New to frogs and have question about Pacmans

[cjbage]

First off thank you all for having such wonderful information, I have been reading the forums for days now weeding out all of the bad info that I obtained from researching these particular frogs from other places around the web, so much varying info. I do have a question concerning the quarantining of this type of animal. As this will be my first foray into frog keeping I wanted something that would be fairly good for a beginner.

I understand obtaining a baby or a juvenile is common and as such should be kept in a smaller enclosure similar to a pet keeper ( 17.5" L X 12" W X 6.88" H is this size I was looking at ) until it reaches approximately 3.5" in length then moved to its permanent residence. My question is this, when reading the posting on quarantine it is mainly geared toward tree frogs or non burrowing frogs, should I still set up with paper towels on the bottom or should I set up with eco-earth as I would in the permanent tank? Please excuse me if this has been posted elsewhere I have been going page by page in the sub-forum and may have just missed it.

I am still in the researching stage at this time so haven't purchased anything yet. Will be looking to set up with purchases of equipment and so forth in the spring to see exactly what I will need to maintain for temperature / humidity in the room until it is stable then decide if I want to take the chance on a store purchased frog or try and find a breeder in the North Carolina area that I can look at and buy from. I am not crazy about the idea of shipping to this area, as the delivery people.. USPS, Fed Ex, or UPS are all unreliable and don't seem to understand what Fragile means and would hate to see if they know what Live Animal means.

Thanks again

[Mentat]

Hello and welcome to FF! Since Pacmans are kept alone and in simple set-ups; you do not need to keep them in paper towels initially. Still, you have to perform a quarantine and not share anything between the new frog and others. Guess this does not applies to you, just letting you know in case get another frog. Always wash hands with soap and hot water before and after feeding and maintenance.

If a baby (1-2 in.) the pet keeper you are describing is too big. Something like an ExoTerra medium Breeding Box (around 12x8x6 in.) is better. Only thing you need there is shredded coco substrate (around 1 in.), a water dish (cleaned daily), and a silk plant. You can then place the whole thing inside it's future larger home and control that to 82F and 70-80% humidity. There are several options for heating; myself prefer a ceramic heat emitter in a built in dimmer dome fixture. With aluminum foil blocking most of ventilation; couple sprays a day will help maintain proper humidity levels.

Shredded coco should be mixed with dechlorinated tap water (recommend Seachem Prime) until damp and clumps in fist; but does not drip water out. Insects should be same as distance between frogs eyes. For dusting, can follow these schedules: http://www.frogforum.net/food-feeder...schedules.html.

Good luck and make sure you read this: Frog Forum - Pacman and Horned Frogs - Ceratophrys - Care and Breeding !

[cjbage]

Thank you very much, I have bookmarked the links you provided for future reference, I do have one more question if you don't mind, more to clarify my understanding of feeding, I have seen to feed them with earthworms ( not red wrigglers ) and also dubia roaches, so I am assuming with alternating them would be good as long as I cut up the worm to the appropriate length and choose the right size roaches? or should I not give it roaches until it is larger and just find crickets of the right size at a local petco/petsmart as the local small chains in the rural area I live in are geared to cats/dogs/birds... ok so more then one question but its sort of related lol.. is it safe to try and "train" them for the tongs ( soft tipped ones ) from the beginning or is that something I should wait for until I have had it for a bit and it has become more comfortable with interaction ?

[Lija]

No you can try to tongs right away, especially if a baby have been fed like that before ( ask), and foods he is used to eating. Some are used to crickets and might get scared if you go with roaches or nightcrawlers, some wont care of anything as long it is in front of its face, finger would do too


it is ok to ship them, just make sure they come from reliable breeder or company.

[cjbage]

No you can try to tongs right away, especially if a baby have been fed like that before ( ask), and foods he is used to eating. Some are used to crickets and might get scared if you go with roaches or nightcrawlers, some wont care of anything as long it is in front of its face, finger would do too


it is ok to ship them, just make sure they come from reliable breeder or company.

Thanks very much for the info.

It's not so much worry about the breeders since I would go with one recommended from here, it's the delivery people in my area. Let me give examples,

UPS delivery of a $300 set of dishes, they used the box as a step stool, all of the contents were broken with clear boot prints on the outer box.
USPS delivery of medications that should have been brought to the door was found in the middle of the road by the neighbor that almost ran over them and he's the one that brought them up to me.
Fed-EX home delivery dumped packages of electronics down next the road in the yard then had them marked in the delivery area as brought to the front door, after spending 15 min running around the front of the house, back and sides of the house including my car port that's where I finally found the box.

