Age and heating issues.. Please help!

[MariePey]

Hey guys!

Brand new member and proud, educated and brand new owner of a WTF

Here's the story..

I read, stidied, informed and educated myself for months before ive got my little guy. Ive slways been a frog freak from the moment i was capable of grabbing one of them outside on my own.. lol. Im french which also make it "cliché" to some people.. lol. But anyways..

Giggles is "unaged" which i dont like.. the pet store couldnt give me an answer on that. Im in Alberta Canada and to try to find a frog breeder is like looking for a polar bear in Mexico.. lol so i had to get him from petstore or some unhealthy uneducated owners.. Petsmart seemed like the best idea. Anyone could tell me roughly his age? I figure about a year and a half. His just about the sixe of a hard boiled egg when his curled up. I know his a male from my dedicated research, his loose and wrinkly throat and also hearing him croaking on the way home and at night.. which is where i got his name from.. I had him in a small transportation container in my jacket and when he croaked i giggled.. and everytime i giggled he croaked again! Lol plus hes been my smile and giggles since his arrival.

The one thing im really having issues with is the heat.. humidity is under control but here in Alberta, its crazy cold outside and we keep our house at about 68 or 70. Well.. from the get go i knew i would need a spurce of heat. So i bought a heat pad. ZooMed everything as they recommend you to use all of the same product. I applied the UTH following ALL and every single instruction to a T. Well.. two days later, i decided to clean the cage and dispose of the coconut fiber (eco earth) substrate after my little guy had a not so pretty episode of throwing up his supper which was loaded of that yucky stuff.. well what a surprise.. the UTH cracked my tank all the way and all the way thru at one spot as the pad glue was coming thru! And they dont warranty their stuff! Was i mad... oh boy. Took it like a straight attack on Gigs. Fuming. So anyways... i had to get another tank (exo terra 18x18x24). Obviously did NOT put a heat pad or coco substrate... Gigs is on the tank carpet and i bought two 60watt blue glass day/heat lamp. Well.. cant getthe temperature up at the right spot!!! So i have a small room heater.. Gigs and his enclosure are in my bathroom. So i leave the door closed and check on him every so often.. turn it on then turn it off.. like ten times a day! Soneone mentionned the ceramic heater but i dont want to dry him right out or burn him. I had this undercover perfect set up for a frog in my house all that time.. lol even put a darkening curtain up so once Gigs is put to bed, us going in and turning the light on wont bother him... i also read about infra red. Would definatly need a timer and thermostat. Im a little bit at a loss.. battling between all the confusing online suggestions??!!

Can someone help please!

Gigs is otherwise a healthy, nervous little guy but he is under amazing care now! Hes even won the heart of my hunny who beleives frogs are meant to live outside.. lol i think he gets more excited talking about it than i do. Lol

Thanks you guys!

[elly]

Welcome and congrats on the new frog! I feel your pain about the heating situation. I can't put a very large heating pad on my temporary quarantine tank so I've also kept mine in the bathroom for a while, checking on them in the night. Eventually I found that a heat lamp with a100 watt ceramic heat emitter suspended over the tank (combined with a small space heater nearby) worked well. It does dry out slightly more easily, but at the same rate it would with just about any heat source. I spray down the tanks before I go to bed and they're still at an acceptable level in the morning. Maybe an extra-large water bowl would help keep up humidity a bit. Do you have any kind of substrate in there to hold moisture right now? I hate to suggest spanum moss because it's an impaction risk, but if you feed from a bowl the frog is less likely to accidentally ingest the stuff. Edit: Okay, I'm not battling Alberta level cold- apparently the solution I gave you is what you're already doing without success.It's late and things have stopped making sense All I can really suggest for heat is maybe a slightly higher wattage lightbulb?

[irThumper]

Welcome to FF and congrats on your new cutie! As far as age I'd say he's fully grown, or nearly so, from his size. One thing I would have asked the store is how many months he's been there, and how large he was when he came in. Juveniles go up to appx 1 1/2" inches snout to vent, from 1 1/2 to 3" they are sub-adults (teenagers basically), and over 3+" they are considered adults, they can get to 4+", with females generally being bigger than males.

We don't have quite the issues with cold here (NW Oregon U.S.A.) and so far I've been able to keep up with my froggles' heating needs, so I'll let someone who's had to battle REAL cold help you out with that problem Good luck with your guys, he's very cute!

