Pros and Cons of Letting a Young WC Toad Go Free

[yoshimi]

Ok, so my Banjo, (female eastern american toad) has been with me since the end of Sept, growing from 1.25in to 2.5in, last I measured. That's 7mnths. Recently she wasn't eating, no interest in food save for one bug for a period of about 2 wks. She was also shedding frequently and sleeping a lot. Or whatever it is they do in their burrows. She's since stopped the shedding, but I had to help her remove leftover skin, changed her substrate, and only then did she eat, (day before yesterday I think). And take a poop, which I guess was mostly skin pooped out, as I'm positive she hadn't eaten anything for a week.
Was crazy scared for her, had been giving her honey bathes (3), and am so relieved she ate, tho she hasn't been hungry since then. She's still a fantastic hopper outside, and she walks normal (adorably), so all in all, she looks pretty good.

Have to move back to my bf's house, and he thinks I should let her go, since I don't know anyone I'd trust to care for her or would want to. Bf doesn't like the bugs or the money it costs to take care of her. I'm ok with her going off and living the life she was meant for, but I don't know where I'd let her go. She was picked up off the sidewalk, in a residential area with train tracks on a main road in town. The closest nearby pond is cut in half by a road, and on one side, there is a business complex, so the road gets a lot of fast traffic. The other side is quieter, but there are snakes. That's still my best bet I think. Other ponds around are still near roads and not where she came from, and one in particular has a "no trespassing" sign and that's generally where we hit frogs in the car on warm rainy nights.

What do I do here? I love my little girl, obviously. Too much to put an ad up on craigslist or something, and too much to ship her anywhere. I couldn't bear to think of her in a box on a journey getting bounced around.

Pros and cons of letting her go, and if letting her go, where? All cons can be related back to my bf. I want to make the best decision for her. And I need help to do that. Thanks.

[Gnag the nameless]

That's a hard one Crystal, but if you're going through a tough time, you're not alone. I just lost one of my Chorus frogs, Chrome

I got my Gnag and Bumpy at the same time (Sept 24th) as you got Banjo, so all it takes for me to know how you feel is to imagine having to make a decision like that with one of those two. Maybe see if anyone here on the FF lives in the Massachusetts and is willing to take her in? That, or find an animal shelter. I honestly don't think you should let her go. It'd be such a shock from living with you for so long and then suddenly being placed back outside. It's entirely your and Banjo's choice, though, and no one else.

I'd at least take her to the vet before letting her go (if you do let her go), and see what's up with her.

Are there any nearby Provincial parks or large forests? I think those would be her best chance if you decide to let her go.

I'd take her in if I lived closer

As for a pro and con list, here's mine:

PROS OF:
Keeping her:
She may likely heal from her current state, even if it requires help from a Vet.
She'll be happy staying with you, and you'll be happy with her staying with you.
She'll be under the care of a very caring pet owner.
No threats of predators attacking her or vehicles hitting her.
She may live MUCH longer than she would in the wild.

Letting her go:
She'll live the life nature intended her to have.
She may heal from her current state.
She may get the chance to breed and have young.

CONS OF:
Keeping her:
A grumpy and/or disagreeing Bf.
She may not heal from her current state.
She will not reproduce (unless you get a Bf for her too )
It will cost money, though not more than the current cost.

Letting her go:
She may be run over or eaten by predators.
She may die due to shock from the sudden move or unknown location.
She may not live as long.
She may be abused or attacked by humans.
We'll miss hearing about her on the Frog Forum.

I really do think you should keep her, you two are so close. But, like I said, it's entirely up to you two.

[yoshimi]

There are some great parks around, a state forest in the next town over. 800 acres with paths that go past some ponds and wetlands, but I'm not sure how they'd feel about my dropping off a toad. Also a national wildlife refuge that is huge, less than 2mi from my house as the crow flies, but unfortunately is directly behind where the remaining Boston Marathon Bomber kid is right now. Don't really want to go there just yet. And again, not a place where I should introduce something new.

I don't want to leave her too far from where I found her so, here's a map. It's looks much better and greener from above than it really is. Nevertheless.

The hearts are my boyfriend's house, the strange yellow face is where I work, the green glow is where I kidnapped Banjo, and the panda and cat are my house. My world is small.

To the left of that large mass of buildings on bottom right is a pond, which continues on the other side and becomes smaller.
This is what it looked like March 15th: Beyond this it becomes a brook and on the northern side of it is a nature trail, but I know there are snakes, and people walk their dogs there. South of the brook is a few trees on a hill leading up to a cemetery and then where I'm going to be living. Imagine if I put her on the cemetery side and then found her on the road, cuz she was coming to see me. Better thought: I open the door one day and she's sitting there eating bugs and waiting for me.
I don't trust that place. I don't like the street that runs by it, and all the wooded area seems in danger of being mowed down to build new houses.

I have more to say but it's late and I'd better leave it be for now.

[kueluck]

I would release her in a State Park, or Nature Preserve. Only about 20% of frogs/toads make it to adulthood so I think she has a pretty good chance out in the wild. Wish you were closer, I’d take her in a heart beat.

[yoshimi]

I would release her in a State Park, or Nature Preserve. Only about 20% of frogs/toads make it to adulthood so I think she has a pretty good chance out in the wild. Wish you were closer, I’d take her in a heart beat.

I know, I thought of you, and said to Paul that there's one lady I'd trust her with, but can't ship my little girl all that way.

