future. Would it be better for me to get two? I have since read that they're communal.

Thanks for your help.

[flybyferns]

Hi,
So sorry to hear your frog died? Sad

I have never kept them? I'll do my best to get some questions going?
I'll PM someone who may know . Answering these questions may help ?

What were the temp and humidity settings.
Did you use a UVB ?
They really need a lot of space...what size enclosure was he in?
They are very social....confirm...... he was alone, right?
What substrate were you using?
What was he eating? Did he hunt for his food or did you feed him?
What supplements were you using?

Best, Lynn

[Lija]

So sorry for your loss

lots of things can have been gone wrong here. Is the frog in your avatar the one you lost?
would you have pics of your frog?
Would you please answer questions of the trouble in the enclosure. This way we can over and see if there were any problems to avoid in the future.
What you describe is not really typical, it might have been excessive shedding, either way lets try to figure that out.

And to answer to your question, yes they love company of their own.

[Lija]

Those are the questions.



1-size of enclosure
2-# on inhabitants - specifically ( if there is another frog ---size differences ?)
3-humidity
4-temp
5-water - type - for both misting and soaking dish
6-materials used for substrate
7-enclosure set up i.e. plants( live or artificial) wood, bark etc -how were things prepared prior to being put into the viv
8-main food source
9-vitamins and calcium ? ( how often )
10-lighting
11-what is, specifically, being used to maintain the temperature of the enclosure
12-when is the last time he ate
13-have you found poop lately
14-a pic would be great ( including the frog ) any little cell phone pic is fine
15- how old is the frog
16-how long have you owned him
17- is the frog wild caught or captive bred
18- frog food- how often and if its diverse what other feeders are used as treats
19- about how often the frog is handled
20-is the enclosure is kept in a high or low traffic area


If I have left anything out, please feel free to chime in !
Lynn -AND -- Thank You Grif !!!!!!!!

[Kay]

Hi,
So sorry to hear your frog died? Sad

I have never kept them? I'll do my best to get some questions going?
I'll PM someone who may know . Answering these questions may help ?

What were the temp and humidity settings. -- I don't remember (he died a year ago) but it would have been whatever settings were recommended. I monitored the thermometer and hygrometer constantly. His terrarium was on my snack bar and I'm always in the kitchen, so I watched him a lot.
Did you use a UVB ? Yes.
They really need a lot of space...what size enclosure was he in? He was in a ReptiBreeze terrarium 16 x 16 x 20. The man I bought him from said it would be adequate size. This had glass on four sides with a screen top.
They are very social....confirm...... he was alone, right? He was alone.
What substrate were you using? Coconut husk.
What was he eating? Did he hunt for his food or did you feed him? He hunted for and ate live crickets.
What supplements were you using? I don't remember any supplements. I would sprinkle calcium powder on the crickets.I realized afterwards that I may have been told things by the seller that were not accurate. It is hard for me to believe that someone would tell you anything you wanted to hear, just to make a sale of an animal. There was a lot he did not tell me about the frog's needs. I found out afterwards as I started reading about waxy frogs. He made it sound like you put it in terrarium, give it something to climb on, feed it crickets and that's it!
Best, Lynn

​Thank you for your help, Lynn!

[Kay]

So sorry for your loss

lots of things can have been gone wrong here. Is the frog in your avatar the one you lost Yes, when first got him. He was supposed to be two months old.
would you have pics of your frog? I do have others pictures. Most of them are like my avatar. I probably have a couple at night time pictures.
Would you please answer questions of the trouble in the enclosure. This way we can over and see if there were any problems to avoid in the future.
What you describe is not really typical, it might have been excessive shedding, either way lets try to figure that out.

And to answer to your question, yes they love company of their own.

​I gave information about the enclosure in the first reply. If you need additional information, please let me know.

[Lija]

That is not waxy in your avatar, it is a bit too small and blurry but it looks like Ph tomopterna or tiger leg monkey frog. Waxy frogs Ph sauvagii are different and need completely different environment. I just wanted to clarify, so if you have more pics it would be great.

[Kay]

Those are the questions.



1-size of enclosure 16 x 16 x 20
2-# on inhabitants - specifically ( if there is another frog ---size differences ?) he was alone
3-humidity I don't remember the #s for this and question 4; however, they were what they were supposed to be b/c I monitored the thermometer and hygrometer often. I knew at the time what the humdity and temperature where supposed to be.
4-temp
5-water - type - for both misting and soaking dish distilled water
6-materials used for substrate coconut husk
7-enclosure set up i.e. plants( live or artificial) wood, bark etc -how were things prepared prior to being put into the viv - live plants, and I used the Exo-Terra Jungle Vine for all his climbing. I would just have opened the packages and put them in the terrarium.
8-main food source live crickets
9-vitamins and calcium ? ( how often )I don't remember any vitamins or calcium. I would have put calcium on the crickets he ate.
10-lighting a UV bulb
11-what is, specifically, being used to maintain the temperature of the enclosure I also used a basking bulb that gave off heat. If the temperature starting rising, I would remove it.
12-when is the last time he ate he had eaten the night before
13-have you found poop lately there was poop in his terrarium when he died. i would clean it out weekly.
14-a pic would be great ( including the frog ) any little cell phone pic is fine my avatar is a picture of him. I have other pictures too.
15- how old is the frog He was about 15 months old when he died
16-how long have you owned him I owned him for one year when he died
17- is the frog wild caught or captive breed captive bred; I bought him at a Repticon show
18- frog food- how often and if its diverse what other feeders are used as treat At the time he died he was eating every other day. He only ate crickets. However, if there was some type of work he ate, I would have given him some of those too from time to time. He died over a year ago, so it is hard for me to remembers these details.
19- about how often the frog is handled I probably only handled him for the picture in the avatar
20-is the enclosure is kept in a high or low traffic area my kitchen snack bar, with me in the area all the time.