(Lol, cross posted ya, Elly!)

[Lija]

Hi and welcome to the frogforum! Yeah... I know all about humidity and cold in alberta lol annoying..

anyhow im almost asleep, have trouble reading and thinking lol unless someone reply sooner, I'll be back tomorrow during a day.
where in AB are you from? Where did you get a frog?

one thing I say.. Put a frog in quarantine tank ( wet papertowels, changed daily, 3 sides covered with Smth not see through), test and treat for a start. Branches, decor, whatever that is easy to clean and desinfect.
You can use the same tank you have.

Lisa... We had snow storm in September....

[MariePey]

Hi Elly

Thanks for your reply!

So.. I do spray him on a regular basis and for whatever reason our house stay very humid.. we even have a dehumidifier in our main area and we cant even get under 50 percent.. lol so humidity wise im doing ok. He does have a big water dish and i try to get the carpet moist in the morning when i get up and at night and it seems to work well.

For the heat part.. with the ceramic heater tho, im scared it will get too hot when im absent.. and since im using my actial house light fixture, i cant really put a timer on that.. can you please tell me a bit more about them ceramic heater please? Do you leave it on all day? Do you use a timer? And at night, it cools off to about 68-70 which should be fine for Gigs at night right?

And for the substrat.. i will not be using any kind of moss or fiber or shaved things.. i know Gigs might be more confortable on coco fiber but again.. i am terrified of blockage and impactions.. Im a horse trainer and i know all about them impaction, blockage and colics and thats the last thing i want for my lil guy. Like i said, after that throwing up episode couple days ago which a lot of it was substrate and a still alived half digested crcickets, it stopped me dead in my tracks. I kept the old cracked tank, put paper towel down in it, put it by my crickets and will be making it my feeding pen. Gigs is pretty untamed so if when i pick him up its for feast time, im sure in no time hell welcome me and my hands in his cage! Lol hes a man


Happy tummy, happy hubby they say! Ill win his affection and heart in no time without forcing him against his will!

[irThumper]

Hi and welcome to the frogforum! Yeah... I know all about humidity and cold in alberta lol annoying..

anyhow im almost asleep, have trouble reading and thinking lol unless someone reply sooner, I'll be back tomorrow during a day.
where in AB are you from? Where did you get a frog?

one thing I say.. Put a frog in quarantine tank ( wet papertowels, changed daily, 3 sides covered with Smth not see through), test and treat for a start. Branches, decor, whatever that is easy to clean and desinfect.
You can use the same tank you have.

>>>>>Lisa... We had snow storm in September....<<<<<

Dang!

[MariePey]

Lija;


You must be falling asleep or my Frenglish isnt picking up what you are saying.. lol

I am around the Edmonton area and Ive got my little guy at Big Als actually..i think i said petsmart in my original post which was a mistake i apologize.

I dont quite understand youre quarantine thing..? Why would i need to quarantine him and why put him in a empty tank if hes already sttled in his new house? Im sorry you lost me on that one.. lol

And yes.. for whoever wo ders.. here in Alberta we are in the minus 10 celsius already.. have had about a foot of snow that melted and came back and had a week at -25 celsius already... its COLD!!!!!! Lol

[MariePey]

Welcome to FF and congrats on your new cutie! As far as age I'd say he's fully grown, or nearly so, from his size. One thing I would have asked the store is how many months he's been there, and how large he was when he came in. Juveniles go up to appx 1 1/2" inches snout to vent, from 1 1/2 to 3" they are sub-adults (teenagers basically), and over 3+" they are considered adults, they can get to 4+", with females generally being bigger than males.

We don't have quite the issues with cold here (NW Oregon U.S.A.) and so far I've been able to keep up with my froggles' heating needs, so I'll let someone who's had to battle REAL cold help you out with that problem Good luck with your guys, he's very cute!

(Lol, cross posted ya, Elly!)

Just looked at him again.. hes under 3 inches. Pribably about two and half and my hunny said the same.. hard to argu the two inches and half with a plumber/pipefitter.. lol

So what does in mean in years? Like 2? Or older?

