Estivation Crisis....Please advise

[Sandy Bear]

Ok, so I don't think my Budgett’s Frog is going to make it. She looks quite poorly to me, and I don't know if I should euthanize her or if this is "normal" and just wait and see.

I wasn't planning on estivating her until next year, but my Bridget had other plans and put them into action this week. She is my first Budget’s Frog, so I'm not very familiar with what to look for in regards to estivating.

But this week, she started to shed a lot, and now, she looks pretty much in full on estivation mode. Her eyes and face are covered by some shed, she has bits of shed all over her body, and she is very dozy and uncoordinated when she is disturbed.

She hasn't eaten in a while, so I'm not worried about food rotting in her gut if she can actually successfully estivate.
She's lost a bit of weight this fall, and that was my fault as I was toying with the idea of estivating her so I would stop feeding her for two weeks, but then would get cold feet about it, and start feeding her again. I did that a few times, before I decided to wait until next year. I've read a few posts about Budgett’s frogs dying during estivation, and it got me scared. Under normal circumstances, it's enough of a weight loss to affect her, but because she is going to be estivating, I'm concerned that it will.

Her tummy is also pinkish in color instead of the more whitish color that is normally is. I did the Lamisil treatment on all my frogs last year, and my Whites Tree Frogs tummies turned a pinkish color after they finished their baths for a little while afterwards. Anyways, it's a similar color pink.

Bridget lives in about 10 gallons of water, she has the bigger half of an Exoterra 36x18x18 terrarium. She has 1 fake plant and a fake rock hide for decoration. There is also an internal filter in the tank and a T8 strip light on top.
Her diet consists mainly of CB insects, plus Canadian or European Nightcrawlers. She also ate a live mouse once. The pet shop fed her crickets and mollies/guppies.
The temperature in my apartment is usually around 24-26C, but she has been exposed to anything around 22-32C
I've owned Bridgett for about 1-1/2 years, and she is about 2-1/2 years old. I bought her from the pet shop in town

I have a 10 gallon tub that is filled about 2/3 of the way with 6 bricks of coco-fiber and a shallow water dish on top. I put her in that, but she doesn't look like she wants to dig down. I know I waited to long to put her down for the winter, but I'm not sure if I should help her out a little and dig her down part of the way and have her partially covered? I'm just worried that she will dry out if she doesn't start to dig down.


Bridget's been doing this for the last two days. She has just a bit of her head above water, and supports herself by holding on to the filter or the hide. She does go completely submerged every once in a while for a time.


This is the shed skin that sloughed off this week


This is the tub I set up for her


This is Bridget just before going into her tub


Sorry for the long post, I'm just concerned about her, and if she is poorly, I don't want her to suffer.
If anyone has any advice on estivating Budgett's frogs, I would appreciate hearing about it.

Thanks
-Sandy

[DonLisk]

Although I don't have experience with this frog, I found this information from the link provided below.
Quote""Remove the Budgett's frog from his water home and place him in the dry aestivation tank. He will instinctively start to burrow down to the bottom of the container, and his skin will shed and form a protective cocoon encasing his body. Aestivation will last for a couple of months, and can last as long as 9 months. ""End Quote

Hope someone with experience in this will reply.

Link to information I found on web: Budgett's Frog (Lepidobatrachus laevis) - talk to the frog

[GrifTheGreat]

I'm no expert and have no experiance with Budgetts or estivation, but I do know that they are supposed to be pretty fat before putting down for hibernation. At this point she is probably to far underweight to do so. It may be possible to revive her from this state. I'm not too sure how when its not under normal hibernation conditions. Are theiir any Herp vets near you? Hopefully someone can help you through this and save her. I also hope that Don's link helps.

[Sandy Bear]

I would like to revive her out of this actually if I can, I'm just not sure on how to do that.

The care sheet that Don posted is mine. I wrote that the week I bought Bridgett. I was not impressed that there wasn't a good care sheet out there on them, and I went though every bit of information I could find on them to make that care sheet up. Unfortunately there isn't a lot of information out there on them, so it's hard to know what is right to do.

I know how to estivate them, I just don't think she is fit to do it, as this is the first time with her. I'm stressed out about it, because she looks like she is going to die on me.
My BF wants be to put her back in her tank, or at least in water. I think I will do that.
I may even give her a honey bath to see if that helps.

I have a vet that will see me, and get me what ever I need in order to help my frogs, but the problem is, that they are not experienced with frogs. So if I don't know how to fix this, chances are they won't know either. They are a "farm vet" type facility, they mostly see cows, sheep, horses, elk, etc... They have recently started to get into other types of animals, domestic pets like dogs and cats, reptiles, etc.... As far as I know, I'm their only "frog" client. I got them a copy of the Amphibian Medicine and Captive Husbandry book, so that will help them some. I have a copy of "Amphibian Medicine and Captive Husbandry" (veterinary text). I'm going to be doing some reading tonight.

We have another vet in town that supposed to be an "exotics" vet. I've been there twice a few years ago, and I won't go back there if I can help it. To be perfectly honest, I would rather cut my arm off then have to see that vet ever again. From what I can tell, she is not actually qualified to see reptiles and amphibians, I think she is more small animals like rodents, rabbits, etc...

I'm not confident that she will survive long unfortunately, that's why I think it might be kinder to euthanize her, unless someone else has some suggestions.

[Sandy Bear]

The honey bath seems to be helping loads. Her eyes are open and clear, she is more alert, and is getting quite defensive when I touch her. Her tummy is still pink.
I mixed the honey in warm water. This was my first time using it. I only just found out about the honey from the first aid page on this site.

Bridgett weights 78 grams. I'm not sure what they are supposed to weight, but in case anyone is wondering. She is about 4.5" SVL

I'm going to sanitize her tank later, and I will be giving more honey baths.

Should I try to get her to eat? Maybe tomorrow.
I can't see her wanting to eat now, she doesn’t like to be bothered much before she gets fed.

[GrifTheGreat]

I would let her rest and feed her tomorrow. If she won't feed on her own I would try to force feed. Watch your fingers ;P. I hope the honey brings her out of it. You could also try the pedialite bath. Don knows the mixture ratio. I believe its 10 to 1. With unflavored formula.