Vivarium Help

[starofwhitelight]

I really need a vivarium make over. I went from a 20 gallon to a 90 gallon vivarium 10 months ago. I’ve kept a 20 gallon for three years and never had any problems like these. Here is a list of problems with my 90 gallon vivarium.

1) A have a leak in one of the corners of the tank.
2) Plant growth is really really fast
3) Never could grow moss (tried twice)
4) Spider mites (these are not that big of a deal. They had 2 population booms and died off quickly each time)
5) Centipedes!!! (I really don’t like these bugs, but their population is small and they never had a boom. I just don’t like them!!)
6) Ants!!!!!! (These are new. There is a small colony of ants living in the vivarium. I noticed them two weeks ago. The ants are small and I never see many of them walking around.)
7) Red worms (Okay, I added these to the tank, but they are everywhere at night. I started with ten and now I have dozens inching up the glass every night. I also think the frogs hate them)
8) Isopods (I seeded the tank with 40, now there are hundreds. Turn over anything and wow!!! I love isopod, but every day I have 6 to 20 dead isopods in the water bowl.)
9) Springtail (They do well, but I have to reseed every 4 months because their population drops.)

I am planning to try to fix some of these problems this weekend. I am planning to take everything out of the tank and use silicone caulking to fix the leak. I am going to replace the substrate with a mix of coconut fiber, cypress mulch, plume moss, charcoal, and peat moss. I want to keep most of my plants and wood. After re-planting, I plan to use dry-ice to kill anything that hitched a ride on the plants or wood. I know I want to reseed the tank with bugs, but how……. I am guessing it would be a good ideal not to put red worms in the tank, but what about the isopods and springtails. What do you guys think?

[Bolisnide]

Welcome to Frog Forum!
Sounds like you have everything under control! I personally love isopods and springtails, and yes they multiply quickly, but have never found it to be a problem. In fact I think it keeps my tanks smelling very earthy and somewhat clean.
What type of tree frogs do you house in this tank?

[Bolisnide]

Oh, and meant to mention, the centipedes , yuck! How in the world did they get in the tank?

[starofwhitelight]

I have 9 red eyes tree frogs in my 90 gallon vivarium. I think I got the centipedes from a parlor palm. I rinsed the palm to the bare roots with water and pulled off the clumps of dirt before planting, but somehow, I think, a centipede egg got into the tank on the parlor palm. IDK

Also, I was wondering where I should put the frogs when I fix the tank. I was thinking individually in deli cups.

[Bolisnide]

Nice! That is such a nice size for 9 redeyes.
*jealous*

I would PM Lynn, flybyferns. She's a moderater on FF. She is the goddess of redeyes

That totally sucks about the centipedes, creepy...

[Bolisnide]

And Heatheranne (also a moderator) has a lot of experience with redeyes....
She can help also.

[Heatheranne]

Hello. Your plan is a good one. You can keep your red eyes in a quarantine tank while waiting for the silicone to dry and cure. Do you have any extra tanks?

If you rinse the plants, bake any natural wood at 325'-350'F for 30 minutes, rinse down the tank, change all substrate (leave bare with no substrate when using the dry ice), and use the dry ice you should minimize if not rid of all pests.

I prefer only using springtails and isopods. Centipedes love to hide up in substrate tangled within plant roots. Be sure to rinse them well.

It seems you have a perfect ecosystem for them all to thrive in there (insects). Unfortunately they can be a nuisance.

90 gallon is a nice sized tank. What are your dimensions?

[starofwhitelight]

Two of my frogs died. One passed the day after getting into the new tank, the other 2 days after that. All other frogs (6) seems health and happy. I placed the frogs in totes for two days to let the silicone to dry and cure in their tank. Two totes were solid colors non-see-through and one tote was clear and see-through. All the totes were place in a bathroom with heating pads. An Ultrasonic Humidifier was also place in the bath room. I had two temp alerts one for above 83 one for below 72. No alerts were triggered. I also place roaches in tupperware containers in each tote. Every tote held 3 frogs for 52 hours. I noticed quickly that the frogs in the clear tote were not eating. Soon one frog in the clear tote started to be active during the day; this same frog formed a nose rub. The next day two frogs in the clear tote were active during the day. The newly day active frog formed a minor nose rub. These two frogs were the ones that passed away. I wonder if it was due to the clear tote .

I decided not to use dry ice after all. I removed all of the substrate and rinse all the plants to the bare roots. I sprayed all plants with 91% alcohol after I took them out of the tank and before I put them back in. I also baked the wood. I reseed the tank with springtails and isopods.

The tank’s dimensions are 36X36X16.

[Bolisnide]

I'm so sorry!
I'm curious about these 'totes.' Were they bags of some sort?
I would PM Lynn and Heatheranne to get their feedback.
Again, I'm so sorry.

[flybyferns]

Hello, ( sorry I don't know your name)
Some thoughts
What kind of soil did you use ? What kind of drainage / bottom design did you set-up?

I have never put a plant into a tank with out doing a diluted bleach dip first ( leaves and cleaned roots) / then a long soak in a bucket of de- chlorinated water.
A little OCD --- ya think ?

