Nitrates are a PITA

[reptileszz]

Hi all, I have been doing water changes til I am blue in the face and my nitrate levels are still at 40 ppm. My back can't take much more of this. I can't do 50% a day. I just cant take it. I have been doing 10 gallons a day which should be 30%. I skipped Thurs. as my back couldnt take lugging the water. I did 15 gallons today and it's still at 40ppm. How is that possible? Where is it freaking coming from? My tap water is 5ppm.

Is there something I can do to remove the nitrates besides water changes? This is killing me

Thanks,
Carole

PS Norm seems to be doing extremely well and getting bigger and bigger.

[deranged chipmunk]

what kind of filtration are you running? and how long has the tank been set up?

[reptileszz]

This is a very established tank that has been set up for about 8 years I think. Its been a lot of years. It had fish in it until about January when "the last cichlid standing" died. He had managed to kill all the others over the years. I had a pleco still in there. I got it in my head to get the ACF's so went and got two babies. Blah blah blah. One ACF did well, the other did not and eventually died after not ever having eaten much. I think I got them on or about Feb 4ish. I had not done anything to the tank at all except lower the temps for the frogs. It is a 29 or 30 gallon tank with an eclipse filter top thingy with a biowheel and filter cartridge. I took out all the gravel which created a mess. I did multiple water changes altho not a ton when I look back on it to get rid of all the **** that was floating around from removal of the gravel... my ammonia is at 0, my nitrites were at 0 but the nitrates were over the top, over 80 ppm and probably worse. I have spent the last week doing daily water changes, carefully vacuuming out any food or poop remainders. There is ONE frog in this tank and he is about 2 inches long. All I read everywhere is that the tank must be overstocked if you cant get the nitrates down. I just dont feel like the water changes are doing any good. They just seem to sit at 40 ppm or somewhat more...

I have been looking around since I wrote my original post and there just doesn't seem to be anything to do but water changes. I was barely able to walk this morning from all this water lugging. Ugh, I guess I will just have to keep doing it. If this goes on for another week with no changes he is going to be stuck with 40ppm. He seems to be tolerating it just fine.

Thanks for the reply.
Carole

[deranged chipmunk]

if you have any places around you that sell aquatic plants, you can float some water sprite or pennywort or something similar. they will suck up nitrates very well. otherwise, you can try a nitrate remover, although I don't like using stuff like that. it's just a crutch.

[reptileszz]

Hi, I have wisteria floating around in there. Is water sprite or pennywort better at this?

Thank you so much!
Carole

[deranged chipmunk]

wisteria would help. the other two other would do a comparable job.

[Heatheranne]

Maybe your filter isn't filtering the water appropriately? You may need a canister filter to keep up? You could try using Prime water treatment or other similar treatment. Try adding another aerator stone. Let your beneficial bacteria rebuild itself. Try putting the frog in a smaller tank for a couple weeks while you let the tank's nitrogen cycle rebalance. Lessen the water changes to weakly. Change the filter pads. Leave the biofilter pads in and do not rinse them. Add an inexpensive fish like a couple of guppies to keep the nitrogen cycle going. And check to see if your test strips are still good (not outdated). What kinds of plants and decor are in your tank?

[reptileszz]

Maybe your filter isn't filtering the water appropriately? You may need a canister filter to keep up? You could try using Prime water treatment or other similar treatment. Try adding another aerator stone. Let your beneficial bacteria rebuild itself. Try putting the frog in a smaller tank for a couple weeks while you let the tank's nitrogen cycle rebalance. Lessen the water changes to weakly. Change the filter pads. Leave the biofilter pads in and do not rinse them. Add an inexpensive fish like a couple of guppies to keep the nitrogen cycle going. And check to see if your test strips are still good (not outdated). What kinds of plants and decor are in your tank?

I am getting seriously conflicting info here. I was under the impression that too many nitrates were created after a nitrogen cycle had been established. Everyone says not to change the filter media. And I need to do daily water changes. And I dont use test strips. I have a brand new master kit from API. I dont know what to do. Your advice is completely opposite of what I have been told... Ugh. This sucks.

[mpmistr]

I am getting seriously conflicting info here. I was under the impression that too many nitrates were created after a nitrogen cycle had been established. Everyone says not to change the filter media. And I need to do daily water changes. And I dont use test strips. I have a brand new master kit from API. I dont know what to do. Your advice is completely opposite of what I have been told... Ugh. This sucks.

The only way to clean filter media is to rinse it out in old tank water. Changing media constantly is bad. Excess nitrates is better than ammonia and nitrite.. Your tank sounds cycled to me. You my need additional filtration but I am betting that something is not right in this tank.. Is there a dead fish or decaying matter of any sort present? Have you checked under decorations? Perhaps mix some bottled spring water in to your water changes if your tap has nitrates?

