Gorilla Fur (redwood mulch)

[Badger]

Both play sand and mulch are unsafe, they can cause impaction and kill your frog, the best substrate to use (in my opinion) is coco-fiber (not to be confused with coco-husk). The biggest name brand is Eco-Earth by zoo med.

[TANK]

well i know for a fact play sand is safe since ive been using it in a mixture with cocofiber with my african bullfrogs and my toad
but i just wanted to know if it is toxic to my toad
im not too worried about impaction since i only tong feed

[Badger]

If you ONLY tong feed then either would be safe, I believe redwood is non toxic. and if you don't tong feed, playsand and mulch both are very dangerous.

[Kurt]

Redwood is a conifer and most conifers are toxic to frogs. So unless someone more in the know than myself chimes in, I would avoid redwood.

[Badger]

I had no clue it was a conifer. Whoops. Yeah, avoid it.

[Kurt]

Never been to California, eh?

[Badger]

Haha, nope. Only here in new england sadly. I knew redwoods were the HUGE trees, but I thought they were hardwood.

[SludgeMunkey]

Both play sand and mulch are unsafe, they can cause impaction and kill your frog, the best substrate to use (in my opinion) is coco-fiber (not to be confused with coco-husk). The biggest name brand is Eco-Earth by zoo med.

Sand- True
Mulch- Depends on the mulch

Coco-fiber and coco- husk are the same product. They are just different forms of coir.

As for redwood, never use this stuff. It is OK for orchids, but bad for living animals.

Over on Caudata Culture Articles, I have an article that discusses what wood products are safe to use for amphibians.

[Badger]

I was under the impression that coco-husk was un-ground, having big chips in it that run the risk of impaction, and coco-fiber was complete ground and resembled dirt more than mulch. Granted they are both coir, I believe they are different products. Exo-Terra sells the husk, and Zoo Med sells the fiber, of which Zoo Med is the best choice.

[TANK]

good to know
thanks for the input everyone

[Poly]

Both play sand and mulch are unsafe, they can cause impaction and kill your frog, the best substrate to use (in my opinion) is coco-fiber (not to be confused with coco-husk). The biggest name brand is Eco-Earth by zoo med.

I disagree! If an amphibian comes from a naturally sandy enviroment, there is no reason that sand cannot be used in it's vivarium. My american toads have a mixture of sand and soil in their viv (used to be straight sand, had to mix in soil for the plants to grow), they hunt in the viv for their food (I do not tong feed them) and they are fine.

Sand does not cause impaction, I know this for a fact because my american toad shed on 100% sand while being partially burrowed, and it's shed was FULL of sand. It ate the entire shed, sand and all and was fine, now is still fine 2 months later. Sand is small, if ingested, it is easily passed.

Where are you getting your information about how "unsafe sand" is?

[Poly]

Oh, and chances are, a Bufo alvarius (Colorado River Toad) is WC and used to a sandy enviroment.

[SludgeMunkey]

True, but a wet sandy environment is NOT an enclosure in your home. I am against the use of sand for terrestrial amphibians less due to impaction and more due to the fact wet sand goes foul very quickly. This results in death of the specimen due to fungal or bacterial issues.


Personally, I suggest a mix of organic topsoil and coir for toads. North American toads in particular like to burrow and need a substrate that can withstand burrowing. Sand alone does not do this as in order to keep it wet enough to compact, it is too wet for the toads.


Trust me when I say that a coir/soil mix is best.

[Poly]

True, but a wet sandy environment is NOT an enclosure in your home. I am against the use of sand for terrestrial amphibians less due to impaction and more due to the fact wet sand goes foul very quickly. This results in death of the specimen due to fungal or bacterial issues.


Personally, I suggest a mix of organic topsoil and coir for toads. North American toads in particular like to burrow and need a substrate that can withstand burrowing. Sand alone does not do this as in order to keep it wet enough to compact, it is too wet for the toads.


Trust me when I say that a coir/soil mix is best.

Who said anything about it being wet? I keep my substrate "damp" and they have NO problem burrowing in it. When I used 100% sand for their substrate, they'd burrow all the time! And I NEVER have problems with "fungal or bacterial issues".

Here's just one of many photos I took:

[Poly]

Here's the toad that ate it's sand covered shed:

[Badger]

I know that sand can cause impaction in herptiles, toads may be an exception, but there are some nasty horror stories of beardie impactions due to sand, but beardies are at a higher risk for it due to their poorly designed digestive tract. I don't see how it would be impossible to cause impaction in amphibians though, just because they are so small. I have never personally encountered any instances of amphiban impaction, but I would rather be safe than sorry. There is a reason lifespans are shorter in the wild. Just because it comes from that environment does not mean the conditions are optimum for survival. Bearded dragons come from a sandy (Though, there are a bunch of other types of substrate that they encounter, ex: rocks/soil) environment, and sand is terrible to use for them. As for the fungal/bacterium: I'm not sure if you would be able to see either, but I am not very educated in either of them

I like a healthy debate once in a while =D

[SludgeMunkey]

Who said anything about it being wet? I keep my substrate "damp" and they have NO problem burrowing in it. When I used 100% sand for their substrate, they'd burrow all the time! And I NEVER have problems with "fungal or bacterial issues".

Here's just one of many photos I took:

Easy there.

If you did not want opinions from other keepers, why post in a public forum?

[Poly]

Easy there.

If you did not want opinions from other keepers, why post in a public forum?

I was simply stating my opinion, well rather fact with my amphibains and replying to your post.