light / heat confusion ?!?

[dadmccabe]

Hey All!

I'm new to this forum. All the info has been helpful thus far, however I'm still totally confused about heat sources. I'm setting up zoo med 12x12x12. Plan on purchasing a juvenile White's as soon as I'm setup and have temps regulated. Online articles, in-store advice has me baffled re: heating.

here we go...

1. I was told that UTH is all i need b/c any light will "dry out" Dumpy's skin.

2. Was told 40 watt blue incandescent (in conjunction w/ UTH) was the way to go.

3. I've read that lower wattage is better (than the 40W)

So, i have 40W light blue bulb, a 5.5" clamp lamp (i plan on sitting flush on screen - is that ok?), and a UTH (10-20 gal which I fear might be too big now / take up too much surface area under tank)

Anyone having success with the 12x12x12 want to share their heating solutions? Should I get extra small UTH instead of Small? Am I over-thinking???

[DonLisk]

Heating the enclosure is going to mainly depend on your rooms temperatures. A whites should have enclosure temps arounf 78 degrees in the daytime and 68 to 70 degrees at night. If your room is normally 70 degrees then you only need a compact florescent bulb to add a few degrees and create a day and night time cycle. You wouldn't need a night light at all.

Since your frog is going to want a ton of height your going to find the frog will climb to the top and try to push it off and hang from it. The screen on top of the Zoo Med is going to get very hot with a 40 watt bulb right on it and your going to lose a lot of humidity out the top is you don't close a little bit of it up with a piece of glass or plexi.
I've never used UTH with any of my frogs except in the winter when I want to create a warmer side of the tank. I place the TH on the side for this.

I myself like the matching hoods they do for the Zoo med and Exo enclosures and would think more on a compact florescent. A 15watt CFL bulb with 6500K color temps is perfect for your size tank and a 24 watt for a 18x18x18 with plants and I find them at Walmart under the Reveal Label listed as Daylight 6500K. Here is a link to the case price but you can get in two packs in stores. Walmart.com: GE Energy Smart Spiral CFL Daylight Bulb, 15W, 12 Bulbs: Decor

UTH heaters work ok but can dry out substrate quickly, and the heat has to make its way through the drainage layer and then through the substrate to change the ambient air temp it the tank. Not the best thing.

If your room is always cold, then add a night 15 watt bulb in red or moon to keep temps up some. I think the 40 for night is going to be too much. Keep in mind that the forg is going to get to that metal screen on top and you don't want it scalding hot.

[dadmccabe]

WOW, Thanks Don!..Makes sense. I have not felt confident w/ the 40W OR the UTH suggestions by pet store ppl. I will take your advice..

Quick questoin re: substrates: I have coco husk, and exo-terra's Moss Matt.. can't decide which to use. You mention "drainage layer" AND "the substrate" ...I don't see many ppl include BOTH layers in tank setups.. will coco husk serve as both layers? should I be using a combo??

[DonLisk]

Are you going to include live plants?
A drainage layer is use to allow excess water or over misting to drain through the soil, preferably Eco Earth or Plantation Soil, into the drainage layer made of gravel, or hydroballs, or a false bottom made from eggcrate (lighting louvers).

If the husk is chunks, then it is a potential impaction hazard to your frog. It is hard for the frog to remove things from its mouth once they bite it, so they swallow the materials. Eco Earth and Plantation Soil are easily digested and passed through the body but the chunks and bark type items are not.... as small stones are not.

Here, many people use a drainage layer but find ways to hide it. I don't have a tank that doesn't have a drainage layer of some sort. If you over mist you end up with soaking nasty soil. If the soil drains into a drainage layer, it will either collect or evaporate. If it collects you simply slide a small hose down into it once its deep enough and siphon it off.

If you decide on a drainage layer you will need to separate the drainage layer from the substrate with a piece of substrate screen or window screen.

Now, if your planning to upgrade the tank soon, then you can get away with the Moss Mat for now since it should hold moisture for keeping humidity.

Here is a pic of the 12x12x12 that I have set up with a basic stone drainage layer, plantation soil, and one plant that has tripled in the tank since set up. Note that this is not the ideal setup for a tree frog since there is little climbing vines and branches for the frog.
I only add water to the bottom and it maintains 50 percent humidity with a Reveal Bulb and a piece of plexi glass covering 3/4 of the top. This was when it was initially put together so the plants are more grown in now.

[dadmccabe]

that looks amazing. Wow.. I was going to add one or two small live plants, however thought they might stay potted. Again, I'm not quite sure how to clean an enclosure w/ "rooted" plant life.. I totally understand the drainage layer now - thanks! I will most likely use hydro balls / screen / plantation soil combo b/c I'm wary of water "sitting" on the glass below the eggcrate. Wait... I can siphon, right?? hmmm... what to do...

Anyway, back to the top... is your light sitting right on top of the clear plexi? It there a hole cut? will heat emit thru the acrylic like that? will the metal melt the plexi?? Are you using the 15w daylight 6500 ??

I would love to set mine up same way (I work w/ pvc, plexi, acrylic, etc all day long - so I have access to materials / machinery for cutting)

[DonLisk]

If your using compact florescent lighting then you can place the light right on top of the plexi. If the tank is getting to hot, then you just raise the light. My plexi warps slightly and occasionally I just flip it over to start the warping the other direction. If it is cut correctly to size then it shouldn't warp.

If you use too intense a bulb then you may cause plexi to melt but then use glass instead. The whole idea behind covering part of the top is to help keep the humidity in. An open top loses humidity fast and a light of any sort burns off the humidity too.

as for the plants and a tank like above, there is not real maintenance except cleaning glass and spot picking up droppings since the droppings you don't see will fertilize plants. If you use plants, then they must be rinsed off completely including the fertilized soil. You just replant into the plantation soil and use the 6500K daylight bulb for the plants.

I think your going to find your frog is going to grow out of that tank quickly. I had 4 WTFs in a 18x18x24H Zoo Med and it never seemed like enough for them since they were extremely active at night.

Here is a pic of that viv: