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Thread: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

  1. #1
    Froggle
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    Talking Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Hi everyone, I've never owned a frog before or anything similar so want to make sure I have everything right before buying the little guy. I've wanted one for years but having bought my own place and settled down I thought now would be a great time to go for it.

    I bought and set up the following today:

    - An Exo Terra Vivarium (45x45x30cm - WxDxH)
    - Coco Fibre Substrate
    - Heat mat with thermostat
    - Hygrometer
    - Thermometer
    - Water dish
    - Hide/House thing (this was free with the other stuff, I have no idea if its suitable at all so some help would be appreciated)

    1. I'm planning on getting some plants along with the PacMan, is there a specific type that's best/safest? Or should I start out with plastic plants?
    2. How moist should the Substrate be? Will I need to re-wet the Substrate at certain intervals?
    3. I know my tank is quite big but will this be a problem for the little guy?

    I know about temperatures, humidity, food, vitamins and treating water.

    Am I forgetting anything else?

    Here are some pictures to make things clearer:











    Thanks for taking the time to read - Matt

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  3. #2
    Moderator Lija's Avatar
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    welcome to the frog forum! so glad you are setting up before actually getting it, what kind( species/color) are you getting, i hope you could post pics when you have it, we LOVE pics here

    now about your set up, everything looks good, expect a few things, the enclosure itself is way too big if you are getting a baby, my VERY big female ornate living in exactly same tank. a baby will just get scared of big space = won't eat = big problems. i suggest you get medium sized plastic critter keeper for now and when it is adult sized ( can easily be in 3-4 month) transfer him/her to that one. plastic keeper is a very useful thing to have handy at all the time, for bath, for transporting, just for when you clean the tank.
    make sure you cover all 3 sides with something that is not see through ( fish tank background is very nice to use), place your heat pad on a side of the tank ( never on a bottom) keep substrate moist at all the time but not mud like.
    when you are gonna use your tank i must say it is very hard to keep humidity on a level it needs to be in low hight tanks, you gotta cover 3/4 of the lid with plastic wrap or foil, i used leftovers of fish tank background to tape to the lid on one of my tanks. You will also need to cover 2 sides that are not covered for that tank, that hide is snake hide, adult frog won't fit his butt in there lol you can get some sorts of handing plants ( i like silk plants the best, but you can go with any artificial ones) you can use one of those fern bush plastic ones too, it will create a hide for a frog and look naturalistic, live plants won't survive in the amount of waste these guys make, live plants don't like low light conditions that are needed for pacs and i don't think they'd appreciate much you taking everything apart once a month for cleaning.
    did i cover it all?
    Save one animal and it doesn't change the world, but it surely changes the world for that one animal!

  4. #3

    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    If you do really want live plants, I suggest maybe golden pothos? Those plants can survive almost anything in my experience, works good as both a wall or ground cover. You could also try air plants such as orchids or tillandsias, mount em on the background
    "Those among us who are keepers (yes, I am one) owe each and every animal, be their cost mere pennies or thousands of dollars, the best of conditions and care. Research each species before acquisition, and then acquire only those that you can care for adequately and with relative ease." - Richard Bartlett



  5. #4
    Froggle
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lija View Post
    welcome to the frog forum! so glad you are setting up before actually getting it, what kind( species/color) are you getting, i hope you could post pics when you have it, we LOVE pics here

