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Thread: WTF Skin Infection

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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Exclamation WTF Skin Infection

    Hey everyone! Since late January, I have had some troubles with my 9 year-old WTF Moochy. It started off with some cloudiness in her left eye. I took her in to the vet, got some oflaxacin eye drops, and used them as prescribed by the vet. After the regiment, her eye didn't look any worse or better, so I decided to wait it out and see how she progressed from there. Her eye is still the same, but this prior Sunday (six days ago), I noticed her back was getting bumpy. By Tuesday, there were more bumps and some even started to look like little whitehead pimples. I got into the vet on Wednesday (three days ago) and was prescribed silver sulfadiazine cream. The vet tried to get a scraping of one of the bumps to look at it (under a microscope, I think?), but he couldn't make any direct conclusion and kindly didn't charge me for that part. I was also unable to grab a good fecal sample to get analyzed; they were always too dry to be useful by the time I found them, but they were a concern since they were runnier than normal.

    I'm not sure how fast results usually are when using this cream, but I feel there are more little white bumps than when I brought her in. Is it a case of getting worse before getting better? It's really hard for me to tell because Moochy has been seemingly unaffected by her current state. Her weight hasn't changed, she's still eating, displaying her usual little behaviors. She is downright feisty when I've applied the cream, swiping her little hands at the cotton swab and even kicking her legs at it. It's been the silver lining in all this and the only assurance she could make a full recovery.

    If anyone has any advice for how to proceed, I would really appreciate it. I'll be continuing the silver sulfadiazine cream as told by the vet, but I may call in on Monday to request proceeding to oral antibiotics, which was going to be the next step if the cream was ineffective. Part of the trouble is not knowing if what she has is fungal or bacterial in origin and my searching on the internet seemed fruitless.

    I should also note Moochy has a 9 year-old tankmate named Fatty. She has shown zero signs of infection and will hopefully remain that way since they're now in separate tanks and the prior one has been thoroughly cleaned.







    Last edited by Bynny Ribbit; February 24th, 2018 at 03:41 PM. Reason: fixed image sizing

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  3. #2
    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    I just did a treatment of the cream and a good portion of the white bumps have appeared to "pop" leaving little brown indents. Hopefully it's a sign of progress. I will try to grab a picture tomorrow during her next treatment. She's still behaving normally and ate half a worm tonight.

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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    I'm glad to be seeing some more of her old color, but it does make it more difficult to find those lighter spots, lol. The routine is putting her in the critter keeper to apply the cream, but she inevitably always figures out she can climb out and I end up holding her while dabbing some of the sneakier bumps on her back legs, sides, and face. She has shown some improvement and continues to behave normally, so I'm optimistic.

    I also got some shots of her face and captured the irregularity in her left eye pretty well. I'm starting to think it was either an injury, hence why eye drops didn't make it go away, or my vet said it could simply be a lipid buildup. I have read that older frogs can get these simply due to age, too. Considering she's about 9 years-old, it wouldn't be too far-fetched.






    I'll continue to keep track of Moochy's condition not only for my own benefit, but for others who may eventually face a similar issue.

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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    There hasn't been any direct improvement with the cream and I feel there are actually more dots now than before. Moochy also seemed to really dislike the cream and show signs of discomfort after it was applied. I have an appointment scheduled with the vet on Wednesday. In the meantime, I'm no longer using the cream and instead making a strong saline solution to put her in briefly to see if that helps. She is still eating normally, though she seems a little less active and more prone to long soaks. This makes sense since I don't know when she last shed, hopefully the saline solution benefits her.

    It's been hard seeing her like this but it helps that she is still voracious and behaving mostly like herself. Hopefully this means it's more of an external issue.

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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Moochy is still soaking a lot and hasn't pooped in over a week. I took her into the vet this morning and he said she was looking better and not to worry about her lack of poop since he didn't feel any impaction when examining her. She received an antibiotic injection of ceftazidime in case what's causing her skin lesions is systemic. Some of the bumps near her face have morphed into little, hard red dots. They could be scabs? I decided to dab some of the silver sulfadiazine cream on some of the worst areas, especially where wounds seem to have opened. If the dots turn out to be scabs, it may be worth doing another saline soak. It has the added benefit of encouraging a shed. Vet said if there is improvement with the shot, he recommends another at the end of this week or early next week.

    Moochy is becoming one of the most expensive pets I've ever owned, lmao. But! She ate four whole crickets yesterday with a lot of vigor! It's very nice to see...and very confusing. What's with your skin, girly?






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    100+ Post Member elly's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    I have no idea what those bumps could be, but I hope the cream works, whatever they are. Maybe there's some skin irritation from the cream? I had a frog treated for protozoa and he reacted badly to the medicine for a little while, being lethargic, but he perked up. Maybe your frog will improve in the long run.

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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Quote Originally Posted by elly View Post
    I have no idea what those bumps could be, but I hope the cream works, whatever they are. Maybe there's some skin irritation from the cream? I had a frog treated for protozoa and he reacted badly to the medicine for a little while, being lethargic, but he perked up. Maybe your frog will improve in the long run.
    Both the vet and I are scratching our heads over the mystery bumps, especially since her demeanor has been mostly unaffected. I think the issue with the cream before was I was using too much of it and dabbing it on every little bump I saw since it was the only thing I had to treat her issue at the time. Now that she's had the injection, I'm only using it on any open or worrisome spots. The good news is the little red dots are either gone or smaller, so I'm pretty sure they're little froggy scabs! I keep seeing more open sores where there were once bumps, so I'm optimistic it's a sign of healing. I'm also hoping that not every single bump breaks open because that would be a lot of little wounds to keep clean.

    I also got a poop out of Moochy, bottled it up, and tossed it in the fridge. I might call later to see if they might want to pursue a fecal test to really narrow it down.

    I'm feeling pretty good about her prognosis, I just hope it's something that can be truly fixed so she can live with Fatty again.

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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Not much to say about Moochy at the moment. She's taken to hiding more, but her skin hasn't improved since the initial shot she received. She's still looking better than earlier, but not by much. I gave her another strong saline soak on the off chance it might help since I initially did one last week and it may have been what got the ones near her face to heal. I'm also still not sure when she last shed so I'm hoping the soak encourages that.

    Otherwise, still a healthy girl. Still wants to eat, still active.

  10. #9
    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    I actually have some positive results to bring back for Moochy's skin condition. Her left eye, on the other hand, has had the cloudiness strike back with a vengeance along with a mystery dot (the reason she was likely hiding more). I have been putting the eye drops I previously received in it in hopes it will help alleviate it until her next appointment, which will unfortunately be Thursday due to scheduling conflicts with the vet I'm taking her to.

    I may have wrongfully attributed Moochy's progress to the injection she received last Wednesday (or maybe it and the soak worked in conjunction a little bit?). I just did a 2nd saline soak on March 4th since she seemed to be doing worse and I'm really pleased with what it has accomplished in such a short time frame.



    The image on March 1st was two days after her first soak (I realized this after I made the graphic, my bad). You can see she was smoother than previous pictures and that a few of the tan nodules turned into open sores. Considering how the ones on her face started off like this, scabbed, and healed, I believe this is a good sign of progress. I didn't pursue another soak after this and only administered the silver sulfadiazine on the open sores to promote good healing. Her skin worsened over the next few days and I wasn't able to get her into the vet, so I turned again to the strong saline dip which I found here. Although it clarifies it is for use on aquatic and land-based frogs, I decided to chance it and I'm glad I did. I used pictures of her back legs because I feel the progress is nicely apparent there; I circled two different problem spots which have obviously improved in a 24 hour period. Other areas are a bit more difficult to notice because of her color changing.



    Moochy was definitely uncomfortable on the 4th and barely wanted to open her cloudy eye (and all those bumps!). Fast forward to the day after and it seems to bother her a little less (I was applying her eye drops along with the saline soak). Although the picture on the right isn't perfect, the skin was smoother with a portion of the nodules seeming to recede. I didn't circle them, but there were two tan nodules to the left of her left eye in the March 4th image. Next day, both of those nodules had turned to the open sores along with a hidden one inbetween them!

    Moochy still has a long way to go to good health again, but these results made me pursue another soak today. I haven't noticed any negative effects on her. In fact, she did a short little call for me not too long after her soak, which really put me in a good mood.

    Thanks for keeping up with Moochy's progress!
    Last edited by Bynny Ribbit; March 5th, 2018 at 06:59 PM. Reason: image error

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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Hello again! Moochy's condition has been slowly, but surely, improving. My vet was supportive of her saline soaks and recommended doing the ceftazidime injections along with the soaks more consistently. What's nice about the injections is I only had to buy the bottle of ceftazidime once and all injections after the first one haven't cost me anything else (not sure if this is the same for every vet clinic). She just had one last Thursday, then on Monday, and she'll have another on Thursday. The vet recommended calling on Saturday with progress.

    I think this is the best she's looked in a while save for her poor pimple face.






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    100+ Post Member elly's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Thank you for documenting this, I hope to learn something. And I hope Moochy feels better. I'd never heard of frogs getting lipid buildup before.

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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Quote Originally Posted by elly View Post
    Thank you for documenting this, I hope to learn something. And I hope Moochy feels better. I'd never heard of frogs getting lipid buildup before.
    No problem! I'm actually super thankful I stumbled upon the Frog Forum months ago when I first got my Pacman frog, it's been a great resource and I'm glad I can contribute so others may benefit in the future. Yeah, they can get a lipid build-up in their lenses, though the biggest cause I've read is a very fatty diet fed long term (which Moochy hasn't had at all). My vet mentioned it can also be due to metabolism changes, and I've read online that it sometimes happens to older frogs.

    Thanks for your concern, I hope she feels better soon, too.

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    Moderator Lija's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Glad Moochy is better and you have good vet nearby! I must say for 9y frog he looks great!
    Yes, lipid build ups are very common in overweight frogs, or older frogs. Very often these build ups are the cause of death, very much similar to overweight humans, dogs, etc
    Save one animal and it doesn't change the world, but it surely changes the world for that one animal!

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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Quote Originally Posted by Lija View Post
    Glad Moochy is better and you have good vet nearby! I must say for 9y frog he looks great!
    Yes, lipid build ups are very common in overweight frogs, or older frogs. Very often these build ups are the cause of death, very much similar to overweight humans, dogs, etc
    Thank you! She and her tankmate are a couple of oldies, I hope to have them for many more years.

    Unfortunately, I'm going to have to conclude the saline soaks or figure out a different method. Her legs/belly have gotten awful pink and I'm 95% sure it's from these strong minute-long dips. Her behavior is completely normal and she is still heartily eating what I give her, so I don't believe it's bacterial. Many or most of the bumps/blisters are gone, though there is a new accumulation near her head that generally sits above the waterline of the dips, so I'm dabbed some of the silver sulfadiazine cream on them in hopes of keeping them controlled until her next vet visit. Hopefully we'll be able to visit tomorrow or Tuesday and discuss a new approach.

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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Moochy continues to wonder why she is in her boring quarantine tank and why I handle her so much, lol. She's had a fun week hunting down crickets and croaking at me when she hears running water (she is set up in a warm, spare bathroom away from the other froggies).

    I haven't been doing full saline soaks, instead dipping a cotton round pad into the saline solution and dabbing her with it. It worked okay, but my vet suggested putting it into a spray bottle instead and I wondered why I didn't think of it! Most of this week has been using the cotton rounds, but yesterday I began using the spray bottle and decided to up the treatment to every 12 hours instead of 24 hours. I'll keep an eye on her to see if this stresses her too much, but she's been very tolerant of everything (except the cream) so far. Her underside is far less irritated looking now so I'm happy about that. I did take her back into the vet because a biopsy had been on the table, but the estimation for it was $450 which was far too costly for me. A culture is also an option and is $150, but it doesn't cover everything so it could ultimately be inconclusive. He recommended to continue what I've been doing and check back in two weeks since she is still alert and eating.

    Moochy decided she wanted to be brown today to really show off those gross blisters. The first picture is before being sprayed and the second picture is after...I have to imagine all of it coming to the surface is a good thing? I always feel sad when I treat her because it seems like it's worse, but then I check on her later before bed and she looks better, so I can sleep soundly, lol. I'm glad I'm documenting all of this with pictures, it's really been helping me see her progress and that things were far worse before, so she is slowly getting better.




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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    I'm back with a happy update!

