Mealworms vs Crickets vs any other bug!

[LazyEyedFroggie]

What's the best food for medium sized toads/frogs? (about 2 inches)

[frogluver]

For pet amphibians (amphibians bought at the pet store), I would say crickets are the best choice. Mealworms are ok, but too much of this insect can cause problems. I don’t like wax worms or earthworms because they always give my frogs diaherria when I feed them these, including my Whites tree frog. For wild (captive) amphibians, I would say spiders, moths, daddy long-legs, grasshoppers, beetles, and lace wings are excellent in addition to crickets. However, if you do harvest insects—as I do in the summer for my Wood frogs— make sure that no pesticides or other harmful substances are sprayed in your area.

[LazyEyedFroggie]

Thank-you! Great advice, especially with the separate diet of captive bred vs wild

[frogluver]

Your welcome !
How are your Wood frog froglets doing and the female frog you recuperated, how is she?

[Sublime]

Dubia roaches are the best, hands down. Small-medium nymphs would be appropriately sized. Dubbed the best feeder insect in the world, research them and you'll see why. The effort of starting a colony and paying the price might turn you off, but the reward is endless. Crickets are more commonly available, the price you can't beat and availability. Not a lot of nutritional value though unfortunately, but with occasional supplemented dustings and prior gut loading should give your toad/frog proper nutrition. Mealworms are the larvae of a beetle (Hence containing chitin), once they pupate they are very high in chitin making up their hard outer exoskeleton. Not a great protein-fat ratio either. I would try red wigglers or night crawlers, although maybe not since frogluver said they give her frog diarrhea. I would still try them out though. All frogs can handle some parasite loads, it's when they're stressed commonly in captivity is when it is deadly. Weakened immune system leads to illness, pre-mature death.

[Kreamcheese]

Dubia roaches are the best, hands down. Small-medium nymphs would be appropriately sized. Dubbed the best feeder insect in the world, research them and you'll see why. The effort of starting a colony and paying the price might turn you off, but the reward is endless. Crickets are more commonly available, the price you can't beat and availability. Not a lot of nutritional value though unfortunately, but with occasional supplemented dustings and prior gut loading should give your toad/frog proper nutrition. Mealworms are the larvae of a beetle (Hence containing chitin), once they pupate they are very high in chitin making up their hard outer exoskeleton. Not a great protein-fat ratio either. I would try red wigglers or night crawlers, although maybe not since frogluver said they give her frog diarrhea. I would still try them out though. All frogs can handle some parasite loads, it's when they're stressed commonly in captivity is when it is deadly. Weakened immune system leads to illness, pre-mature death.

I was hoping somebody would say dubias. I just ordered mine and hope to start my colony soon. Ordered 15 females/6 males and 50 large nymphs. Is that good for a start? I plan to use crickets still for the next few months before digging into my roaches.

[Sublime]

I was hoping somebody would say dubias. I just ordered mine and hope to start my colony soon. Ordered 15 females/6 males and 50 large nymphs. Is that good for a start? I plan to use crickets still for the next few months before digging into my roaches.

It's usually recommended to start atleast a 100-200 adults. Your 50 large nymphs should be ready to molt into an adult female or male though so that's good. You can start out with that many, it's just going to take longer before you should start picking out of it.

What kind of frogs do you have to feed? If it's a larger more voracious eater like a pixie or pacman, it will take around 4-7 months guessing on the amount you have. If it's a smaller frog that mainly feeds on small-med range nymphs it will only take you a few months depending on the amount of frogs you have maybe longer. Your going to have to wait awhile till they start to really thrive based on the conditions you have them bred in. I'm also feeding mine crickets till my colony gets going, he eats so many of them though it's ridiculous.

I go through 250 large crickets in a few days with one juvenile pixie. Atleast they're cheap in bulk. Definitely not breeding them, they're a pain.

Sorry got a little off the roach topic, just make sure to keep the temps 90-95, oranges for breeding offered with other fruits or vegetables if you choose, moderate humidity, protein chow, cram them together (they're a social roach and production goes quicker when they're in close quarters). They should breed fairly quick for you, your frog will be very happy.

[Kreamcheese]

It's usually recommended to start atleast a 100-200 adults. Your 50 large nymphs should be ready to molt into an adult female or male though so that's good. You can start out with that many, it's just going to take longer before you should start picking out of it.

What kind of frogs do you have to feed? If it's a larger more voracious eater like a pixie or pacman, it will take around 4-7 months guessing on the amount you have. If it's a smaller frog that mainly feeds on small-med range nymphs it will only take you a few months depending on the amount of frogs you have maybe longer. Your going to have to wait awhile till they start to really thrive based on the conditions you have them bred in. I'm also feeding mine crickets till my colony gets going, he eats so many of them though it's ridiculous.

