Large water dish V.S. water feature for White's viv?

[Stickyfeet]

Hi everyone!
I'm in the planning phase of setting up a 29gl naturalistic vivarium for my White's tree frogs. I have a very large water dish that they are using now. I'm trying to decide whether to create a pond with filter in their vivarium (something I'm not sure I fully understand how to do), or to stick with their water dish. My biggest concern is the health of my frogs. With the water dish their water would be changed and the dish would be cleaned every day or every other day. It won't look as natural, but is it a safer bet than risking a bacterial bloom in the pond water? As I said I'm not entirely sure how to set up a pond, so am I wrong in assuming it'd be less safe?

Also, I will be using coco fiber as a substrate, with some large leaf litter on top (and of course a drainage layer and mesh divider). How often will I need to completely change the substrate if it's planted with lots of live plants?

[deranged chipmunk]

Are you doing a false bottom, or a hydroton base, like the standard dart frog fare?

[HerpDerp]

With a false bottom and live plants and proper spot cleaning the substrate doesn't really need to be changed completely. Just make sure you clean up poops when you find them. Getting isopods to act as a cleaning crew helps too.

As far as a pond goes, as long as it's done properly and has a sufficient filter it is perfectly safe to do. And if you have a waterfall for it too it will greatly improve humidity.

[NatureLady]

To each their own on this question, but as long as any water has enough safe entrances and exits the frog should be ok. Filteration is key on the pond/pool, while routine changing/cleaning of the water bowl is also key.

[Stickyfeet]

As of right now the plan is to use Feather-Lite from Welcome to Black Jungle Terrarium Supply - The Natural Choice! and divide it from the substrate with Zoomed terrarium substrate mesh. Then I plan to top it with coco fiber and some leaf litter. If i wanted to make a water feature would I need a false bottom? Would I need to silicone a glass divider into the tank? How would I filter it properly? It seems like there is a lot of different options out there and I'm just trying to narrow it down.

Michelle, I definitely plan on having to find and clean up all their poop, and I intend to buy a springtail culture to get things started.

Bill, last night I read your posts about your 150gl WTF tank and your Madagascar tank. Those are just amazing! I don't think I'm ready for something that complex yet though. But clearly you have lots of experience with this.

[NatureLady]

Joleen...Bill is just a show off. No really he does great stuff and great guides! Bill I couldn't help myself lol

From my personal experience, if you want a water feature do a false bottom. I am currently building one and I keep telling myself that it will be amazing when done. I did a water feature in a hydroton/coco fiber set up as my starter viv. The coco fiber just found it's way into my pump. It was really pretty, but a major pain. I tore it apart 2 months after I finished it because of the pump issues and just put a water bowl instead. That is my next project and my viv for my WTF. I will be doing a egg crate and stump viv that will rock my White's socks off!!!

My over all advise...keep looking at other peoples builds. Google search photos to give you an even bigger picture. The possibilities are endless!!!!

[deranged chipmunk]

ok, sorry, now i can wrap my brain around it. i just checked that feather lite out. ehhh....i think if i was gonna go that route, i would just smash up some lava rock. lol $4 for a 40lb bag of lava rock versus $12 + shipping for pumice? you don't have to go by me, go with what you are comfortable using and Black Jungle is an excellent place.

a false bottom is not necessary to make a water feature, but it does make it easier. i recommend you start easy, no water feature. why complicate things right off the bat? there's plenty of time in life for other builds

oh, and get isopods as well. springtails are great, but tiny, the more cleaners you have, the less you will eventually have to do.

changing water in the setup you have planned is easy. get yourself a length of 1/2" pvc pipe, about as long as the tank is high. this is going to hold your drainage tube. what i have done in the past at this point, is drilled some holes at the base of the pvc pipe, about as high as your planned water level, then silicone some fiberglass screen around that section. that keeps the holes from clogging. others do it differently. insert a piece of aquarium airline tubing down the hole and you can now siphon the water from the tank. btw, mount the pvc in the back corner of the tank. it can be hidden by plants. i hope that makes sense.

and thank you for the kind words Joleen, i really appreciate it

[deranged chipmunk]

Joleen...Bill is just a show off. No really he does great stuff and great guides! Bill I couldn't help myself lol

that's why you're my favorite Capital B on here Amanda. you give it right back to me....LOL respect

[Stickyfeet]

Bill, so your saying to drain the water in my dish that way, or if I had a pond in there? I just planned on lifting the dish out and washing it.

I agree I think I should start easy and just focus on keeping the tank and plants healthy until I feel comfortable with the whole thing, so I'll stick with the dish. Your threads will definitely be something I'll consult when I'm ready to upgrade though. As for the Feather-Lite, I already bought it. Gotta love those rewards points and gift certificates. But I'll keep in mind that there are cheaper ways to do things next time. Where can I get other isopods and what ones should i get? The springtails will be coming from a friend.

Michelle, he is clearly a show off.
Personal experience offers the best advice. I'll keep that in mind when I do a water feature on the next one. Can't wait to see pictures of when you're done with your project! And those google searches are killing me. I was up until 5am looking at all the possibilities! It's just incredible what can be done! I think the future will be bright for my White's as well!

Thank you both for your help! Really glad I found this site!

[deranged chipmunk]

sorry, should have mentioned that. if you build the pond, that would be the way to drain it.

isopods here :
Isopods at Josh's Frogs

the pond part is simple. you'll just have the feather lite a little lower in the pond section and no coco fiber on top of it. make sense?