    now about your set up, everything looks good, expect a few things, the enclosure itself is way too big if you are getting a baby, my VERY big female ornate living in exactly same tank. a baby will just get scared of big space = won't eat = big problems. i suggest you get medium sized plastic critter keeper for now and when it is adult sized ( can easily be in 3-4 month) transfer him/her to that one. plastic keeper is a very useful thing to have handy at all the time, for bath, for transporting, just for when you clean the tank.
    make sure you cover all 3 sides with something that is not see through ( fish tank background is very nice to use), place your heat pad on a side of the tank ( never on a bottom) keep substrate moist at all the time but not mud like.
    when you are gonna use your tank i must say it is very hard to keep humidity on a level it needs to be in low hight tanks, you gotta cover 3/4 of the lid with plastic wrap or foil, i used leftovers of fish tank background to tape to the lid on one of my tanks. You will also need to cover 2 sides that are not covered for that tank, that hide is snake hide, adult frog won't fit his butt in there lol you can get some sorts of handing plants ( i like silk plants the best, but you can go with any artificial ones) you can use one of those fern bush plastic ones too, it will create a hide for a frog and look naturalistic, live plants won't survive in the amount of waste these guys make, live plants don't like low light conditions that are needed for pacs and i don't think they'd appreciate much you taking everything apart once a month for cleaning.
    did i cover it all?
    Quote Originally Posted by Jerah Teoh Yong Qiang View Post
    If you do really want live plants, I suggest maybe golden pothos? Those plants can survive almost anything in my experience, works good as both a wall or ground cover. You could also try air plants such as orchids or tillandsias, mount em on the background

    Thanks for the replies . I'm not sure on the species yet as they have a selection but I'll definitely post pictures as soon as possible!

    Awww okay I don't want the scare the froglet so I'll do as you said and get a critter keeper for now like you suggested. The humidity is currently at about 82% but i'll keep an eye on things, I've got some cling film(saran wrap) ready in case it's hard to keep up anyway . I'll give the hide to my friend and get something else thats more suitable. I assumed keeping real plants in the tank would be better for the frog but based on what you've said I'll just go for the plastic stuff for now.

    How often am I supposed to clean the entire tank out and change all the substrate by the way ?


    Thanks - Matt

  6. #5
    100+ Post Member Louis Charles Bruckner's Avatar
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    First of all,
    Welcome tot he forum.

    With packs I do spot cleaning like using cat litter.
    and every month or so a complete change out might be needed.
    Your nose will tell you. Normally moist, Not wet coco fiber will
    have a slight musty odor. Now when it becomes overloaded with
    foggy waists it will not smell as good and will need to be changed.

    When I have to do a complete change of the coco fiber.
    I prepare a 80F de-chlorinated water bath in a plastic tub and wrap a towel around the out side of the tub
    so it will help keep the heat in and help calm the frog. If the sides are greater than 6 inches tall a 2 to 3 in or smaller frog
    can't jump out.
    Then I remove the water dish and any ornaments. I have several smooth river rocks that are under the ceramic heat element.
    they act as heat capacitors the absorb heat and slowly release it to help stabilize heat levels in the terrarium.

    Then I use a small wet dry vacuum to remove the coco fiber. It really makes quick work of it.

    Then I use hot de-chlorinated water (warmed up in a microwave) to wipe out the bottom.

    And use the remainder of the warm water to hydrate the new coco fiber just so it clumps when you compress some in your hand.

    Replace all the ornaments, Check the temp and humidity and make sure they are ok for the frog.
    Then put the frog back in and watch it hop around a bit and find a new spot to burrow in and wait for food.



  7. #6
    100+ Post Member GRABibus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Is the mat the white part on the left rioght side of the terrarium (On the left part of the picture) ?
    If it is a UTH on the side, be careful that with spraying, it can create a thermal shock which can break the glass of the terrarium.
    If it is under the tank, it is not good.
    1.0.0 Ceratophrys ornata CB
    0.1.0 Pleurodeles waltl CB
    1.0.0 Pyxicephalus adspersus CB



  8. #7
    Froggle
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Thanks again for the replies all information noted down . The heat mat isn't attached to anything at the moment, I was however going to put it on the bottom at one side, so one half of the tank is cooler than the other so the frog can cool down.