I go through 250 large crickets in a few days with one juvenile pixie. Atleast they're cheap in bulk. Definitely not breeding them, they're a pain.

Sorry got a little off the roach topic, just make sure to keep the temps 90-95, oranges for breeding offered with other fruits or vegetables if you choose, moderate humidity, protein chow, cram them together (they're a social roach and production goes quicker when they're in close quarters). They should breed fairly quick for you, your frog will be very happy.

Not meaning to hijack this thread but thanks for the help. I have 1 pacman, 2 white lips, 2 small tarantulas and a few salamanders to feed. Wont be feeding the adults or large nymphs to anything but the pacman. And I know the temp needs to be high. Do you just have a giant heat mat wrapped around or how do you get the heat that high?

[Sublime]

Not meaning to hijack this thread but thanks for the help. I have 1 pacman, 2 white lips, 2 small tarantulas and a few salamanders to feed. Wont be feeding the adults or large nymphs to anything but the pacman. And I know the temp needs to be high. Do you just have a giant heat mat wrapped around or how do you get the heat that high?

Yeah no problem; sorry I'm typing this on my iphone if the responses come late.

I have a 22 gallon rubbermaid roughneck tote with a medium 30-40 gallon zoo-med under tank heater stuck to the bottom (also bought the zoo-med rheostat to adjust the heat, it's on max right now). It takes up pretty much the whole bottom floor of the bin. It's around 100-105 at the bottom, temperature drops as they move up the egg flats a the heat is dispersed throughout.

If you are still having a hard time keeping the temperatures high with an outside heat mat, flukers makes an internal heat mat that can be placed in the bottom of the bin. That should definitely heat the ambient air up in there for you. Other than that all I can say is just try to keep them in a warmish-area with insulation also allowing air flow to come in through the ventilation cut out. Some people will wrap a fairly large heat mat around the sides where the egg flats will be, this will also work too.

If you want to stick the heat mat to the side of the tote or bottom and that mat doesn't have an adhesive end you can go to a local hardware store and pick up some ul listed foil tape for heat transfer.

[Kreamcheese]

Yeah no problem; sorry I'm typing this on my iphone if the responses come late.

I have a 22 gallon rubbermaid roughneck tote with a medium 30-40 gallon zoo-med under tank heater stuck to the bottom (also bought the zoo-med rheostat to adjust the heat, it's on max right now). It takes up pretty much the whole bottom floor of the bin. It's around 100-105 at the bottom, temperature drops as they move up the egg flats a the heat is dispersed throughout.

If you are still having a hard time keeping the temperatures high with an outside heat mat, flukers makes an internal heat mat that can be placed in the bottom of the bin. That should definitely heat the ambient air up in there for you. Other than that all I can say is just try to keep them in a warmish-area with insulation also allowing air flow to come in through the ventilation cut out. Some people will wrap a fairly large heat mat around the sides where the egg flats will be, this will also work too.

If you want to stick the heat mat to the side of the tote or bottom and that mat doesn't have an adhesive end you can go to a local hardware store and pick up some ul listed foil tape for heat transfer.

I was actually thinking about using those electric heaters for backs and necks and just put that under the tote. Think those are pretty cheap at walmart would that work you think? Thanks again for the advice I really appreciate it!

[Sublime]

I was actually thinking about using those electric heaters for backs and necks and just put that under the tote. Think those are pretty cheap at walmart would that work you think? Thanks again for the advice I really appreciate it!

Are you talking about just a normal heat pad found in the pharmacy section of Walmart instead of a heat mat specified for reptiles? Yeah that will work as long as it gets pretty hot, say around 100F and doesn't have a auto shut off so you can have it on 24/7. It's advisable to get a rheostat if you are unsure of how how hot it will get, however heating devices such as those aren't meant to heat out of control (extreme) so you should be fine. No problem, by the way.

[LazyEyedFroggie]

They're all doing great! The one-eyed frog is still out and about, but she is hiding a bit more often, probably in preparation for hibernating
I have 2 Wood Froglets, and 2 Western Toadlets, I am just starting to figure out their adult diets. I have considered Dubias, but no local pet stores carry them, and I don't have a credit card for online buying.... Otherwise, I'd have no problem breeding them. How great are the benefits of Roaches? I currently supplement the small crickets with Flukers caulcium and phosphorus powder. Occasionally I give them moth larvae from around my house.

[Sublime]

They're all doing great! The one-eyed frog is still out and about, but she is hiding a bit more often, probably in preparation for hibernating
I have 2 Wood Froglets, and 2 Western Toadlets, I am just starting to figure out their adult diets. I have considered Dubias, but no local pet stores carry them, and I don't have a credit card for online buying.... Otherwise, I'd have no problem breeding them. How great are the benefits of Roaches? I currently supplement the small crickets with Flukers caulcium and phosphorus powder. Occasionally I give them moth larvae from around my house.

