Moss: the other substrate.

[motiszm]

I think it's time for some healthy debate . I propose that for tong fed (this distinction is important) horned frogs moss is superior to coco fiber and foam as a substrate.

Four reasons:
It holds water like none other, keeping the tank nice and humid.
It doesn't cling all over the frog, keeping them nice and pretty to show off and is more natural and requires much less work than foam.
Just as easy for the frog to burrow into as coco fiber.
It comes in big bags for cheap at Home Depot.

What do you guys think?

[DeeDub]

It molds; and decomposes which creates a science project in your frog's cage. BOOM!!!!



Plus, I like my frogs dirty!! :-)

[motiszm]

It molds; and decomposes which creates a science project in your frog's cage. BOOM!!!!



Plus, I like my frogs dirty!! :-)

Ha ha, well to each his own. The molding/decomposing could be another benefit - visual cue that it needs changing!

[MatthewM1]

Ha ha, well to each his own. The molding/decomposing could be another benefit - visual cue that it needs changing!

But by allowing it to mold or start to go bad before you change it you are culturing who knows what in your frogs terrarium. People should be proactive and change substrate before decomposition occurs regardless of what type it is.

I have the same opinion as deedub on this one. Who doesn't want a big dirty insect annihilator

[motiszm]

But by allowing it to mold or start to go bad before you change it you are culturing who knows what in your frogs terrarium. People should be proactive and change substrate before decomposition occurs regardless of what type it is.

Sometimes I wonder if keeping a completely sterile cage is even desirable. Letting them sit in their own filth is obviously a bad thing (red leg is no good), spot cleaning needs to be done and the whole substrate needs to be changed out frequently, but is a bit of decomposition a bad thing? After all, these guys burrow in decomposing leaf litter in the wild.

This is kind of a ridiculous example, but I guess you could relate it to parenting styles. Some moms sanitize their children's hands after they go outside or touch anything, others let their kids get dirty and eat things off the ground. Which of these groups of kids gets sick more often?

By hyper sanitizing are we robbing our frogs of beneficial bacteria and other microbes and making them more prone to disease and infection?

[DVirginiana]

I'm not gonna attack anyone for using sphagnum as long as they tong feed or feed in another container, but all of the benefits you mentioned are really benefits for the keeper rather than the frog (less frequent misting, frog looks prettier, ect). I just prefer the cocofiber for mine. I also feel like them being able to get the substrate closely packed against them helps with temp regulation.

Sometimes I wonder if keeping a completely sterile cage is even desirable. Letting them sit in their own filth is obviously a bad thing (red leg is no good), spot cleaning needs to be done and the whole substrate needs to be changed out frequently, but is a bit of decomposition a bad thing? After all, these guys burrow in decomposing leaf litter in the wild.

This is kind of a ridiculous example, but I guess you could relate it to parenting styles. Some moms sanitize their children's hands after they go outside or touch anything, others let their kids get dirty and eat things off the ground. Which of these groups of kids gets sick more often?

By hyper sanitizing are we robbing our frogs of beneficial bacteria and other microbes and making them more prone to disease and infection?

A typical frog's tank is far from sanitary. They urinate all the time, people allow crickets or roaches to roam over the substrate for minutes at a time, and tiny bits of their shed skin are probably all over the place and we just can't see them. Add on top of that the temp and humidity are ideal for most bacteria. Cleaning tanks doesn't keep them sterile, it keeps the bacteria under control.

Decomposition is bad. It doesn't happen if bacteria aren't present, and it takes a LOT to decompose coco-fiber.