    Matt

  9. #8
    100+ Post Member GRABibus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Ok.
    Monitor the temperatures before getting the frog, because you must check taht your cool area is not too cool and that your warm area is not too warm.
    It depends on the size of the terrarium, the mat power and the room temperature.
    You must get 77F at the opossite of the mat (Cold area) and you can try to get 82.4F on the side where there is the mat (Warm area).
    Sometimes heat mates only heat 2cm around where they are sticked and it could be that the opoosite is not warmed at all.
    Don't forget also that spraying water on a side of the terrarium where the heat mat is mounted can make it broken (Thermal schock).
    1.0.0 Ceratophrys ornata CB
    0.1.0 Pleurodeles waltl CB
    1.0.0 Pyxicephalus adspersus CB



  10. #9
    Moderator Lija's Avatar
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerah Teoh Yong Qiang View Post
    If you do really want live plants, I suggest maybe golden pothos? Those plants can survive almost anything in my experience, works good as both a wall or ground cover. You could also try air plants such as orchids or tillandsias, mount em on the background
    my waxies managed to kill pothos and they are not close to the size of adult pacman lol
    when i read your post lol i was imagining how fast my very big girl (6"+) would ruin ground cover lol sorry can't stop laughing, she is a tank literally, have to post pic of her rearranged tank.

    as for the cleaning and having dealt with i had to i don't suggest for anyone to wait until they smell something, etc, sometimes it is too late then.
    cleaning should look like that:
    done every month!
    1. you take frog out, place him in a nice water bath ( they'll enjoy it or not)
    2. you take everything out- plants, decor and wash it with very very hot water, let it dry.
    3. you take the substrate out completely
    4. you wash the tank from outside and inside, remove all water deposits from a walls ( blade scrapper works wonders), disinfect your tank ( i use "wipe off" lately, but you can use any other disinfectant), then rinse it off well, then i use terrarium cleaner by zilla for the walls http://www.amazon.com/Zilla-Terrariu.../dp/B001F9ATFG that stuff leaves your glass sparkly clean, water residue is not accumulating as fast after you use it.
    5. you put a new substrate in, then everything else to the exact spots where it use to be, make sure you make a hole for a frog where it used to be. They hate any changes and will show you most likely just how much after you put them back lol.
    6. put a frog in his water dish. done! time to move on to the next tank ( that's for me), i do it every first sunday of the month lol full day project usually for the amount of tanks i have.
    Save one animal and it doesn't change the world, but it surely changes the world for that one animal!

  11. #10

    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lija View Post
    my waxies managed to kill pothos and they are not close to the size of adult pacman lol
    when i read your post lol i was imagining how fast my very big girl (6"+) would ruin ground cover lol sorry can't stop laughing, she is a tank literally, have to post pic of her rearranged tank.

    as for the cleaning and having dealt with i had to i don't suggest for anyone to wait until they smell something, etc, sometimes it is too late then.
    cleaning should look like that:
    done every month!
    1. you take frog out, place him in a nice water bath ( they'll enjoy it or not)
    2. you take everything out- plants, decor and wash it with very very hot water, let it dry.
    3. you take the substrate out completely
    4. you wash the tank from outside and inside, remove all water deposits from a walls ( blade scrapper works wonders), disinfect your tank ( i use "wipe off" lately, but you can use any other disinfectant), then rinse it off well, then i use terrarium cleaner by zilla for the walls Amazon.com: Zilla Terrarium Cleaner (8 oz.): Pet Supplies that stuff leaves your glass sparkly clean, water residue is not accumulating as fast after you use it.
    5. you put a new substrate in, then everything else to the exact spots where it use to be, make sure you make a hole for a frog where it used to be. They hate any changes and will show you most likely just how much after you put them back lol.
    6. put a frog in his water dish. done! time to move on to the next tank ( that's for me), i do it every first sunday of the month lol full day project usually for the amount of tanks i have.
    Whoaaaaa.... Those must be some real killer frogs you have! I'm envious.
    "Those among us who are keepers (yes, I am one) owe each and every animal, be their cost mere pennies or thousands of dollars, the best of conditions and care. Research each species before acquisition, and then acquire only those that you can care for adequately and with relative ease." - Richard Bartlett



  12. #11

    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Hi, I'm new too. But I would reccomend some sort of digital humidity/thermometer reader with a probe. Over the last couple weeks I having a hard time getting the temps and humidity levels correct and I believe its because of my analog reader. Just thought I'd let you know, newb to newb.

