Do frogs get lonely?

[Malduroque]

"But anyways, how can you tell if an animal feels emotions?...."

Possibly, at least regarding herps, there is no evidence, behavioral or neurological, to suggest that they do.

I think the bigger question is why do some herpers so badly want it to be so? I cringe every time I see "he looks so happy" or "she loves that" to cite but two of the maudlin and inaccurate comments that appear.

Accept our wonderful, fascinating little creatures on their own terms for what they are. Don't insist on trying to make them something they are not.

[Crystal6]

"But anyways, how can you tell if an animal feels emotions?...."

Possibly, at least regarding herps, there is no evidence, behavioral or neurological, to suggest that they do.

I think the bigger question is why do some herpers so badly want it to be so? I cringe every time I see "he looks so happy" or "she loves that" to cite but two of the maudlin and inaccurate comments that appear.

Accept our wonderful, fascinating little creatures on their own terms for what they are. Don't insist on trying to make them something they are not.

When he's ramming his head into the top of the cage over and over I can theorize that he is discontent with his cage. When I let him out and he stops, sits on the top, and just chills out can I not theorize he is, on some level, satisfied?

If he isn't and you can prove he lacks the neurological parts in his brain to feel pleasure or sorrow I can accept that, but I like to learn. I would love to go to a class and hear all about how his brain works and what each area does. But I can't do that unless someone here has a book on frog neurology. I only ask for that reason. If he doesn't feel emotions I won't like him any less then I already do thinking he does. (Though even if he could feel emotions his ways to communicate it are less then if he were a cat.)

[1beataway]

I believe they don't feel emotion. I think your frog just may never realize that you're its caregiver and that it should cuddle up to you.

But, I think the frogs feel some things. Obviously, they feel pain. Someone I know has a White's tree frog that got out and got one of its toes cut off, and now it stays a "purplish" color. She describes it as mad, because of that color. Luigi likes to move back and forth across the front of the tank, until I open the door and let it jump out a few times. Then I can put him back and he's fine.My frogs are a lot more active in a bigger tank than they were in the smaller one. Frogs can feel threatened and be defensive.

But I think these are different from emotions. This hurts. This is better than that. He can eat me, better do this. Seems like basic stuff any animal would know.

I'm very tired today (two hours sleep last night) and am having trouble saying exactly what I mean, but there it is. lol

[JeffX]

I don't think they have emotions, but more like natural instincts that we all do. We are more aware of ours and others since we can clearly communicate with one another. Not saying that amphibians don't as they do, but not on our level. I frog is going to of course "act happy" when you feed it worms, or anything else. That is more of their feeding instinct kicking in.

[Crystal6]

I believe they don't feel emotion. I think your frog just may never realize that you're its caregiver and that it should cuddle up to you.

But, I think the frogs feel some things. Obviously, they feel pain. Someone I know has a White's tree frog that got out and got one of its toes cut off, and now it stays a "purplish" color. She describes it as mad, because of that color. Luigi likes to move back and forth across the front of the tank, until I open the door and let it jump out a few times. Then I can put him back and he's fine.My frogs are a lot more active in a bigger tank than they were in the smaller one. Frogs can feel threatened and be defensive.

But I think these are different from emotions. This hurts. This is better than that. He can eat me, better do this. Seems like basic stuff any animal would know.

I'm very tired today (two hours sleep last night) and am having trouble saying exactly what I mean, but there it is. lol

I know it will never cuddle with my hand or anything and I don't mean to imply that it will. But, when I first got it it was terrified of me and now it is very comfortable with my hand picking it up. (Granted he hates it when I wake him up.) If he had no concept of such things he would remain terrified of me for as long as I had him as he was the first few days.

[Kurt]

Frogs have emotions, but not in the way humans interpret them. I feel there emotions serve to keep the alive and not to bond to others. The only long for food, safety, and every so often a mate, some long for territory, but that's it.

[Malduroque]

"I know it will never cuddle with my hand or anything and I don't mean to imply that it will. But, when I first got it it was terrified of me and now it is very comfortable with my hand picking it up. (Granted he hates it when I wake him up.) If he had no concept of such things he would remain terrified of me for as long as I had him as he was the first few days."

I don't think anyone, myself included, said that they can't learn things within their environment. That's how they survive. Heck, even earthworms can be conditioned to navigate simple mazes when a mild electric shock is the result of going the wrong way.

Your frog simply became acclimatized to a human. Many will do that especially when they associate us with feeding. I have a Ranid, notorious for their skittishness, who is no longer jumpy even when I remove and replace the terrarium cover directly over his head. I can also stick my hand in there and tong feed him.

Of course, he doesn't recognize ME personally, these animals do not form personal bonds with people. He's just now less fearful of a creature of my general size and countenance because he does not associate that form with danger but does associate it with food. I could invite a neighbor to perform the same actions as I do and he would also display the same tranquility that he does for me.

So we're still a long way however from 'happy', 'loving' and the host of other complex emotions that some herpers insist on ascribing to their pets.

[Crystal6]

Frogs have emotions, but not in the way humans interpret them. I feel there emotions serve to keep the alive and not to bond to others. The only long for food, safety, and every so often a mate, some long for territory, but that's it.

^ I like this interpretation of it best. I don't mean to start an argument anyway.

[hyla]

Regardless of what each individual believes a frog is or is not capable of, it is clear that we as humans (who certainly do feel emotions) love our herps and are very passionate about them. So if you have a frog and it is healthy and thriving because of the care you give it, then I think you can say and think it is happy or sad or angry or whatever other emotion you can think of because it is yours. The most important thing is that we all have the best understanding of how to care for them and that is why we are all so fortunate to have this website!

[Mellyjoe04]

Well I have two whites tree frogs and I got them at different times. The first did well by himself but we thought he would get lonely as you did. We decided to get him another friend and they are always together. They are always clinging to the same wall, same tree, always touching when they sleep. I think they are happier together. I think Kermit is happier now that he has someone to be with. Although, something I have learned is if you want to get another, they should be around the same size and same type. Something important is that you don't mix. Get another grey tree frog around the same size! I think it would be great for your froggie!

[Malduroque]

Once again, science and reason are trumped by emotion and superstition.

There are no happy forgs. There are no sad frogs. There are no lonely frogs. There are no frogs that are accountants, computer programmers or film directors and even though they jump well, there are no frogs in the NBA.