Adopted Albino Pacman Frog Help

[Pruvmerong]

Hi. I recently adopted an Albino Pacman frog. I've never owned an amphibian before so this is all new to me. After receiving the Pacman frog which came with the enclosure I started doing research and generally kept ending up on this forum. The frog seems to look healthy and it's quite big (nearly 5 inches). The original owner said it's between 2-3 years old.

I've been using Google as a source for answering most of my questions but my conscience would feel better knowing this guy will be okay. I think my pacman is really awesome and I want to do my best to keep it healthy. I've ran into a couple concerns...

- I haven't seen it eat yet; I've only had the frog 5 days and the original owner said he was fed a week ago. So he hasn't eaten anything for at least 12 days. I was told he eats mice and that he is way to big for crickets (which deemed true.. I put 3 crickets in the enclosure 2 days after getting the frog and he didn't even acknowledge them) I read that these frogs who are on this kind of diet can go quite awhile between their meals, so I'm not too concerned, however, a day after I tried feeding it crickets I went and got him a mouse. I'd really like to see this guy eat! Again, the frog just ignored it and rather bury itself. I would like to get some insight on this.. do they really start ignoring smaller prey after they've reached a certain size? Everywhere I go basically states crickets are the staple food etc.

- I'm having a little trouble with temperature. I know it may take awhile for the frog to adjust in it's new home and I don't see any visual signs of any health issues. I can't get the temperature to rise any higher then 74 Fahrenheit. From what I can tell from looking at this forum I want the temperature to be 80. I'm actually pretty concerned as people on here are pretty strict about this. I need some help. I went out and bought an Exo Terra heating pad (the guy at the pet store said extra small is what I'd want for a 10g tank). But it doesn't seem to be working? I have it placed on the side of the tank as recommended for these frogs. I've also put saran wrap on 3/4 of the tank lid. It's still not heating up.. Did I buy a heating pad too small? My next step is to buy a heating light. My frog is Albino and I read lights can actually harm this type of frog so I wanted to know exactly what I would need to get...

The frogs actions seem to be okay (I think) he just seems very lazy and basically just digs a hole and sits there with the top of his head stuck out. I haven't been handling him.. I'm kinda afraid to. I heard a frog this size can have quite the bite. My friend however is more brave. He picked him up with no hassle at all and the frog just let him. I dug him up today because he's been burrowed in the same spot for almost 3 days but he looks to be fine. His skin looks moist and it doesn't look like it's getting hard or anything. He basically went to the edge of the tank and back again then burrowed. I was considering the tank may be a little too small. He can't really do much in there..

I've filled out the questionnaire and I'll attach pictures of the frog and my setup. I would very much appreciate any help or advice. If I'm doing something wrong please tell me! Thanks

1. Size of enclosure - 10g
2. # of inhabitants - One Albino Pacman Frog
3. Humidity - usually between 80-90
4. Temperature - 72-74
5. Water - Aqua Pro Tap Water conditioner with Aloe Vera
6. Materials used for substrate - Exo Terra Plantation Soil
7. Enclosure set up - Two fake plants. 4 inch substrate. Water Dish half full.
- I haven't cleaned the whole tank yet. But I'll make sure to wash everything with hot De-chloride water.
8. Main food source - Was told mice with feeder fish once in awhile.
9. Vitamins and calcium? Haven't thought this far yet. I will once she starts eating.
10. Lighting - Just a desk lamp shining in the tanks direction.
11. What is being used to maintain the temperature of the enclosure - Extra Small Exo Terra Heating Pad
12. When is the last time he/she ate - Approx 12-13 days ago..
13. Have you found poop lately - Only the day I got the frog. I've seen it pee though.
14. A pic would be helpful including frog and enclosure - Will attach pictures
15. How old is the frog - Approx 2-3 years old
16. How long have you owned him/her - 5 days
17. Is the frog wild caught or captive bred - No idea.. If this is crucial I can probably find out.
18. Frog food- how often and if it is diverse, what other feeders are used as treats - Haven't experimented with food yet. Been told mice and feeder fish from original owner
19. How often the frog is handled - Once in 5 days.
20. Is the enclosure kept in a high or low traffic area - Currently in my living room since it's the warmest place in my house. Won't be permanent once I get the heating issue fixed.
21. Describe enclosure maintenance (water changes, cleaning, etc) - I've been making sure the water is cleaned and I mist every couple hours if the humidity drops.