  13. #12
    Moderator GrifTheGreat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    I have to agree with danfrog here. Go with digital. They are far more accurate.

    Everyone has you covered.


  14. #13
    Froggle
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Hi everyone, sorry for the delay but I've been waiting for my new phone to turn up in the post so I could take a picture.

    Here's Boris:




    Does he look okay? Not sure exactly what type he is but think he's pretty standard from other peoples pictures I've seen.

    He's eaten two crickets since I got him on Friday but he hasn't eaten anything today and doesn't seem interested. Is this normal?

    Thanks - Matt

  15. #14
    100+ Post Member Louis Charles Bruckner's Avatar
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Boris may still getting use to the new surroundings so I wouldn't be too worried as of yet.

    My little one was the same, it didn't eat much to start off but now puts away 2 night crawlers plus a few dubia roach nymphs a day.

    Here is Pep one 18 days after I got it. it weighed 17 grams on 5-3-13
    in this pict it weighed 18g after 18 days and didn't eat much.
    Name:  05-21-13.jpg
Views: 302
Size:  93.7 KB


    Now it weighs 53g and has been eating very well.
    Name:  06-30-13.jpg
Views: 257
Size:  103.2 KB
    Still hasn't called and I am not convinced that it is a male yet.



  16. #15
    Froggle
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Here's two more pics if someone could identify Boris

    He's made his fresh water muddy!




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    Moderator GrifTheGreat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Ceratophrys cranwelli.


  18. #17
    Moderator Lija's Avatar
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    that is absolutely adorable C. cranwelli.
    Save one animal and it doesn't change the world, but it surely changes the world for that one animal!

  19. #18
    Froggle
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Thanks .

    I don't think he likes being fed from Tongs. Is there anything else I can feed him other than crickets, considering he's only little?

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    Moderator Mentat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Froggle View Post
    Thanks .

    I don't think he likes being fed from Tongs. Is there anything else I can feed him other than crickets, considering he's only little?
    Hello and welcome to FF! Just to make sure you've seen it, here is link to an excellent care article: Frog Forum - Pacman and Horned Frogs - Ceratophrys - Care and Breeding.

    IRT food, get plastic or plastic tipped tweezers and approach from side slowly. Sometimes wiggling the food in front of mouth gets you a response. Another option is to get a small glass dish and place it in front of frog with crickets inside (they don't climb out of glass). Crickets should be same size as distance between frog's eyes. Dust food with calcium 2X and vitamins 1x weekly on different days with a skip day in between.

    The best food for Pacmans are earthworms. You can get European Night-crawlers in bait and tackle shops, just make sure they have no additives like dyes. If frog is smaller than couple in. you might need to cut the worms. Do that from their pointy end and the worms will heal. I would feed all the food the frog will eat until satiated. There is a 15 min. feeding rule going around; but my Pacman eats fast and loses interest in a couple minutes.

    When using the shredded coco, mix it with dechlorinated water until slightly damp. It should clump in a closed fist without dripping water. Good luck !
    Remember to take care of the enclosure and it will take care of your frog !​

  21. #20
    100+ Post Member Louis Charles Bruckner's Avatar
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    Default Re: Getting a PacMac this weekend - Just want to make sure my setup is okay.

    I feed mostly Night crawlers, 1 every other day and Crickets and Dubia roach nymphs gut loaded.
    A pinky mouse once a month. Now it is large enough to eat one.

    Keeping a dubia roach colony is really easy and is much cleaner than keeping crickets.
    I cut it down a bit I don't want it to get too fat LOL



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