This is what I can come up with off my head after researching them for about a month.

Dubia Roaches

.::Pros::.
Perfect size, not too big and not too small reaching maturity
No smell (A dozen crickets can stink more than 2000 roaches in a bin that is cleaned monthly)
No jumping/flying/climbing (Little baby nymphs can climb, just use plastic tape around the side walls, no escapes)
No noise (Little bit of rustling from them walking on the egg flats if you listen closely)
No biting
Long living (1-1 1/2 years after maturing)
Hardy
Retain nutrients for up to 48-72 hours
Low maintenance
All digestible besides the male wings when they reach maturity
High meat-to-shell ratio
Nutritional value of 1 dubia = 10-12 crickets of the same size
Breed fast (Females produce 30-40 baby nymphs in good conditions)
Great for training your frog to be tong fed

.::Cons::.
Bunker down when fed
More expensive
Not as available as crickets
Phobia
Takes awhile to establish a colony

Crickets

.::Pros::.
Available
Cheap
Soft body
Breed fast (Live short lives, annoying to breed)
Retain Nutrients for up to 18-24 hours

.::Cons::.
Bite
Bad meat-to-shell ratio
Contain chitin
Jump
Have to be gut loaded with enough nutrition 24 hours before feeding to be of any nutritional value for your herps
Not very digestible
Harder to catch for your frog
Even adults are small for larger reptiles/amphibians
Noisy
Smell
Not hardy

I'm not biased at all, I still use crickets for feeding my frog while I'm establishing my dubia colony so he doesn't wipe it out. When I researched all the positives of dubias compared to crickets, it was the easiest decision I made to start breeding them. It's been proven that the frogs primarily fed on a dubia diet just grow faster, grow bigger, overall just the best thing you could offer. I don't know what else to tell you about where you can get them since you said you can't buy online or none of your pet shops carry them. You could try going to a herp expo/convention in your area if they have them around you, they should be offered there by one of the booths. You could ask staff working at a reptile shop near you if they could special order the dubias to their shop for you, although that could get pricey. Hope this helps.

[LazyEyedFroggie]

Wow, the Dubias certainly have a lot in favor for them. I'll do the best I can to get some, but it may be tricky

[frogluver]

They're all doing great! The one-eyed frog is still out and about, but she is hiding a bit more often, probably in preparation for hibernating
I have 2 Wood Froglets, and 2 Western Toadlets, I am just starting to figure out their adult diets. I have considered Dubias, but no local pet stores carry them, and I don't have a credit card for online buying.... Otherwise, I'd have no problem breeding them. How great are the benefits of Roaches? I currently supplement the small crickets with Flukers caulcium and phosphorus powder. Occasionally I give them moth larvae from around my house.

That's good to hear, especially since winter is so near.Today it started to snow here in Alaska. Hopfully you'll be able to find her next spring. Oh and those are adorable pictures of your Western toadlets you posted in your album!

[steest]

Another feeder that you may try, since you have smaller frogs, is a feeder roach called Blatta Lateralis. (called rusty reds or Turkistan Roach) It is perfect for smaller sized phibs/herps because the adults are just a little bit bigger than crickets. They are pretty dang cheap too. They are also different from dubias because they lay egg cases instead of the live-bearing dubias, and they are known to reproduce fast. If you wish to feed CRICKET sized insects, I believe blatta lateralis are the way to go. They are kept almost exactly like dubia.

Here is some places you can buy them...

Blatta lateralis (Turkestan Roach) - Greg's Exotic Inverts

Blatta lateralis a.k.a Rusty Reds 100 | Aaron Pauling.com


I just bought a culture and cannot wait to get them going!

[Sublime]

Another feeder that you may try, since you have smaller frogs, is a feeder roach called Blatta Lateralis. (called rusty reds or Turkistan Roach) It is perfect for smaller sized phibs/herps because the adults are just a little bit bigger than crickets. They are pretty dang cheap too. They are also different from dubias because they lay egg cases instead of the live-bearing dubias, and they are known to reproduce fast. If you wish to feed CRICKET sized insects, I believe blatta lateralis are the way to go. They are kept almost exactly like dubia.

Here is some places you can buy them...

Blatta lateralis (Turkestan Roach) - Greg's Exotic Inverts

Blatta lateralis a.k.a Rusty Reds 100 | Aaron Pauling.com


I just bought a culture and cannot wait to get them going!

I approve this post. Blatta Lateralis are very fast breeders, comparable nutritional value to dubias. Just a little smaller. Blatta Lateralis are also the alternative to Lobster Roaches because they don't climb.