[deranged chipmunk]

The only way to clean filter media is to rinse it out in old tank water. Changing media constantly is bad. Excess nitrates is better than ammonia and nitrite.. Your tank sounds cycled to me. You my need additional filtration but I am betting that something is not right in this tank.. Is there a dead fish or decaying matter of any sort present? Have you checked under decorations? Perhaps mix some bottled spring water in to your water changes if your tap has nitrates?

i thought about death in the tank, but if anything was decaying, ammonia should be off the charts. i put a distress call out in my planted tank forum. tried getting a hold of a buddy of mine that maintains tanks in the NJ state aquarium, but he's not answering right now.

[Heatheranne]

Bill? What would cause the beneficial bacteria to fail at their job, other than not keeping up with water changes, which she is?

[deranged chipmunk]

i've been pondering that exact same issue. i gotta pm a buddy of mine from another forum.

[Heatheranne]

The process is ammonia (wastes), to nitrites, to nitrates. Having a good mechanical filter to filter out solid wastes and a good biofilter with a good colony of beneficial bacteria (often within the same filter) can assist in the conversion. You are right, nitrates are the final step in which we need to assist with removal. The question is why are they so high when you're working so hard at doing water changes. Unless perhaps too many beneficial bacteria are also being removed in the process. Only change the nonbiofilter pads. Most filters have a solid waste collecting filter pad in which the water passes through first and then a biofilter pad where the good bacteria thrive, so the water can pass through where they can assist in converting the nitrites to nitrates. The beneficial bacteria also live throughout the gravel, once established.

So, the question is, in an established tank that should have a good colony of assisting bacteria, with a filter, and water changes, why are you having such high levels?

[Heatheranne]

Decay is a good possibility.

[rodsboys]

Maybe your test kit is no good. There should be no reason for those readings based on everything your doing. There could very well be issues with the water supply where you are too due melt/run off etc.

[mpmistr]

API Master Kits are considered accurate, probably the best test you can get at a reasonable price.

If the test is in error check the expiration date on the bottle.. make sure you add the water to the line. I would heavily shake both bottles and REALLY REALLY shake the second nitrate test bottle, as it tends to crystallize.

Add 10 drops of bottle 1, swish it a few times so it mixes with the water, add 10 drops of bottle 2 and swish it around some more until it's mixed together with the water. Let it sit about 5 minutes and look.

Water wisteria is very good at sucking up nitrate and is a fast growing plant, so is water sprite and pennywort but they all 'eat' nitrates about the same. If you are getting high nitrates still (and it sounds like you're doing everything right) I would check to see if something is 'dead' in that tank, a fish or something may be rotting in there under an ornament. Maybe you should just do a complete inventory of what's in the tank and look for something that may be suspect. Wanna take a picture of the tank? Any driftwood in there? Perhaps it is rotting?

A 29 gallon tank is quite adequate for a single clawed frog, so we know it's not water volume. The filtration may be suspect but I don't know much about Eclipse filters.. how did your Cichlids die? 8 years is a very mature tank, did you have these problems with your previous fishes? Were there any premature deaths there? I would not panic but something is certainly 'odd' here.

[deranged chipmunk]

Decay is a good possibility.

decay should be accompanied by high ammonia and nitrites, not nitrate. the only thing i can suggest is feed less and add more plants

[reptileszz]

OK, so just now did 15 gallons which is about 50%. 5 min. later I did the test and guess what. It's coming up the same. Sill 40ppm. Same color. My husband says it even looks darker. How is that even possible? So 3 buckets of water later I get nowhere, nowhere, nowhere. I might as well have not have bothered. I hereby give up. He seems fine with it so I guess that's just the way it's going to be.

Thanks for all the advice,
Carole

[reptileszz]

OK, so here's a thought, is my biological filtration too well established? Should I scrape off some of this biowheel thing? There is also a fair amount of buildup of algae inside the filter and tubing and stuff. Should I scrape that all out? I thought it was good to have it there but maybe not. I should also mention that I have 5 small nerite snails in there to take care of any algae and I did remove the aforementioned pleco.

Thanks

[Hidr]

Can you get some duckweed or water lettuce? These are fast growing and really good for the water. Also how many plants do you have? Your tank should have not just lots of plants but so many your fish/frogs can get lost in the tank. There is a picture of mine in the ADF picture thread to give you an idea about how many plants.
I am like your going to let my fish population die off naturally and go to just adf's in my 55 gallon.
Good luck