If I have left anything out, please feel free to chime in !
Lynn -AND -- Thank You Grif !!!!!!!!

Thank you for your help. If you need any other information, let me know.

[Kay]

That is not waxy in your avatar, it is a bit too small and blurry but it looks like Ph tomopterna or tiger leg monkey frog. Waxy frogs Ph sauvagii are different and need completely different environment. I just wanted to clarify, so if you have more pics it would be great.

The man who sold it to me said it was a monkey tree frog indigenous to Paraguay. Later someone told me that a monkey tree frog and a waxy tree frog were the same. I saw him spreading something on his body. It was if he was coating his body with something and I read that waxy tree frogs do that. Whatever substance came out of his body (before he died) was a white, opague, gooey substance. I will get the pictures and post them.

[Kay]

This is him sitting in his water bowl at night. Sorry it is turned sideways, but I cannot figure out how to rotate it. I will have to transfer some pictures, but I have more I will post.

[Kay]

These are all around the same time. The one on the right is the same as my avatar but I thought it might come out clearer. I see I did have some wood -- it would be oak and I would have soaked it in very hot water before I used it.

[DigitalPunk]

I saw him spreading something on his body.

He could of been shedding. When frogs shed they rub their front legs and back legs on their body to help with the shedding.

From a google search I would say he was a Monkey frog, but I can't be sure. He doesn't look like a Waxy to me.

[poison]

Yeah thats a waxy sauvagii

I can see why Lija would think other wise though. Never seen a sauvagii with orange on it. And I've seen lots of babies. Or at least I've never noticed it.

[poison]

The man who sold it to me said it was a monkey tree frog indigenous to Paraguay. Later someone told me that a monkey tree frog and a waxy tree frog were the same.

Just to clarify. Pretty much all of the species in the genus "Phyllomedusa" are commonly referred to as "monkey tree frogs". Not all monkey frogs are waxy's.

Tiger leg monkey tree frog

Super tiger leg monkey tree frog

Giant waxy monkey tree frog

Waxy monkey tree frog

And there are lots of others.

[Lija]

Nope, that is not sauvagii the frog looks like sauvagii in second and third pic, but last pic clearly shows it is not, sauvagii dont have any orange color anywhere. I would like to see clear shot that would show belly and legs stretched, but from what i see here it looks like phyllomedusa vaillanti or white lined leaf monkey frog. It also smaller then sauvagii should be.

One way or another it is too late for him now if you would want to get another we sure can help you set up everything for him.

[poison]

Nope, that is not sauvagii the frog looks like sauvagii in second and third pic, but last pic clearly shows it is not, sauvagii dont have any orange color anywhere. I would like to see clear shot that would show belly and legs stretched, but from what i see here it looks like phyllomedusa vaillanti or white lined leaf monkey frog. It also smaller then sauvagii should be.

One way or another it is too late for him now if you would want to get another we sure can help you set up everything for him.

Not saying you're wrong but I'm seeing a sauvagii.

This frog doesn't have the spike like crests going down the sides of its body that vaillanti's have. Its also has the toe pads like a sauvagii and not the wide tree frog pads that most have.

[Lija]

Ill be damned MReady_PHYM106.jpg | Michael Ready - Photographs

you are probably right, but i have never seen or heard of waxy with any amount of orange, so i dismissed it as possibility completely without looking for other things. Im gonna go into deep research on a matter, orange, hm. This is really weird, even just out the water babies are all green, can it be locality?

kay more pics?

[Kay]

Daniel, I would have said the frog was 100% green. I did not notice the orange until I posted these pictures.

Lija, I will look for more pictures but I doubt there will be any showing his full belly or with his legs spread. It is too late for him, but I wanted to find out if I had done something wrong. I am interested in getting another tree frog. I would like to be able to use the terrarium I had for this one -- 16 x 16 x 20. It is all glass except for the screen top. An alternative would be a 16 x 16 x 20 all screen cage. I just got a veiled chameleon and it will be in this cage for the next seven months. I will then have to purchase a much larger one, so I could use this smaller screen cage.

If y'all could recommend another type of frog, I could start reading up on it (and asking y'all questions) before I get it (or them if I need more than one). If it matters, I live along the Gulf Coast in northwest Florida. We have high humidity here, but the frog would be indoors and temperature controlled. Maybe a beginner frog would be best, since I must have done something to kill the first one. I've also had three firebelly toads for three years. I adopted a fire belly toad that had a neurological deficit and had to be hand fed. He lived a lot longer than they thought he would.

Any suggestions would be welcome. I just don't want to kill another frog.

[poison]

Key, look into whites tree frogs. They make great beginner frogs and my fav frog species. I would stay away from Indonesian whites though as most are WC. If you can go with Australian whites tree frogs. Those are CB. These frogs are fat, cute and active. Your cage is a bit small for an adult whites. I would look into a 20G for 1-2 adult whites.

[Kay]

By 20G do you mean a 20 gallon aquarium? I have a 20 long and I could make it vertical. All the sides would be glass but I would make the front all screen. What do you mean when you say the Austrailan whites are CB?