[EJT97]

I keep WTF but your frog burrowing is because the humidity is low, or he is stressed and finding it hard to adjust to his new home. Sorry I don't know more!

[Maharg]

I dont think you need to be concerned just yet. I commend you on being very well read on frog husbandry before you purchased. I have a lot of respect for anyone who goes into it with knowledge enough to keep the frog happy and alive. Grif will be able to answer your question better than me but I can address a few issues.

1) Note that its common for Pacmans not to eat for a few days after moving. They 99% of the time overcome this, and the fact that the frog had gone a week without eating prior to this isnt all that significant. These frogs can go months without eating is come cases.

2) Yes, Pacmans will sometimes become picky after being fed nothing but large prey items such as rodents over long periods of time. A staple of rodents although is very unhealthy and can eventually prove fatal or cause blindness from fat deposits over the eyes. You may need to consider force feeding if this persists. I see no other option really. Ill admit that I know absolutely nothing about force feeding, what it entails, or if its even a viable option for an adult Pacman. I have never had to deal with this. Knock on wood.

3) Your humidity may be to high. Frogs skin is highly permeable and prolonged periods of 90% humidity can be too humid and detrimental. Try to aim for 80%. Try only covering 50% of the top with saran wrap. You also want to keep airflow high. Bacteria build up will hurt your frog.

4) Yes, your temp is to low. Your frog will at some point began to aestivate if you dont correct this. Your UTH is to small for a 10 gallon. Try purchasing the next size up.

Like I said Grif can answer more. They know more than be about Albinos, what light they are sensitive to, and how you can go about raising the temp safely.

Edit: I see your from Calgary lol. Cowtown represent.

[MatthewM1]

You can try offering night crawlers, they are much bigger than crickets and easier to deal with, also not as fatty as mice

[MatthewM1]

Oh and for your temp problem try insulating 3 sides of the tank with thicker cardboard or Styrofoam it will help hold the heat a little higher untill you get a bigger uth

[Kira Hudson]

few things first he is albino you shouldnt use a bright light such as a desk lamp on him his eyes and skin are very sencitive to them and can blind him/cause great pain secound pacs arnt active frogs they dont jump around and move alot like tree frogs third you should cover three sides of his tank so he feels safe ,next feeding him just mice will kill him eventuly becuse they have way to much fat in them and should be a treat only,next adult pacs dont eat as much as baby pacs do its normal for them to eat only once or twice a week they love to bury them selfs so that is normal try a bigger heat pad see if that helps any

you ahave a great looking frog there

[Pruvmerong]

Thanks for the info. I'm not too concerned over him not eating yet. BUT this morning before I went to work I noticed he got out of his hole last night and pooped near the water dish. I think this is a good sign and could this mean he may be ready to eat now? I just bought him a heating pad so this is unfortunate I may have to buy a bigger one.. how big of a UTH do I need?

[Maharg]

Thanks for the info. I'm not too concerned over him not eating yet. BUT this morning before I went to work I noticed he got out of his hole last night and pooped near the water dish. I think this is a good sign and could this mean he may be ready to eat now? I just bought him a heating pad so this is unfortunate I may have to buy a bigger one.. how big of a UTH do I need?

Im using a medium one for a 5 gallon in a heated room. They dont provide much heat. It covers nearly half of the back of the tank and my Fantasy is always right up to it. About a centimeter away.
Do you plan on getting more amphibs? If you do, definitely consider a space heater. They are infinitely more effective and can heat several tanks at once.

