Why is breeding different species of dart frogs among themselves so frowned upon?

[flybyferns]

Friends,
Wow ! What a great thread. I go to bed early and missed all the fun. The moment is probably gone.

Actually, the best part is we can have this conversation without throwing things at each other.
I’ll take care of that when I see Ed this weekend.
How about you , Uncle Billy, why don’t you try to make the drive to White Plains this weekend----I can hit you over the head with my purse.

My thoughts.........not my practice.........are all over the place with this, mostly because I have a good imagination and not a genetics degree.

Seriously, I stay on the same side of the fence as Ed and Bill…. never mix species, morphs of the same species and even go so far as not to put pairs together that came from the same parents so to produce “healthy offspring” . ( ie like father and daughter ) I feel like it’s my responsibility. I look at it as black and white. As a 'rule'.

I’m surprised that no one has started a business in the dart trade utilizing some kind of a swap thing as it would help the overall genetic diversity of each species.

I’m sure ‘inbreeding” and poor husbandry goes hand and hand as well ? ( ie over breeding and a diet of nothing but FF !) Both situations, we know, can cause tons of problems with the frogs we keep and on the reproduction of healthy off spring. This is just as big a responsibility. Like anything else, sadly, some people just don’t care. Oh boy ! I'll stop there as I'm sure I'm walking on thin ice.

I always wonder?
I've not been on trips to view darts in the wild…but are we even reproducing frogs with the same exact clutch sizes, colors, and body size of the WC? And do they - ever- interbreed in the wild?

WE CAN’T keep taking them from the wild ….that a scary thought and a whole separate topic.
So now what ?

[flybyferns]

I'm sure like me you all enjoy reading as much as possible.

dendrobates.org is one of my favorite past-times.
You can go on forever and ever off the external links. ie Tree Walkers ...of which joining/donating is well worth the investment.

This is a link from the "About Us " pages with information about important and passionate individuals.
Sadly , I don't' think it has been updated recently and at this point, some of the personal account links are broken.

Dendrobates.org - About us

check out the "mint white" P terribilis -- This got me hooked !
http://www.peruvian-frogimport.com/

and this ! http://www.dendrobates.org/mysteriosus.html

enjoy the photo gallery !
http://www.dendrobates.org/photo_gal...bum/index.html

Lynn

[DartEd]

I'm glad you mentioned swapping off similar line frogs. Many breeders that I've met actually do work out trades with each other. Frogs can be interbred for a couple of generations without any degradation of quality or health. Brothers and sisters can be bred with no problems. The problems start to develop 4-5 generations down the line which is why some breeders will trade male for male from separate lines in order to preserve quality and health.

[CJ PELCHER]

Swapping off similar line frogs I very much support to keep the gene pool healthy and pure. I have never seen anyone do hybrids but I am sure they are out there but remain very discrete about it. I don't take that risk however is someone where to take pictures of it and post I would be amused of some new look and would hope they do their best to leave it in their own home and not trade or sell the frog off.

[flybyferns]

Seems this thread has been resurrected It's always good conversation.

My 2 cents
Not only is it frowned upon to interbreed different species and different morphs of one species of dart frog, it is also questioned when interbreeding from where one morph of one species originated. We should respect our responsibility and privilege to protect the fragile and ominous status of frogs in the wild. ‘We’ want to keep things pure to protect this.

Here’s a sad, sad thought...... from the inside > looking out:
Someday, a morph or even an entire species may be extinct in the wild, but available only in captivity. I sure hope that if that should ever happen …….WE haven't mucked things up

No one should ‘tell’ anybody what to do with their frogs. But it’s really scary to think of interbred offspring looking identically to one of the parents getting out there without proper disclosure.

[Psychotic]

Old thread I know but I wanted to chip in. I'm not totally against hybrids. But it can get messy.

I mainly keep and breed snakes and hybrids are always a very hot topic. Especially with corn snake mixes. There are some people who are on the whole, "It's not natural" side. But the majority of people are against it because of breeders who are not honest or knowledgeable about what they have. If they sell these snakes as pure then other peoples breeding stock becomes contaminated. So, when a new morph pops up it is always questioned as to if it is actually pure corn snake. Take for example the Ultra gene in corn snakes. The original breeder also bred hybrid rat snake/corn snake crosses. He couldn't remember who the parents were of the clutch that hatched out the very first Ultra. It could be a hybrid or it could be a pure corn. A lot of people are now scrapping the Ultra projects and labeling them as hybrids now after all these years because a well respected breeder in the hobby has decided the snakes are in fact hybrid. So, now Ultra and any Ultra combination has become nearly worthless. Yet, there are still respected breeders that claim there is no poof these are hybrids and nothing about the way they look says hybrid. Plus the same hybrid pairing has been done many times since and no Ultra's have come from the hybrid pairings. So, many say this is proof that Ultras are indeed pure corn snake.

Sorry for the long ramble. But as you can see hybrids are a big can of worms and can wreck entire breeding projects down the road. It's not just about the money. It's about the how now all these once valued animals are now seen as worthless and everyone is trying to dump their project animals. So the market became swarmed with them and no one wanting to buy them. Meaning not many homes for these animals all because of the possibility of being a hybrid.