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Thread: Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

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    Default Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    Update. She is pooping little by little every night (i dont know how much but her water bowl has been very dirty every morning). She is eating small meals every night with reptaboost. I have been giving nightcrawler chunks about a third inch long. Tonight was her first calcium dust night since before her impaction ( tomorrow will be back to repta boost, then vitamins the day after) . She takes the food from tongs a littlebit quicker than I would like, I literally have no time to react. Also her tounge is shooting out unlike before. I think she will be okay, but we arnt in the clear till we see the big poop log.

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    Also her color has lightened up to a teal color agian. And she doesnt have the hard lump on her right side anymore.

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    Hypnotic
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    Default Re: Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    Really great to hear she's doing better!

  5. #4

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    She is doing much better now. Nothing is worse than comming into a room and seeing your frog belly up in a soak tub. I suspect electrolyte poisoning from the pedialyte ( along with the stress from her first soak). I did the 1:10 ratio, but I'm thinking that might have been too much for such a small frog. If she pulls through completely I'm thinking about a name change... something about overcomming possible deadly conditions. My daughter is calling been her Little Mojo last couple days.

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    Moderator GrifTheGreat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    Quote Originally Posted by danfrog View Post
    She is doing much better now. Nothing is worse than comming into a room and seeing your frog belly up in a soak tub. I suspect electrolyte poisoning from the pedialyte ( along with the stress from her first soak). I did the 1:10 ratio, but I'm thinking that might have been too much for such a small frog. If she pulls through completely I'm thinking about a name change... something about overcomming possible deadly conditions. My daughter is calling been her Little Mojo last couple days.
    Dan electrolytes do not poison you or frogs. Electrolyte imbalances yes, but Pedialyte is designed to balance out electrolytes in the body not cause an imbalance. Calcium is actually an electrolyte in itself. Flipping over is a sign of severe stress which is most likely from all the handling not from the Pedialyte. If it was actually mixed at a 1 to 10 ratio there would be no possible way to cause damage even if the electrolytes were able to cause the frog to Tox Out.


  7. #6

    Default Re: Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    I don't know too much about electrolytes and frogs and I do not deny that my froggy was super stressed at the time. Im a soldier in the U.S. Army and we spend many hours in the open sun working. We are well educated on the importance being properly hydrated to avoid heat injuries. I have seen other soldiers drink nothing but Poweraids and Gatorades in the summer heat instead of water and end up in the hospital from electrolyte poisoning. Too much electrolytes are just as dangerous as not enough. But then agian, I can't really compare humans and frogs lol.

    What I'm thinking is there should be two more factors in the pedialyte ratio. Time soaked and size of the frog. Im just not 100 percent sure the 1:10 ratio is correct. This is a picture of Gingerbead seconds after I found her belly up. Notice her arms, they were stiff as a board.

    As I said before I don't know enough about frogs. And this is just me thinking aloud. Im just in it for the frogs, and want everyone's frog to be as healthy as can be. What all do you guys think?

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    And by all means. If I'm wrong please educate me and correct me so I don't steer people in the wrong direction.

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    I knew I shouldn't have started this thread. Things took a turn for the worst this morning. Gingerbread is suffering now. She is leaning over on her side and going in circles, she doesnt have much time left here. She was doing so much better too. Not sure what I should do.

  10. #9

    Default Re: Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    Took her out for a soak and she pooped this out. I decided that since she a week to destress that I would soak her. She pooped this out. But the leaning to the side has me worried now.
    She is back in her enclosure.

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    Moderator GrifTheGreat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    I'm not saying that too much of a good thing isn't bad and yes if drinking a electrolyte solution you MUST combine it with water otherwise you are just causing more harm and not hydrating yourself. The 1 ounce to 10 ounce soultion is very weak so it should do no harm, but if you feel this is the cause then stop using the Pedialyte. Stress can cause many problems with these frogs and even people. They can easily have a stroke from it.

    Now no more baths. Let her be and keep her calm. Feed her and once or twice a week soak her in her own dish of plain water. Sounds like she may have had a stroke and has developed a neurological disorder. This may heal itself in time, but some do not ever recover. As long as she will eat she may make it.


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    Moderator GrifTheGreat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    You know Dan. I've given this some thought and it could be electrolyte toxicity. Stop dusting with the Repta Boost and no more Pedialyte soaks. The Repta Boost has a lot of electrolytes as well, but a light dusting shouldn't have caused this. She may just be weak and so this has taken its tole on her.


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    Moderator Mentat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    Quote Originally Posted by danfrog View Post
    Took her out for a soak and she pooped this out. I decided that since she a week to destress that I would soak her. She pooped this out. But the leaning to the side has me worried now. She is back in her enclosure.
    Quote Originally Posted by GrifTheGreat View Post
    ...The 1 ounce to 10 ounce soultion is very weak so it should do no harm, but if you feel this is the cause then stop using the Pedialyte. Stress can cause many problems with these frogs and even people. They can easily have a stroke from it.

    Now no more baths. Let her be and keep her calm. Feed her and once or twice a week soak her in her own dish of plain water. Sounds like she may have had a stroke and has developed a neurological disorder. This may heal itself in time, but some do not ever recover. As long as she will eat she may make it.
    Hi Dan! I'm so sorry Gingerbread suddenly got worse ! Just imagine how stressed she and you are with this turn of events. Yes, do follow your gut feeling on this one and stop the Pedialyte baths. If you keep her substrate a bit more moist than normal, she won't need the water baths so much either and maybe get some rest from all the handling for a few days. If you do so; might need to increase substrate change to once a week or so.

    Agree with Colleen/Jerrod to also stop the Repta Boost. Would only dust CA/D3 and vitamins on a normal schedule.

    As long as frog is eating, there is always a chance or recovery, even if some minor neuro damage remains. I survived two TIA's last year and it took some time; but the fumbling of things on hands and loss of balance went away. Good luck !
    Remember to take care of the enclosure and it will take care of your frog !​

  14. #13

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    I stopped the pedialyte in her soak dish, and won't reptaboost. One good thing is about her is she is a great eater. Usually soon as I put a worm in her face she attacks it. Ill put her back on regular feeding schedule. Do the multivitamins have electrolytes? If so I should probably hold off on those. I only took her out this morning and soaked her because I saw she was all lop sided like her front arm stopped working and wanted to inspect her, that's when she kept going in circles. After a while though she calmed down and went poop a little. Agian thanks for the help everyone.

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    Moderator GrifTheGreat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    Quote Originally Posted by danfrog View Post
    I stopped the pedialyte in her soak dish, and won't reptaboost. One good thing is about her is she is a great eater. Usually soon as I put a worm in her face she attacks it. Ill put her back on regular feeding schedule. Do the multivitamins have electrolytes? If so I should probably hold off on those. I only took her out this morning and soaked her because I saw she was all lop sided like her front arm stopped working and wanted to inspect her, that's when she kept going in circles. After a while though she calmed down and went poop a little. Agian thanks for the help everyone.
    Yes multivitamins have electrolytes. I would hold off on the calcium and multivitamins because calcium is an electrolyte

    Maybe for a week to see if she flushes some whatever is causing this out of her system.


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    Will do.

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    Default Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    Hi Danfrog,

    I am sorry this is happening to your frog. Lets take a step back and reevaluate.

    The flipping over is a sure sign of stress. Try and keep things calm and quiet with minimal hands on. Only as necessary.

    The spinning I have encountered with a few of my friends' frogs over time....

    My buddy's frog does this when he eats too much. He will spin around and lean to one side (almost always to the right). He acts almost as though he has a belly ache. He says his frog stops after he finally poops. ? Gas pains ?