[GrifTheGreat]

I also commend you on doing as much research as possible before taking on a frog for a pet. Great job: Welcome to Frog Forum.
Your heat pad is probably fine. Remove the desk lamp it is probably causing unnecessary stress and hurting her eyes. Go out and buy a Fluker's 5.5" Clamp Lamp with dimmer. The dimmer switch will allow you to adjust the heat and light output of the heat bulb. Now the heat bulb MUST be and infrared. No daylight bulbs or basking spotlights of ANY kind. Be sure that the bulb is no higher than 50 watts. 50 watts is also preferable.

When using Saran Wrap only wrap the sides of the lid and leave a gap in the center to place the lamp Cut a hole in the Saran wrap on high ends of the lid so that air can circulate through the top of the lid. . The lamp will raise the ambient air temp which should be as stated by Graham at 80°, but no higher than 85° during the day and 75° to 79° at night. Hover around 78° though. Humidity should be 75% to 80% and substrate moisture must be moist or heavily damp, but not mud.

Try Night Crawlers to see if he will eat those. If you can find Hornworms(Goliath worms) they would also be good to try.

[Pruvmerong]

I also commend you on doing as much research as possible before taking on a frog for a pet. Great job: Welcome to Frog Forum.
Your heat pad is probably fine. Remove the desk lamp it is probably causing unnecessary stress and hurting her eyes. Go out and buy a Fluker's 5.5" Clamp Lamp with dimmer. The dimmer switch will allow you to adjust the heat and light output of the heat bulb. Now the heat bulb MUST be and infrared. No daylight bulbs or basking spotlights of ANY kind. Be sure that the bulb is no higher than 50 watts. 50 watts is also preferable.

When using Saran Wrap only wrap the sides of the lid and leave a gap in the center to place the lamp Cut a hole in the Saran wrap on high ends of the lid so that air can circulate through the top of the lid. . The lamp will raise the ambient air temp which should be as stated by Graham at 80°, but no higher than 85° during the day and 75° to 79° at night. Hover around 78° though. Humidity should be 75% to 80% and substrate moisture must be moist or heavily damp, but not mud.

Try Night Crawlers to see if he will eat those. If you can find Hornworms(Goliath worms) they would also be good to try.

Thank you for your help. I will go buy one of these and go from there. Will the infrared bulb work for the 12 hour light rotation? If so what should I do at night if I require the light to be on to maintain heat levels? Can I just dim the light for night time?

[GrifTheGreat]

Thank you for your help. I will go buy one of these and go from there. Will the infrared bulb work for the 12 hour light rotation? If so what should I do at night if I require the light to be on to maintain heat levels? Can I just dim the light for night time?

You can just use the natural day/night cycle or keep the room the frog is in well lit and just turn the light keeping the room lit off at night.. You can keep the infrared bulb on 24/7 or use a Moonlight blue bulb fir night time if you'd like.. The dimmer is to lower light and heat output so to achieve the lower night temps you can dim it. I just make sure the room is lit by natural light or artificial and they recognize the photo period and adjust on their own.

As long as the room is well lit during the day and dark at night all should be fine. Keep her warm and moist and all should be well.

[Lija]

so glad this frog went to someone who cares! I exchanged a few emails with his previous owner, he knows nothing about frogs and pacmans in particular so I'm pretty sure you saved the frog. by the way it was eating adult mice every week with occasional gold fish.

welcome to the forum!

so... we have 3 people from Calgary including me here as of now! that's exciting!

[Pruvmerong]

Thanks for all the info. I'm bored so I thought I'd post an update on my frog to see if she's okay. I fed her a mouse last week and and it was quite entertaining to watch. She failed miserably and got a mouth full of dirt on her first dash. I know that's bad so hopefully she's not impacted. She basically hopped right over to the water dish and cleaned her face off and maybe tried to spit out dirt. She sat there for a bit and the mouse came near - she noticed something move and instantaneously rotated to that general direction. The mouse stepped in the water and BAM! Grabs the mouses torso and brings it into the water. She then sat there drowning the mouse until it no longer twitched and she just swallowed it. Now she is so fat! She found a nice comfy spot between the two plants I have in there and burrowed half way in. She hasn't moved once (As far as I know. Unless she gets up and goes back to exactly where she was) . I figured that is normal from after having a big meal. Maybe she just needs some relaxation to digest the food.

