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Thread: birth defects in froglets??

  1. #1
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    Default birth defects in froglets??

    First off, Hello! I'm new and came here for some input on my fire belly toad froglets.
    So I bred my fbts, well let's be real, they bred themselves, and continue to breed themselves every 3 or 4 days. I only kept the first batch of eggs, moved them to a new tank and succcessfully hatched them and fed them to froglet stage. This is my first time breeding amphibians, and I have to say, watching the development from egg to froglet is one of the coolest and most fulfilling experiences I've had to date. I have lost one to spindly leg syndrome. He wasn't eating enough, and therefore obviously deficient in calcium. After reading about it I figured I'd lose at least one, so though disheartening, it was expected.
    But I also have 2 little guys that appear to have some sort of defect. Their bottom jaw is not flush with their top, rather, it remains open, leaving a small opening at all times. Amusingly it almost makes them look like they are in a state of surprise at all times, and they are kinda cute. Anyway, due to this, they can't properly hunt fruit flies, as the bugs can just hop back out of their mouths before they can swallow. I know the surest bet is to euthanize, but for curiosity's sake, I have been hand feeding them frozen and thawed blood worms. (Though I know that this is only prolonging their lives until they do die, or that if they do survive, I might have to hand feed or assist in feeding for life) I use tweezers to put it into their opened mouths and wait for them to swallow, then give them a second one, and I do this once day. This seems to be going alright, one even is starting to gain back some weight. They seem to have no other problems with quality of life, are able to swim, hop, explore etc.
    So I guess my question is, has anyone else ever seen this? Is it common? Is it a birth defect or is it signs of something more serious. Should I be worried about my other healthy froglets? What did you do about it? Is anyone interested in updates about these guys? And why/how do you think this happens? My speculation is, since they were normal tadpoles that could eat just fine, that perhaps upon morphing they didn't go though a full transformation from tadpole mouth to froglet mouth.
    I'm also wondering if, provided they do survive and are able to grow, once the bugs they eat become larger than their mouth opening if they will be able to eat on their own, or if I'm just too hopeful.
    I can try to post pics but my phone camera is junk so they may not be great, though this emoji is a surprisingly accurate depiction lol
    Last edited by loudmouse; April 22nd, 2018 at 03:56 PM.

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  3. #2
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    Default Re: birth defects in froglets??

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  4. #3
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    Default Re: birth defects in froglets??

    huh. interesting. i'm on my second year of growing fbt frogs and i have yet to see a defective one.

    when they emerge, I feed them fruit flies dusted with the 'repashy calcium'. it's a supplement that has been recommended here. this supplement also contains 'carotenoids' which is what gives these frogs their intense color. its the only thing i use.

    you do not mention a supplement. this is very important for both calcium and carotenoids. Not all supplements have the latter.
    if you do not have a supplement, then i'd say that screwed with their development.

    the fbt tadpole has a sucker mouth. when the rear legs emerge, the mouth develops that distinctive striping pattern. when the tadpole emerges, the mouth changes entirely in just a few days from a 'sucker' mouth to a deadly cricket and fruit fly black-pinkish-hole. incredible really. they cannot eat during the transformation, but once done, it should be a fully formed froglet.

    i've had a few frogs fail due to the fact that i have more frogs than flies. and i've had a few tadpoles die. but no malformed ones.

    this year, my tank is doing very well, and i'm not going to do the nursery thing, as i've found that my adult tank is an excellent nursery.

    see my other thread for a link to a live video of my tank!

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    Default Re: birth defects in froglets??

    Since losing the one to sls, I've been using the same calcium duster powder I use for my adults. Before that, I'll admit I was slacking. I noticed this problem after they morphed. Before they morphed they would only eat algae and fish flakes, they didn't seem interested in anything else. I'm not sure how one would supplement the algae pellets and fish flakes, so I didn't. So maybe supplementation was the problem, or maybe they should have been eating invertebrates before they morphed as well.
    As a side note, all of the other froglets are growing, healthy, have a voracious appetite and are starting to develop their green backs and orange bellies.
    I'm wondering whether perhaps the parents may have been related and if that has anything to do with it. They were purchased at petco at the same time. So honestly I wouldn't doubt it. I won't be breeding the offspring, just wanted to raise them, keep 2 more to add in with my adults in their 20 gal, and then give the rest to friends/lps. I will note, it was never my intention to breed them anyways. They did it all on their own after their tank upgrade. And I have been scooping out and throwing away any eggs since the first batch, call me plan B lol.

  6. #5
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    Default Re: birth defects in froglets??

    spinach seems to be a great tadpole food. just wilt a few leaves, throw it in the tank. high in calcium.

    algae pellets should be a good food with a wide spectrum of nutrients.

    that's what I use. spinach and pellets.

    weird. it sorta does sound genetic. i was wondering just today how all of these frogs could possibly mutate from little grape like globs into actual frogs. you can see through them when they are tadpoles. the process must be pretty mindbendingly complex. and also fairly cute. mine are just sprouting legs.

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    Default Re: birth defects in froglets??

    One of them has been observed with the ability to close their mouth but only for short periods of time. So I wonder if it's indicative of a breathing problem or infection. I hope I shouldn't have to worry about the other froglets, though the rest are all super healthy, active, and have great appetites.
    These two are in a critter container quarantined from the rest. They didn't want to eat today so I left a few fruit flies in with them.
    I'm still considering euthanizing, but curious to see if they improve.

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