There is a state park in Lancaster, but again, I'm not sure adding to their wildlife would be allowed. Maybe I will have time to scope it out 1st.

[Louis Charles Bruckner]

Another option is a life science museum that has some live exhibits, local children's zoo , zoo.

Good luck I know it is a very hard decision.

[yoshimi]

That's a hard one Crystal, but if you're going through a tough time, you're not alone. I just lost one of my Chorus frogs, Chrome

I got my Gnag and Bumpy at the same time (Sept 24th) as you got Banjo, so all it takes for me to know how you feel is to imagine having to make a decision like that with one of those two. Maybe see if anyone here on the FF lives in the Massachusetts and is willing to take her in? That, or find an animal shelter. I honestly don't think you should let her go. It'd be such a shock from living with you for so long and then suddenly being placed back outside. It's entirely your and Banjo's choice, though, and no one else.

I'd at least take her to the vet before letting her go (if you do let her go), and see what's up with her.

Are there any nearby Provincial parks or large forests? I think those would be her best chance if you decide to let her go.

I'd take her in if I lived closer

As for a pro and con list, here's mine:

PROS OF:
Keeping her:
She may likely heal from her current state, even if it requires help from a Vet.
She'll be happy staying with you, and you'll be happy with her staying with you.
She'll be under the care of a very caring pet owner.
No threats of predators attacking her or vehicles hitting her.
She may live MUCH longer than she would in the wild.

Letting her go:
She'll live the life nature intended her to have.
She may heal from her current state.
She may get the chance to breed and have young.

CONS OF:
Keeping her:
A grumpy and/or disagreeing Bf.
She may not heal from her current state.
She will not reproduce (unless you get a Bf for her too )
It will cost money, though not more than the current cost.

Letting her go:
She may be run over or eaten by predators.
She may die due to shock from the sudden move or unknown location.
She may not live as long.
She may be abused or attacked by humans.
We'll miss hearing about her on the Frog Forum.

I really do think you should keep her, you two are so close. But, like I said, it's entirely up to you two.

Thank you for the kind words, and I'm so sorry about Chrome.

I think she's ok, but there was more shed on her that came off last night in water. Tried to measure her again and she wasn't really having it but it appeared she was a little more than 2.5in now. She never eats when she's in shed, too full of skin, yum. If her recent poo hadn't looked so perfect and she started looking strange and not brightening up and moving around ok, I'd be taking her to the vet. And should any of that change, I *will* be taking her in.

She seems less stressed in front room, where it's warmer and quieter and there's a dimmer switch. No climbing plants or pressing her face against side of tank. Of course I won't be here much longer, but paul's (bf) house has dark quiet infrequently used rooms with dimmers. If he considers the money I make from the roaches, let's me keep them somewhere, even the shed or something, then Banjo wouldn't be a nuisance at all. As one FF member pointed out, a pet in a cage/tank shouldn't be a problem. Still, his house tho.

She does great outside, such a good hopper. Took her out when she was much smaller and she just sat there, so I said no way, after we'd tried it a few times. Now she boogies, and burrows like a champ. When I take her out, I try not to hover, but every leaf rustle has me turning to make sure it isn't something with it's eyes on her. I'm even looking up at the trees for suspicious birds. Then of course there's a moment of panic til I spot her again cuz she can be so blendy. That's a good thing. I'm the only predator she's used to, but I'm bigger and scarier than any living opponent she might encounter outside. She'll know what to do on her own.

Except when it comes to a vehicle. Or lawnmower, which doesn't have to be big... THOSE are the threats I'm most worried about, rather than the natural ones. There's nowhere around here I could put her where she wouldn't be near a road or someone's lawn. Also pesticides. We had a mosquito-born illness "crisis" in MA last Fall, and I don't remember what they did if anything here, where the risk was only moderate, but people use them all the time. I was using ant-murdering granules out front last summer. Didn't work, they just moved their hills over a bit. Paul uses a pesticide around the outside of house as a barrier because I suggested it, and was actually the 1st one to do it. (I used to live there before I moved to this apartment.) It works to keep the bugs out, and if they do make it in, they just die inside rather than out. And Paul himself has mowed a toad in his yard. He didn't see it til it was too late. They're not abundant around here, I've seen one (at paul's house, but not the one he mowed, this one we just watched hop away) and Banjo, and that's it, and I've lived in this town for 5 years.

I'm going to scope out the area and if I see toads calling or hear it, I'll feel better about it. Again, I don't want to take her too far from where she came from, unless there are other toads there, meaning it's frog friendly.

But of course I want to keep her and have her grow old with me.

I'm doing the very best I can for her, even if it means saying good bye. She may be almost fully grown, but doesn't it take a year or two for them to sexually mature? Meaning, she's still growing a bit more and she wouldn't be able to reproduce this year, not yet. Next year, probably. She would just be out there (hopefully) surviving. To me she still looks so small and so vulnerable. But she could grow to be gigantic and I would still probably see her that way.

Question for toad keepers, or whomever might know... if she grew from 1.25in to 2.5in in about 6 months, when do you think she was born? I'm not sure what I mean by born... I guess when was she a tadpole, when did she morph, when was she a tiny little toadlet? Was it spring/summer 2012, or could it have been earlier? Was this past winter her 1st winter? She didn't hibernate or even begin to, so I'm thinking she hasn't before. The way she's been lately, if it was Fall instead of Spring I would think she was settling down. Not as hungry, a lot of burrowing and resting, etc. Right now, she's burrowed and I don't even know where. It looks like her toad abode is empty, but I know she's in there.