I have that Flukers 5.5 clamp with a dimmer switch on top of the tank. I keep it on as bright as it can go (It's 50 watts and infrared) 24/7. I find it difficult keeping the frogs temp around 80 degrees otherwise. It's kinda cold here in Calgary right now and I keep my house at around 73 during the day and 70 at night. Which brings the enclosure temp down to 76 at night. Would this be related to why the frog doesn't move? Just curious.

I'm kinda curious how long it should take her to digest an adult mouse? Also how long should I wait from disturbing her awhile she digests?

I don't think she's sick.. Some days her eyes looks half shut so I'm assuming she's just napping or something. But when I mist the tank and spray her a little she perks right up with huge eyes lol

Also.. having a hard time finding information on "Expanding" the bricks of Coco Fiber Eco Earth. Do I just soak it in dechlorinated water and take it apart? Do I have to let it dry afterwards? I just want to make sure I don't do anything wrong since I'm thinking about cleaning her enclosure tonight or on the weekend. But I wanted to know a little more about my question on the digesting length before I attempt to pick her up with my hands. Her mouth is huge and I heard it hurts to be bitten.

[Maharg]

I use about 3 liters of warm dechlorinated water per brick to expand. I pour it in about a liter at a time and work it with my hands til its the proper texture and broken up nicely.

With the mouse, id only feed once every 3 weeks MAX. Once a month is better. Have you tried Nightcrawlers or Hornworms yet?

[Pruvmerong]

I use about 3 liters of warm dechlorinated water per brick to expand. I pour it in about a liter at a time and work it with my hands til its the proper texture and broken up nicely.

With the mouse, id only feed once every 3 weeks MAX. Once a month is better. Have you tried Nightcrawlers or Hornworms yet?

No not yet. I wanted to make sure she ate something that I knew she would like before experimenting. Now that I know she isn't hungry I'm going to gradually offer her a different kind of food and see if she'll eat off tongs. Lije told me where to get those Hornworms (Or Goliath worms) here in Calgary so I'll be trying those next. They look like the biggest so I'll start there.

[DVirginiana]

For expanding the eco-earth, just get a tupperware container or a plastic bucket or something, put the brick in there, and use the treated water to expand it. You can break it up if you need to.

Frogs will blink, but they should not be sitting with their eyes closed or half-closed for long periods of time, even asleep. Can you post a picture of this?

Even though the person you got her from has been feeding frogs and fish, you really need to try and get her on a healthier diet. Feeder fish from pet stores are almost always diseased; if you ever want to give her fish, buy a pack of frozen silversides. As for the mice, it can be very dangerous to put a full grown mouse in with a frog. I really wouldn't recommend doing this again. Frogs' skin is very fragile so even a small bite or scratch from a mouse can damage it greatly.
Also, even large pacs shouldn't really be eating anything much larger than a fuzzy mouse. The hair and claws on mice don't digest well, and this is a big impaction risk. I never recommend feeding anything other than pinkies because of this (paranoid about impaction).

If the frog won't take nightcrawlers or other insects, you can try taking the insect in tongs and rubbing it on her lips. She will probably get annoyed after a few minutes and take it. Once they realize it is food, they will take it more easily.

Thanks for doing research on your pet! She's a very nice looking frog Yes, these frogs can draw blood with their bite. You're doing right, not handling her. The less stress until she gets used to her new home, the better.

[GrifTheGreat]

I second D's post but with a little extra info. While it is dangerous to offer adult mice because they can harm your frog the frog's skin while sensitive is tougher than most people think. If you ever have to give them an injection you'll discover this when you notice that the needle is having difficulty penetrating the skin. An adult mouse can and will hurt even adult frog since they can bite pretty hard and scratch. The scratching is really only bad around the eyes.

Mouse fur can and will impact the frog if your not careful. From now on when offering mice use pinky mice or fuzzies. An adult mouse will take about a week to digest.

