California toads and Ensatina Salamanders

[Greatballzofire]

Toad tub

Toad tub with lid on.

Toads inside log hide. Ten toads live in this tub. I guess captive life agrees with them, as they are all many times bigger now than they were early this spring when I gathered them.
The lid will eventually go on the box I plan to build for them, with 1 x 12 inch lumber and lined with heavy duty plastic to protect the wooden bottom.

They like to burrow in the evening so I want to give them a nice deep box of at least 6 inches soil; now they have about three inches, which will do for the summer.
I am using just plain top soil with no fertilizers or other additives for them. As they poop up the soil it is recycled into the garden. The water bowl has to be changed at least once a day as they like to soak in it and poop in it. The egg crate piece is loaded with crickets, and cricket food and water crystals for the crickets. This is sort of a toad buffet, which the toads visit throughout the day. Once a week I also feed them live pinks. They love the pinks so much they will eat from my fingers!

The smaller toad box now has a few ensatina salamanders in it. The salamanders were most happy to see the toads move out; the toads were walking on the salamanders and the salamanders were like Get Off Me , you big oafs!!

The salamanders hang out near the cricket food dish.[/quote]
They eat the slugs that are attracted to the cricket meal. Their tails have plumped up considerably since being put in the tub so I know they are doing well.

[tgampper]

Welcome to the forum

Your toad and salamander tubs are awesome! I dream of setting up an outdoor enclosure for my amphibians, but here in Nebraska, it gets very cold in the winter

[John]

I'm glad you're no longer keeping the salamanders with the toads.

[Greatballzofire]

Welcome to the forum

Your toad and salamander tubs are awesome! I dream of setting up an outdoor enclosure for my amphibians, but here in Nebraska, it gets very cold in the winter

It gets cold here in the Sierra Foothills, too. These tubs will go in the citrus greenhouse for the winter. I have indoor-outdoor thermometers in the soil so as to monitor the temperature. If it gets too cold I will bring them on and put them in big Sterilite tubs for the worst of the winter.

[Greatballzofire]

I'm glad you're no longer keeping the salamanders with the toads.

I know! The poor little salamanders! They were put in the toad tub as an after thought; I found them while moving firewood and put them in there as a temporary measure. Within a week they had inherited the old cement mixing tub the toads had previously.

[Kurt]

Welcome aboard. I am so jealous of your ensatinas. Always wanted some, but I have never found any available for sale. Them and red-ellied newts, Taricha rivularis.

[Greatballzofire]

Welcome aboard. I am so jealous of your ensatinas. Always wanted some, but I have never found any available for sale. Them and red-ellied newts, Taricha rivularis.

A group I found last spring when I moved more firewood. I released them a safe distance away from the firewood activity. They are the most common type on my property. There is also a big brown kind, but those are scarce.

[Kurt]

Lucky you.

[KennyDB]

Damn those Ensatina.e.platensis look great! I got E.e.picta and E.e.oregonensis myself but platensis is high on my wishlist.

The big brown type would be xanthoptica... or oregonensis in the northern border of platensis range

[Greatballzofire]

I do feel incredibly fortunate to have these beautiful little creatures on my property. In my opinion they are the most beautiful of all the salamander species.

Next spring I will look for the big brown ones and post some pics of them. They are much more active than the ensatinas, acting almost more like lizards. When uncovered the ensatinas just lay there like oh I hope nobody notices me, but the brown ones sort of glare at you and make haste to find new cover.

[KennyDB]

but the brown ones sort of glare at you and make haste to find new cover.

That sounds like Aneides lugubris behavior? do you mean A.lugubris?

[Greatballzofire]

That sounds like Aneides lugubris behavior? do you mean A.lugubris?

http://www.californiaherps.com/salam....lugubris.html
I think this is it. I live in the small red spot area on the map of California. I saw a group of three of these creatures under a big rock this spring. Now it is hot and dry and nary a salamander of any sort to be seen!

[KennyDB]

Haha yes, I knew it must have been A.lugubris by the "behavior" description , I got some myself, they really are fantastic and superquick!

[Greatballzofire]

Well, I am glad I didn't bother to pick them up! LOL!

[Kurt]

That looks like photo shop to me.

[Greatballzofire]

That looks like photo shop to me.

http://amphibiaweb.org/cgi/amphib_qu...ecies=lugubris

G. Territories. Arboreal salamanders are well known for their aggressive tendencies and weaponry. This species has a suite of morphological features that enable a strong, wound inflicting bite. The jaw muscles are hypertrophied, the skull is heavily ossified with especially strong jaws, and both juveniles and adults possess enlarged and flattened, blade-like, monocuspid teeth (other plethodontids possess weaker bicuspid teeth as juveniles; Wake, 1966; Wake et al., 1983). In his description of arboreal salamanders, Cope (1889) writes: “On the whole, the physiognomy is not unlike that of a snapping tortoise.” Scarred individuals are often found in the field (Miller, 1944; N.L.S., personal observation), and Myers (1930b) observed that salamanders housed in the same container bite each others’ tails. In a study of museum specimens, Staub (1993) found that 15% of the examined individuals were scarred, presumably from conspecific attacks. The frequency of scarring did not differ significantly between males and females (Staub, 1993).

I found it hard to believe that these innocuous looking little animals would have such forbidding dental equipment myself!

[Kurt]

I still believe the picture is a fake. Here is my evidence, a photo I just pulled off of CalPhotos. © 2008 Bill Stagnaro

[Greatballzofire]

I still believe the picture is a fake. Here is my evidence, a photo I just pulled off of CalPhotos. © 2008 Bill Stagnaro

I think the only way to settle this question is to actually find one of these salamanders and see. It's too hot now but next spring I will for sure look for them; if found will handle cautiously! LOL!