ADFs - Floating or Dead?

[PURP]

I have lost 4 ADFs so far, one of which I could not locate the body. The three I have found all followed the same pattern:
- First I find them floating, sometimes upside down, following the surface current of the tank; they appear lifeless. I touch them lightly to see if they respond, and they give a kick or two with a delayed response. I can pick them up by putting one finger under their body and lifting; their limp legs wrap around my finger.
- Then, a few hours later, when I check back on them, they're unresponsive and their body is rigid (which I've been assuming is rigor). Other than that, there doesn't appear to be any marks or discoloration or bloating.
- Burial at sea (toilet).

It breaks my heart to keep losing these guys. Yesterday, one of the remaining 3 started doing the bobbing thing. Strangest of all, her buoyancy seemed off in that she seemed to be struggling to get to the bottom, but couldn't manage to stop floating back to the surface. I assumed I was about to lose my 5th froggy, but when I checked in on her this morning, she wasn't bobbing anymore. I didn't have time to search the hiding places in the tank (there are several), but I will be doing a role call when I get home.

Does anybody know what this pattern means? Drunken-like swimming/bobbing -> rigid.

I'm REALLY hoping I didn't flush away 3 froggies who were just in a deep sleep. They were completely unresponsive.

As for the one missing body; any ideas? The tank's lid has no gaps through which they could escape, and I dismantled everything in the tank and found no body. Could he have been eaten in a matter of hours with no trace left behind?

[gemzjames]

ok, so im not an expert with african dwarf frogs as I have clawed. but the first thing you need to check in the water quality and check ammonia levels, nitrate levels etc and make sure that is normal. Any you do have alive I would quarentine immediately into a clean tank. In regards to the missing one - i lost a frog a few years ago and we have no idea what happened to it, no body and we looked outside the tank around the area and couldnt find it ... so we assumed it might have been eaten by one of my larger females.

how long have you had these for?

[JayFrog]

I'm no expert either but I 100% agree with gemzjames. If your ADF's keep dying and are having repeated symptoms, there is a good chance that it's the water. I was recommended this test kit: Amazon.com: API Freshwater Master Test Kit: Pet Supplies I haven't personally tried it but based on the reviews, it's very good. Test the water after a water change and see the differences, it requires a lot of work but it'll keep your frogs happy. If you'd like you can further investigate this issue by testing the water you're using to change to tank water. That may be causing their behavior. As for the disappearance, it's hard to say since it has never happened to me.

[purpleturtle89]

I keep an aquarium with turtles and fish, the first thing you need to do is get the water tested! you can take it to your local aquatics pet shop and they can do this test for less than a pound. It also means you can get a result the same day without waiting for a test kit but you should be testing your water regularly, and 20% water changes a week to keep it fresh, also dont over change the water you want a build up of good bacteria that will oxygenate the water ! good luck and as for the missing body this happens with aquariums STRANGE GOINGS ON! i wouldnt get your hopes up about him being alive sorry

[Louis Charles Bruckner]

I have been keeping aquariums for almost 30 years and ADF for the past 5.
I will agree something is amiss with your water quality.
What kind of tank do you have, do you keep any other animals in the tank like fish , snails ect.
also what kind of filtration do you have and how often do you do water changes.

I do hope you are using dechlorinated water. and for water changes using a bucket
just for that purpose and treating water before you add it to the tank.

You can always take a water sample to your local fish store and they will test it for free 99% of the time.
Do you have good aeration of the water and or live plants.

[PURP]

Hi again. I apologize for not providing more info in the OP.


My Water:

My water has been tested regularly (weekly) and has come back perfect every time (by 'perfect' I mean that there is nothing to indicate its responsible - Ammonia: 0; Nitrite: 0; Nitrate: 0; Hardness: 150; pH: 8.0). Also, I have real-time alarms in the tank to monitor ammonia and pH constantly. I remove about 5 gallons each week while vaccuuming the gravel, which I replace with fresh water treated with bacteria and a dash of aquarium salt. Chlorine is not an issue as I use well water (the good kind). I have a dedicated bucket for using with the aquarium.


Tank environment:

The 7 ADFs were put in the tank about 4 weeks ago. The first one died two weeks later; the fifth death occurred yesterday (which answers my original question -> floating today = dead tomorrow). I now have two froggies left in a 30 gallon tank with 12 mollies, 11 tetra, and 1 placo(?). They have several places to hide, though they seemed comfortable enough to not have to hide very much. The fish seem to have no problems whatsoever; nor do the frogs... until they die.

So, aside from water quality issues, what could cause the 'death float'?

[gemzjames]

where did u get the frogs from? they might have possibly had a bacterial or viral infection before you got them and its only now that its suddenly taken affect? what about water temperature? it maybe very different from what they were used to ... although im sure this wouldnt cause them to float. it must be an infection of some kind they must have had before you got them???

[PURP]

The temperature is kept at 77-78°F. I've wondered about a possible pre-existing condition... Maybe if no-one bought them, they would have died in the same timeframe anyway? I've heard a rumour that the world-wide supply of ADFs is currently unhealthy...

[Louis Charles Bruckner]

I bought 6 of them a few weeks ago and so far I haven't had any problems.
but I don't vacuum the gravel but twice a year since I have a somewhat heavily planted tank.

[rodsboys]

It sounds to me like your supplier has a case of chytrid fungus. I have a run in with it years ago. Any chance your frogs are from Petsmart?
Here is some info on the horrible disease: VERY Important ADF QT & treatment for Chytrid Fungus in African Dwarf Frogs Forum
You can also find some good info on the yahoo group for ADF's.

[PURP]

It sounds to me like your supplier has a case of chytrid fungus. I have a run in with it years ago. Any chance your frogs are from Petsmart?
Here is some info on the horrible disease: VERY Important ADF QT & treatment for Chytrid Fungus in African Dwarf Frogs Forum
You can also find some good info on the yahoo group for ADF's.

Yes, they are from Petsmart. Body count is now at 5, with 2 remaining. I will go to the link you provided when I get home, as I cannot access it from work; for some reason it is blocked. I really hope there is some way to save the remaining two.

Thank you very much Tony.

[PURP]

Yes, they are from Petsmart. Body count is now at 5, with 2 remaining. I will go to the link you provided when I get home, as I cannot access it from work; for some reason it is blocked. I really hope there is some way to save the remaining two.

Thank you very much Tony.

UPDATE:
The 2 remaining seem to be doing well, though one has a small white patch on his back that doesn't seem to be going away. I added an additional 4 ADF's about a month ago, and they seem to be doing quite well. One of the fake plants I have goes to the top of the water level and then sags across the surface; every time I sneak up to the aquarium, there are frogs (usually 2 or 3) sitting on top of this plant, just bobbing on the surface. I think this indicates contentment on their part...(?) Though a couple of them are still VERY shy.

Despite still occasionally losing a fish, I continue to do weekly water tests and the results continue to indicate that all levels are where they should be. So I guess it WAS simply a case of 'new tank syndrome'.

Just updating in case this info might be useful to someone else in this situation.
Thank you all for your help.
Mark