They do occasionally sleep with their eyes closed. More than likely this is caused by you having the Light up on full blast. If you have a UTH on the side its should help maintain temps. 76° at night is fine, but keep it at 80° during the day. Having the light on full will also suck humidity out so keep an eye on it.

[Pruvmerong]

For expanding the eco-earth, just get a tupperware container or a plastic bucket or something, put the brick in there, and use the treated water to expand it. You can break it up if you need to.

Frogs will blink, but they should not be sitting with their eyes closed or half-closed for long periods of time, even asleep. Can you post a picture of this?

Even though the person you got her from has been feeding frogs and fish, you really need to try and get her on a healthier diet. Feeder fish from pet stores are almost always diseased; if you ever want to give her fish, buy a pack of frozen silversides. As for the mice, it can be very dangerous to put a full grown mouse in with a frog. I really wouldn't recommend doing this again. Frogs' skin is very fragile so even a small bite or scratch from a mouse can damage it greatly.
Also, even large pacs shouldn't really be eating anything much larger than a fuzzy mouse. The hair and claws on mice don't digest well, and this is a big impaction risk. I never recommend feeding anything other than pinkies because of this (paranoid about impaction).

If the frog won't take nightcrawlers or other insects, you can try taking the insect in tongs and rubbing it on her lips. She will probably get annoyed after a few minutes and take it. Once they realize it is food, they will take it more easily.

Thanks for doing research on your pet! She's a very nice looking frog Yes, these frogs can draw blood with their bite. You're doing right, not handling her. The less stress until she gets used to her new home, the better.

Thanks for your help. I know I need to change her diet I just wanted to her be fed as she's used to before I start experimenting with food. I'm aware it could be dangerous to put live adult mice in for the frog to hunt. But I also heard their skin is tougher then it looks as Grif mentioned. When I feed her a mouse again. Maybe next month or something, I'll try a pinky and see if she's satisfied.

I have a short clip of her eating the mouse if you/anyone would like to see it. Not the best quality though. Might be the last time she hunts prey!

I will try to take a picture of her eyes half closed. She's kind of alert right now since I just misted the tank.

[Pruvmerong]

I second D's post but with a little extra info. While it is dangerous to offer adult mice because they can harm your frog the frog's skin while sensitive is tougher than most people think. If you ever have to give them an injection you'll discover this when you notice that the needle is having difficulty penetrating the skin. An adult mouse can and will hurt even adult frog since they can bite pretty hard and scratch. The scratching is really only bad around the eyes.

Mouse fur can and will impact the frog if your not careful. From now on when offering mice use pinky mice or fuzzies. An adult mouse will take about a week to digest.

They do occasionally sleep with their eyes closed. More than likely this is caused by you having the Light up on full blast. If you have a UTH on the side its should help maintain temps. 76° at night is fine, but keep it at 80° during the day. Having the light on full will also suck humidity out so keep an eye on it.

Thanks. You're right about the light drying up the moisture. I have to mist the tank every few hours or so. When I wake up in the morning or come home from work in the evening the humidity is sometimes in the 60's. Will being in the 60's for max 3 hours a day be okay? If not I'm not sure how to fix it. I have the light on full with a heating pad on the side. Has to be on all day to maintain correct temps. I have just the center of the lid exposed with a light and saran wrap on the edges as you instructed.

[GrifTheGreat]

Thanks. You're right about the light drying up the moisture. I have to mist the tank every few hours or so. When I wake up in the morning or come home from work in the evening the humidity is sometimes in the 60's. Will being in the 60's for max 3 hours a day be okay? If not I'm not sure how to fix it. I have the light on full with a heating pad on the side. Has to be on all day to maintain correct temps. I have just the center of the lid exposed with a light and saran wrap on the edges as you instructed.

Should be ok if its only for a little part of the day. to raise humidity buy a Reptifogger or humidifier and hook it up to a timer to periodically turn on and off throughout the day and that should fix the humidity issue. Add a second heat pad for extra heat so the light digest have to be up that high. Should be fine then.