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Thread: Hello from Atlanta GA

  1. #121
    poison beauties
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    Default Re: Hello from Atlanta GA

    Quote Originally Posted by SethD View Post
    And your apparently twenty nine, so? I have been keeping reptiles since I was 4 years old and basically grew up in the hobby. Some of my earliest memories are reptile and amphibian related. I have been interested in in the hobby as long as I can remember, no doubt at least partially due to an older brother that was into the hobby from when I was very little up until I was around 11-12 . I used to study the price lists my older brother got from glades herp back when bill love still ran it and wish I had enough money to buy some of those animals like my brother did. We would sit up in our bunk beds reading reptile/amphibian books plotting about what we would get as well as pouring over price lists. As I got older I slowly started to get enough money here and there to buy some animals instead of just keeping what I could catch. I am sure many long time hobbyist, including yourself possibly, can relate. What does that mean? Not much, it certainly doesn't make me a genius or somehow superior to someone else that didn't grow up that way, but yes I do remember the reptile trade in the 90's pretty well.

    Unfortunately most of your posts have moved into the realm of just plain silliness and can't really be responded to very fully without either laughing at you or responding in a equally ridiculous fashion. Joking around with people insulting everyone is funny to a point but I do tire of it eventually, it just gets boring. If you have something reasonable to say and can refrain from insulting everyone that disagrees with you fine, I am still quite capable of responding to logic if you care to present any. If not though I no longer see a reason to respond as I have both already presented my points and had a chuckle over your attitude.
    Nice to know you grew up around herps. I did too but it does not mean anything. Anyone can own a few herps and claim they have been around twenty years. Like i said lets keep this on topic. Im not looking to keep your rediculously thought out replies coming. Your attitude towards this does more than make me chuckle. You actually think your words are golden. You have not contributed anything to our hobby that sets you above anyone else and if you have noone knows about it.

    If you have a thought on the subject of what make hybrids beneficial to our hobby I will hear you out. Until then your replies are just a joke. You seriously are doing nothing but increasing the chaos in this thread. Lets take the personal issues out of it.

    Michael

  2. #122
    Kurt
    Guest

    Default Re: Hello from Atlanta GA

    Michael,
    All Seth is doing is play the Devils's Advocate. He is trying to show you that you see things one way while others see it another way. I don't think is really picking a side. I agree with you on the subject at hand, but while at the same time I can't tell them they are an idiot for wanting or creating hybrids. I can just state my position and if they don't like it, I just walk away.

  3. #123
    poison beauties
    Guest

    Default Re: Hello from Atlanta GA

    Quote Originally Posted by bshmerlie View Post
    I really wasn't expecting to come back into this argument because....well...its stupid. But Mike, if you go back to the first page of this thread...you actually started it. You came to this forum out of deception...simply to start an argument. Seth's first statement was that if you're looking for an argument try DB. That deception, simply to start an argument shows your character. Everyone greeted you and welcomed you to the forum and you and Tony had to really dig to get the argument going. Even when people were making jokes and trying to stay lighthearted about it. If you wanted to start a discussion about the hybrid issue be professional about it next time instead of what has occurred here.
    Like I just said Im trying to drop the BS from it. I did not come here out of deception and Im well known to help all who I can in this hobby and yes I throw my 2 cents in as well and make sure that the other side of the issue is presented for all to read and decide from.

    Quote Originally Posted by SethD View Post
    Thought I would touch on this a bit, new morphs and hybrids etc. have historically increased the number of people and interest in other portions of the hobby. How many people were into leopard geckos lets say when only normal looking ones were available? Some, but the numbers expanded a lot after more and more morphs and options became available. Some think that is good and some think that is bad I guess, but I personally think it is good. Now that I have answered your question can you give some kind of proof of why hybridization is bad other than the fact that you personally don't like it and fear it will prevent hobbyists captive CB frogs from being re-introduced back into the wild?(something that has zero precedent to my knowledge and is a very long odds shot anyway)
    New morphs and selctive breeding does not benefit the hobby due to bringing more people into it. Thats like saying its better to have a thousand herps than a hundred. Doesnt the quality and content matter?

    As far as hybrids being bad go they take away from the natural representation and that among other things cause issues like people mistakingly or purposely trying to name new species or locales. What about the fact that hybrids promote fads and greed in the hobby? Then what> we have many other producing them and they flood the market. All over a frog that can never hold its value.