Spider mites - in a red eye tank - I am going to say that these are a big deal since the frogs are not going to be eating them. You don't' want them crawling on the frogs - stresses them out - or nipping at the frogs.

Centipedes--- yikes -- I agree with you....... they hitch-hiked in.

Ants- not good - you will want to do everything you can - to get rid of these - most will bite.

Red worms --

The frogs the hate them or ate them ? Either way ----they won't hurt anything. If you get a really lot of them you might notice a distinct odor though?

Isopods and springs should be your best friends ! Especially if you have other dying insects in the soil.

I'm no bug expert; I'll throw Jeff a PM ........He will come to our rescue !

TWO QUESTIONS for JEFF :
1)is there competition going on! Will one bug ie ants - cause the demise of your very important Iso and spring population ?
2) Centipedes - What kind --a photo would be good ( if you can ) Is there is any worry about toxicity if eaten by the frogs?

Lynn

[JeffreH]

TWO QUESTIONS for JEFF :
1)is there competition going on! Will one bug ie ants - cause the demise of your very important Iso and spring population ?
2) Centipedes - What kind --a photo would be good ( if you can ) Is there is any worry about toxicity if eaten by the frogs?

The ants may be feeding on a variety of things in the enclosure; but regardless they are not good. They will be competing with springtails and isopods for various useful organic material and may pose a direct threat or stress factor for the frogs in numbers.

I'm honestly not that well versed in my myriapods, but the centipedes should still be removed manually with tweezers as you see them. They likely won't cause any harm to the frogs by ingestion but depending on the size they may be able to inflict a bite, and most species produce a type of venom to aid in subduing small prey and I'm not honestly sure how hazardous a bite would be for a frog... The centipedes should spend the vast majority of their time hiding within loose substrate and cage decor and are thriving from the warm and moist microhabitat you have in the frog enclosure; feeding on developing red worms and smaller invertebrates. Their pretty generalist predators, and will eat most any of the other inverts in there if they can overpower it, making them a threat to the useful organisms and potentially hazardous to the frogs themselves.

I would wager that replacing the substrate and taking proper quarantine measures (i.e. baking the wood/decor) will virtually eliminate the centipede and ant problem. You may get the occasional pede pop up again if there was any minute larvae or eggs that managed to survive but if you are thorough they shouldn't be an issue = )

[starofwhitelight]

I'm so sorry!
I'm curious about these 'totes.' Were they bags of some sort?
I would PM Lynn and Heatheranne to get their feedback.
Again, I'm so sorry.

The totes were 20 Gallon Storage Totes made of plastic. They were vary similar to the ones here: HDX 20 gal. Tote-2020-0108 at The Home Depot
All totes were soak and rinsed in water and dipped in a bleach dilution and left to dry over night.

[Heatheranne]

Did you happen to rerinse the totes after the bleach?

They should be rerinsed in water with 2-3x the amount of dechlorinator in the rinse water to neutralize the bleach.

[starofwhitelight]

Did you happen to rerinse the totes after the bleach?

They should be rerinsed in water with 2-3x the amount of dechlorinator in the rinse water to neutralize the bleach.

I rinse well with clear water and allow to air dry over night.

[Bolisnide]

The totes were 20 Gallon Storage Totes made of plastic. They were vary similar to the ones here: HDX 20 gal. Tote-2020-0108 at The Home Depot
All totes were soak and rinsed in water and dipped in a bleach dilution and left to dry over night.

Were ventilation holes made in the totes?

[starofwhitelight]

Yes 3 2in diameter holes cover with screen mesh were added to the totes. Hot glue was used on the mesh to glue it to the totes.

[starofwhitelight]

I had a 3^rd frog pass suddenly two days ago. Iwas surprise because all my frogs were good weights and slept happily duringthe day. I did notice something that may have been aggression; one of the frogswas climbing all over two of the others until they fell or hopped away.


I found a person that is willing to take my remaining 6frogs I am meeting them at their Vet’s office today. The person is paying forall of them to get a vet visit and a stool test before I will let him have thefrogs for free. I want to know if there is some kind of infection plaguing thetank or was this a case of stress and aggression.


If there is no infection found, do you guys think it mightbe okay to put my whites in the tank once the RETFs are gone.

-Off to the vet

[flybyferns]

Hi,

It wouldn't be a good idea to put any frogs into the tank until it is thoroughly cleaned.
It should be completely broken down.
Every thing needs to be cleaned with a very, very weak bleach solution/ rinsed thoroughly ( including plants ), decorations.... baked , boiled etc.

[CJ PELCHER]

It seems you have a perfect ecosystem for them all to thrive in there (insects). Unfortunately they can be a nuisance.

HA ... i think the 500 crickets a week i bring into my house are a nuisance!!! ALL OVer MY HOUSE!!

[CJ PELCHER]

Yes... you should have completely broken down the tank before putting red eyes in there... Replaced all the substrate and washed all the pants again. Bbased on the super fast death rate.. have you investigated the water quality? Also are you keeping the vivarium at 65-85 percent humidity. (Do you handle your red eyes without washing your hands) Those (besides disease already carried) Will kill your frog the fastest. Photos would be greatly appreciated.

-Corey