New to darts, w/questions

[emandkel]

I've read and researched on types of dart frogs and what is needed, but still have a few questions. I made the "plunge" into keeping dart frogs just last week, getting 2 Phyllobates Terribilis "orange" and 2 Azureus (tincs), and strongly considering getting 2 Brazilian Yellow Heads (tincs) as well. The ones I just got are froglets and in large deli containers (120 oz???). I also have 5 gallon and 10-gallon tanks for further grow out tanks.

Tincs are known for being aggressive in a group situation and I know are best housed in pairs. Will two of the same sex get along long term if given enough space (as the only occupants of their enclosure)?

Housing ... would a 20 high be ok for two frogs of the given species above? What about an Exo-Terra 18 x 18 x 18?

Eventually I think my actual preference on housing would be the Tetra Fauna 12" wide x 30" long (like a 20 long, but higher, and would have to have glass cut for the lid), but do have an empty 20 high and a 25-gallon as well (20 H dimensions plus a few inches higher). I also have an empty aquarium that is similar in size to a 18 x 18 x 18 Exo-Terra, but slightly longer I think. Also an empty 28 gallon bowfront (similar to dimensions of a 20H). I'm also considering modifying Sterilite-type tubs for dart frog housing. I know the tub housing isn't as clear viewing, but, still, can see the frogs inside ... and I would think this type of housing may make a shy species a bit more active since they can't see you as well. I've considered modifying one by cutting an opening in the front and then siliconing a piece of plexiglass on the front for better viewing; also a section for the light as well.

As far as drainage and misting ... I know most use misters and many have their tanks drilled for drainage ... but if I just mist enough to keep the humidity up and to give the plants some water, and not really adding much to the drainage layer ... is that going to cause stagnant conditions? I would drain off any excess as needed. I could see frequent misting and the water draining out being a better solution as it keeps the water fresh, so wondering how long a viv substrate setup without frequent draining would hold up. Hmmm ... I do see a downside to the tubs as far as viewing the water level.

Well, any comments on the above would be greatly appreciated.

A few pics of my new babies -- taken the day of arrival or the day after. One Azureus was trying to get out. Since then I've not seen either of them try climbing out. The Azureus are about 3/4" long; the Phyllobates are about maybe 5/8" long. I've seen everyone eating at least once.

[Eric Walker]

Since both species are terrestrial the bigger the footprint the better. The twenty high would work to house a pair of tincs but i would go much bigger for the terribs. I had two female tincs ( inferalanis ) that were raised as froglets together and housed together with no problems for two years. I wouldnt recommend doing it though if these are your first darts. I was watching closely the whole time waiting to see signs of aggression before splitting and never did. As for the drainage. One thing you need to know is terribs are prone to foot rot in stagnant poorly drained conditions so you really want to make sure you have a well draining substrate like abg and a good drainage layer below that.

[emandkel]

Since both species are terrestrial the bigger the footprint the better. The twenty high would work to house a pair of tincs but i would go much bigger for the terribs. I had two female tincs ( inferalanis ) that were raised as froglets together and housed together with no problems for two years. I wouldnt recommend doing it though if these are your first darts. I was watching closely the whole time waiting to see signs of aggression before splitting and never did. As for the drainage. One thing you need to know is terribs are prone to foot rot in stagnant poorly drained conditions so you really want to make sure you have a well draining substrate like abg and a good drainage layer below that.

I have and intend to use ABG mix in the layers and plan on a 1 1/2 - 2 inch drainage layer. Thanks for the info on the terribilis. Would the other tank I mentioned above (around 19"L x 17"W -- inside dimensions) work for the Terribilis? The bowfront is slightly deeper and would allow a little more space, but not much. Just trying to see if what I have already would work.

But for the future, assuming all goes well, my plan is to setup a sliding glass front-opening terrarium for ease of maintenance. Would the Terra Fauna tank I listed above be a good size for 2 frogs? Or would a 18 x 24 x 18 Exo Terra be better? The Terra Fauna tanks can have deeper substrate levels (up to about 6" I think), where as the Exo-Terras I think are around 4". These are my first dart frogs and I will be watching all carefully as they grow and mature for any signs of issues. Hopefully I will end up with true pairs (male/female).

[Eric Walker]

Bigger is always better. I would suggest going bigger ( as in more length ) for the terribs. It should work good for the tincs though.