    Michael

  4. #124
    bshmerlie
    Guest

    Default Re: Hello from Atlanta GA

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony View Post
    Why do you keep dodging the relevant questions? Let's hear one good thing hybridizing accomplishes for the hobby and our frogs.
    Colors...I admit it....I like different colors. I can't mix species but I can have different colors. Why do you think people have mixed tanks? They don't want to see all the same animal all the time. Not everyone can afford a frog room with 50 different tanks. If all my red eyes were the same color I wouldn't be able to name them. and someday when someone breeds a pretty blue red eye I will be the first in line to buy it. Its called fun. Most of the people on this forum are hobbiest and they are in it because they think frogs are cool and FUN to own. We're not looking to reintroduce our blue red eyed color morph frogs to the wild. There is a place for the purity that your talking about but there is also a place for the hobbiest who wants to purchase a hybrid. They're not in it professionally they're in it just to have a pet. Yes Tony to some of us that "name" them they are our pets. Hybrids or color Morphs its the same reason.....and its called FUN. Not everyone here looks at their frogs as a business or an attempt to save the planet. My biggest gripe is that any frogs are removed from the wild at all for the hobbiest. For example, I think it should be something similar to what Understory is doing with the Lemurs. Take a few, breed them, then sell those offspring to the hobbiest breeders and then those breeders would have to be able to sustain the regular demand.

  5. #125
    bshmerlie
    Guest

    Default Re: Hello from Atlanta GA

    Quote Originally Posted by poison beauties View Post
    What about the fact that hybrids promote fads and greed in the hobby? Then what> we have many other producing them and they flood the market. All over a frog that can never hold its value.
    So what...its called supply and demand. So what if the market is flooded with$20 pink poka dotted tree frogs if people want to buy them. New people will come to hobby because of it and just like any fad many will leave but some will stay and that will expand the interest in the hobby.

  6. #126
    Jeff Kennedy
    Guest

    Default Re: Hello from Atlanta GA

    I think that the only real course of action here is for all of us "regulars" to just leave these two alone (Tony & poison beauties). It is just a matter or time before they get into an argument with each other over who is smarter then the other and they go back home to Dendroboard. This was a rather peaceful, open minded community until these two experts came along and insulted a large portion of the board with their rude, brash, insulting, "my way or the highway" approach. They have both proved that their is no reasoning with them and they are looking for exactly what we are giving them by arguing. Some people just like to hear themselves talk and these two are prime examples of that. On the other hand, for me, all of this has opened my eyes to the inner politics of this forum and it's merit system. I guess politics are everywhere.

  7. #127
    EpicFrogMan
    Guest

    Default Re: Hello from Atlanta GA

    the dart frog community is a joke....

    Let see what happens when i say it.. Will my rep go down more? will i be banned? i hope so

  8. #128
    SethD
    Guest

    Default Re: Hello from Atlanta GA

    Quote Originally Posted by poison beauties View Post
    As far as hybrids being bad go they take away from the natural representation and that among other things cause issues like people mistakingly or purposely trying to name new species or locales.
    Cite examples. I remember a few years ago in the dart frog hobby there was some speculation that new rivers and giant orange darts were of hybrid or mixed morph origin, I don't recall what the eventual group decision was since I didn't follow it that closely. Given the fact that those morphs are still available and that the dart frog hobby tends to have a strong opinion against mixed morphs or hybrids I assume it was decided that they were ok. I don't recall it ever being a question at all with non-dart frog species. It tends to be well known if something is a hybrid or not and there isn't a lot of confusion on the issue. Any examples of hybrid related confusion I missed or is this point of yours purely hypothetical?



    What about the fact that hybrids promote fads and greed in the hobby? Then what> we have many other producing them and they flood the market. All over a frog that can never hold its value.
    Everything you say about hybrids here would apply equally to natural morphs and different species in the dart frog community. There are cycles where a particular dart morph or species is rare, expensive, and highly sought after, then if the species is capable of it it is produced to the point it is common, prices come down, then a lot of people loose interest, then it becomes rare again and the cycle repeats. It is exactly the same thing as what you describe with "man made" morphs and both occur due to basic human nature. I don't see that as a good reason to condemn morphs and hybrids unless you wish to condemn the dart frog hobby as well.

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