That's the normal delivery of my stuff lol. If it can't fit in my letter box heaven only knows where I will find it and in what condition.

[Lija]

I would ship to fedex hub to hold for pick up then and be there as soon as package arrives.

[Mentat]

You can feed roaches as long as they are smaller than distance between frog's eyes. Only problem with Dubias is that they will quickly burrow if not feed from tongs. A diet of Dubias and night crawlers is fine.

Lija's idea of having the animals shipped to the local hub is very good. Most frog dealers actually prefer that, since the animals will be at a controlled weather building until you sign for them. FEDEX is usually better than UPS when it comes to shipping live animals. If you have the means to pick up the package (arrives usually early AM) at the hub myself would go for it .

[limnologist]

I have to Argentine Pacmans, I have found a very simple set-up to suit them perfectly. I keep mine in plastic shoeboxes with holes melted into the top (i used a soldering iron) and paper towels as a substrate. I have a small bowl for water for my younger frog (the older one doesnt like sitting in water) and have an under tank heater. I place the boxes on top of each other and switch them out regularly, and I feed them superworms, mealworms, waxworms, crickets, goldfish, spiders, and any other live pest i find in or on my house :P . I trained them to eat from my hand, so they are very easy to feed.....and very fat lol. anyway, my advice is: stay simple, more decor is more work and your frogs dont care for fancy decor as long as they can dig and they also dont care to be disturbed much when your cleaning your tanks stuff. These frogs are the coolest, most interesting, most beautiful frogs ever! (says me) they make great pets.!

[Mentat]

I have to Argentine Pacmans, I have found a very simple set-up to suit them perfectly. I keep mine in plastic shoeboxes with holes melted into the top (i used a soldering iron) and paper towels as a substrate. I have a small bowl for water for my younger frog (the older one doesnt like sitting in water) and have an under tank heater. I place the boxes on top of each other and switch them out regularly, and I feed them superworms, mealworms, waxworms, crickets, goldfish, spiders, and any other live pest i find in or on my house :P . I trained them to eat from my hand, so they are very easy to feed.....and very fat lol. anyway, my advice is: stay simple, more decor is more work and your frogs dont care for fancy decor as long as they can dig and they also dont care to be disturbed much when your cleaning your tanks stuff. These frogs are the coolest, most interesting, most beautiful frogs ever! (says me) they make great pets.!

Hello and welcome to FF! Don't understand how do you keep Pacman's on paper towels with a source of heat underneath them and one of them without a water dish. What temperature and humidity parameters are maintained in the plastic shoeboxes?

Feeding your frogs a high fat diet (goldfish, superworms, mealworms, and waxworms) and pests you find in your house is not the healthiest nutrition for them. Here is some more info about their care: Frog Forum - Pacman and Horned Frogs - Ceratophrys - Care and Breeding. Good luck .

[cjbage]

Thanks for the helpful info, I hope you all don't mind but I have another question. Do these guys do better where there is little to no "traffic" like a bedroom area or will they be ok in an area like a living room, giving 3 sides of the tank is covered etc and usually fairly quiet. Sorry to be such a bother but trying to find what would be a good location for the perm. tank to be set up.

[Hypnotic]

I would suggest the bedroom. All of mine are in my bedroom. I've recently recieved a frog from my friend, he was in her living room and doing poorly due to the high traffic. Offcourse all frogs are different, but it's better to be safe.

[cjbage]

I would suggest the bedroom. All of mine are in my bedroom. I've recently recieved a frog from my friend, he was in her living room and doing poorly due to the high traffic. Offcourse all frogs are different, but it's better to be safe.

Thank you very much, really appreciate the help everyone is giving me.

[limnologist]

Hello and welcome to FF! Don't understand how do you keep Pacman's on paper towels with a source of heat underneath them and one of them without a water dish. What temperature and humidity parameters are maintained in the plastic shoeboxes?

Feeding your frogs a high fat diet (goldfish, superworms, mealworms, and waxworms) and pests you find in your house is not the healthiest nutrition for them. Here is some more info about their care: Frog Forum - Pacman and Horned Frogs - Ceratophrys - Care and Breeding. Good luck .

the paper towels are always moist, the one without a water dish just doesnt like water for some reason (ive had it for three years) they are always at 80 degrees with 85% or so humidity.

The goldfish contain high levels of calcium, the waxworms fatten the frogs for breeding (i breed a lot of frogs) the mealworms and superworms are for variety i live in a clean, natural place, so the wild insects (crickets and grasshoppers) are pesticide free, the other "pests" are large ants, cabbage caterpillars, wild moths, earthworms, and sow bugs. btw, i breed my own goldfish so they are extra nourishing