    My bullfrog leaned to one side and occasionally spun around when he had an ear infection, though in this case, not applicable. Fluid in tympanum = vertigo and dizziness.

    And, yes, the third thought is neurological....whether it be stroke related or deficiency/toxicity. Being we can't do a CAT/CT scan, we will have to monitor his symptoms. The arms straight out is concerning. It generally signifies a calcium deficiency. Being the treatments you have provided, this is highly unlikely. There is calcium in reptaboost, some in mvi's and of course in calcium supplements.

    This is only an educated guess, but I'll throw it out there....

    My guess is stress combined with abdominal cramping from vitamin overload and neurological symptoms from high vitamin levels.

    Both Grif and Mentat are accurate...in a normal, healthy, properly hydrated frog that has good kidneys and liver function, the frog should be able to regulate the vitamins and electrolytes if provided in proper doses and if provided with a water bowl and proper humidity.

    IF accurate...
    minimizing stress, gently setting the frog in a regular dechlorinated water water-bowl soak in his own tank (and not to worry if he gets out...just let him. Set him in after you feed him.), providing 80% humidity and nice moist substrate (moistened with dechlorinated water), and going back to a regular feeding schedule of only soft foods such as night crawler or earthworm pieces (easy to digest) with a usual calcium/vita D3 and mvi schedule, he should level out and be fine. Start the next feeding with no supplements.

    If you keep us posted on his symptoms we will know easier and can continue to guide you. We can guide you as to when to restart his mvi and Ca/D3 depending on his symptoms and/or resolution of symptoms.

    Try not to get too worked up when caring for him, even though I know it's hard. They can feel your stress.

    Hoping he does okay for you tonight! I'll be waiting to hear and will follow this post along with Grif and Mentat.

    Good luck!
    Last edited by Heatheranne; September 2nd, 2013 at 11:08 PM.
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    Default Re: Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    I just jump in real quick about pedyalite, sorry didn't have time to read everything, but I really hope everything is gonna be all right.

    Every single frog medicine textbook says to use undiluted pedyalite, same thing is stated in all notes from exotic vet. Conferences that I have available to access and same thing a saying all exotic vets that I communicate with. I have a few new ones reference books coming in soon from Europe, will see what in there.
    My gut says to use caution and dilute according to the state a frog is in. But I would love to further discuss the issue, it is on my list to do as soon as I deal with urgent stuff I have now.
    Save one animal and it doesn't change the world, but it surely changes the world for that one animal!

  19. #18

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    She ate a small nightcrawler piece last night. She is still leaning to one side though, although this morning she was more propped up. All movements I do are very slow and quiet. She is pooping little by little. Should I gently place her in her soak dish when I get off work today? I kinda don't want to give any vitamins and calcium for a few days at least. This poor frog is having tons of health issues. I'm thinking the spinning is from a belly ache and maybe some neuro damage. I wish I could give her the same treatments as an adult frog, its like how do you treat and frog you cant really treat. That would make things so much easier. Her arms arnt stiff anymore either. She was using both of them to get her worm chunk into her mouth last night. Ill get a picture of her tonight and post it here. I keep forgetting to.

  20. #19

    Default Re: Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    Here are the pics. Man I feel so bad. This frog is such a fighter. I wish she would be okay. I know she is hurting.

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    100+ Post Member Louis Charles Bruckner's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gingerbread. Impaction survivor.

    At this point in time I would only do just water changes in the dish make sure everything is clean.
    Feed what it will eat no extra supplements or anything at this point in time and just keep your fingers crossed.

    When these frogs are so young they're very resilient and they have incredible healing abilities so it may recover just keep your fingers crossed and don't lose hope.
    You're doing the best you can do by limiting stress.
    And making sure all the conditions are correct for it, I.E temperature humidity.
    Covering all sides might be a good thing to do until it is well.

    It using both its arms to push food into its mouth is a very good sign.

    Best wishes for you and your little one I know it's stressful for both.



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