    I ended up moving Moochy back into the frog room because I don't think what she has is airborn. The lighting and air circulation has also been better for her, which encouraged me in her treatment. However, as I continued spraying Moochy with the saline solution, I ultimately realized that progress with it had plateaued, so I went looking for another way to try and help my girl. On the same site I found the saline mixture, I had also found the "heat treatment". You essentially induce a "fever" in the frog by raising the temperature in the tank. Even with the risks, I decided to try it and put a higher temperature basking spot in her tank. It averages between 85F and 88 as the day goes by, but there are cooler areas of her tank where she can retreat to (such as her water dish). At any time when I'm checking on her, she is generally either hiding under her plastic container or actually basking in the warmest spot, probably a 75% hiding/25% basking ratio. As I write this, it is actually a bit past the third full day of doing this and not using any of the saline and I'm very pleased with the results.







    Sorry for the picture quality, there was so much light and Moochy is quite shiny after a shed, lol. She was also in the midst of changing color since I sprayed her tank down not too long before, for the most part she's been very green lately (I'll have to try and grab a pic later!). A lot of the marks have started the healing process and there are much less of the tiny "pimples". As always, no change in behavior and eating habits, but I'm super excited about the improvement this past week! She's really looking like her old self. Don't get me wrong, she still has to go back to the herp vet to get looked over, especially since her left eye is still has that foggy line through it. However, it's been so long and tiring, and to finally be possibly coming out the other side soon? It's awesome.

    Raising the heat in her tank has helped her so much, but I don't want to overwhelm her, so I may lower it to more comfortable levels and see how things go from there and retry the treatment if her skin starts looking rough again.

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    100+ Post Member elly's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Oh good, I've heard of heat treatment but I've been hesitant to recommend it to people because it seems experimental and sometimes is risky. And also, I'm not a vet. But I'm glad it seems to help here.

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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Quote Originally Posted by elly View Post
    Oh good, I've heard of heat treatment but I've been hesitant to recommend it to people because it seems experimental and sometimes is risky. And also, I'm not a vet. But I'm glad it seems to help here.
    Moochy has tolerated it very well. I've also read on a veterinary resource WTFs can handle having their temps up to 90F, so I figured as long as it was a few degrees below that point, it would be okay. The original source of the treatment implied making the entire tank a high temperature, but this seemed risky, so I only did the one corner of her tank. Granted, her temp tank is quite small (12Wx12Lx7.5h). It is likely still pretty warm throughout the tank, but not as hot as the one corner. Like I said, I'm giving her a break the next few days and keeping an eye on her to see if another "round" of this treatment may be prudent. Fingers crossed!

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    100+ Post Member Bynny Ribbit's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Moochy is still alive and kickin'! Her appetite is good, but her skin is still a bit ugly (but better than before) and, within the last week, she has seemed a bit bloated and somewhat lethargic.

    I actually paused in specifically treating Moochy because her tankmate, Fatty, was acting off and ended up being positive with parasites. It turned out she had a type of hookworm(?) though when my vet inquired a specialist about it, they said not to worry about it? It was kind of confusing to me, but part of the reason they were talking with the specialist was to ask if this parasite was capable of becoming a dermatological problem, and apparently it's possible. So, we did a round of Panacur with Fatty and she seems to be doing better. We're now pursuing the same with Moochy since other treatments targeting bacterial/fungal problems have been ineffective. She just got her first dosage yesterday, but I'm not sure when I'll possibly see a difference.

    I was pleasantly surprised today that she was wandering around when I checked on her in the wee hours of morning. The week before this, she was sleeping despite it being her awake time. It's making me hopeful. Should the Panacur not be helpful, I have to imagine Baytril might be the way to go? I know it's rather strong, but I'm a bit at a loss for helping frog. I'm considering giving her a Pedialyte soak to maybe help her bloating. I should clarify she's not super bloated like a balloon, nor does it feel like she's full of water like edema...just a soft, airy bloat, I guess? She pooped just yesterday, so I know it isn't impaction.

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    100+ Post Member BossFrog's Avatar
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    Default Re: WTF Skin Infection

    Thanks for keeping us posted, this is really interesting! Hope she gets better!
    Always take time to appreciate your pet; remember, even though your pet isn't the only thing you have, you are all that they have, ​so love them while they're here!


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