Thanks

[irThumper]

Ah! His pic is a fooler then... do you have small hands too? If he's 2 1/2" inches then he's still a teenager, possibly around 9 months if he's croaking? It's hard to say with these guys if you don't know for sure how old they are when the store get them, and (around here at any rate) they don't usually ask their suppliers how old the frogs are when they get them

[MariePey]

Ah! His pic is a fooler then... do you have small hands too? If he's 2 1/2" inches then he's still a teenager, possibly around 9 months if he's croaking? It's hard to say with these guys if you don't know for sure how old they are when the store get them, and (around here at any rate) they don't usually ask their suppliers how old the frogs are when they get them

Yes! Lol my hands are like miniature.. my thumb is a mesure one inch and half! Lol that was my first comment when i saw the pictures too.. he looks huge! But again, my hands are not very big at all and hes like a skinny teenager.. the legs on that boy! Dear! But he is under tree inches for sure. And for the croaking.. dear oh dear.. lol besides the good giggles, he was sooooooo loud the first night hone, the first song he sang was about ten croaks long and each of them a little louder than the other.. by then end, i swear he sounded like he was on my pillow! Lol so im assuming i could call him 'a year old" to be safe. Pet store had him for a while and his partner left a few weeks ago.. the were really bad about that. I mean they are little creature that for some of us are like little human being so at least if theres no "birthdate", a month and a year would be appreciated!

Im having a very hard time finding his nuptial pad but with the crazy croaking weve heard already and the loose skin under his throat would mean his a boy right? Lol i always second gyess myself and pet store arent helpful in that matter either.. lol

[irThumper]

Yes! Lol my hands are like miniature.. my thumb is a mesure one inch and half! Lol that was my first comment when i saw the pictures too.. he looks huge! But again, my hands are not very big at all and hes like a skinny teenager.. the legs on that boy! Dear! But he is under tree inches for sure. And for the croaking.. dear oh dear.. lol besides the good giggles, he was sooooooo loud the first night hone, the first song he sang was about ten croaks long and each of them a little louder than the other.. by then end, i swear he sounded like he was on my pillow! Lol so im assuming i could call him 'a year old" to be safe. Pet store had him for a while and his partner left a few weeks ago.. the were really bad about that. I mean they are little creature that for some of us are like little human being so at least if theres no "birthdate", a month and a year would be appreciated!

Im having a very hard time finding his nuptial pad but with the crazy croaking weve heard already and the loose skin under his throat would mean his a boy right? Lol i always second gyess myself and pet store arent helpful in that matter either.. lol

Lol! I'd say probably under a year if you don't see visible nuptial pads (could be wrong, but he looks younger than that). Mine started croaking before the pads showed up too. Here's a pic of what they look like and where they are located. Hope this helps!

[MariePey]

Lol! I'd say probably under a year if you don't see visible nuptial pads (could be wrong, but he looks younger than that). Mine started croaking before the pads showed up too. Here's a pic of what they look like and where they are located. Hope this helps!

Thanks! Its nice to see a clearer picture of them for sure but i knew what to expect. The little ones doesnt have them yet. Or at least not colored yet.. looks like theres a bit of a bump there but no dark color. Heres a no so good picture of his throat.. cant see much but hes got a sac under there and ive tried to catch him croaking to see if it inflates but no luck on that lol. And they say females usually dont croak right?

[MariePey]

Ill try to catch a better picture tomorrow.. hes got one fold underneath his throat lol

[irThumper]

Thanks! Its nice to see a clearer picture of them for sure but i knew what to expect. The little ones doesnt have them yet. Or at least not colored yet.. looks like theres a bit of a bump there but no dark color. Heres a no so good picture of his throat.. cant see much but hes got a sac under there and ive tried to catch him croaking to see if it inflates but no luck on that lol. And they say females usually dont croak right?

Actually females can make a sort of croaking sound, but their throat doesn't inflate into a bag so it doesn't sound as deep. They can also make a kind of squawking sound, like a raspy duck, lol. Best indication is the balooning throat sack... I've heard it said that the throat turns dark, but I've seen lots of adult WTFs online who's males still had pale throats. They definitely didn't look like the Pacific chorus frogs I'm more familiar with, and those guys get very dark throat pouches.

[elly]

Actually it's not a ceramic heater, it's a ceramic heat emitter. It doesn't go in the tank so less chance of burning the frog. It looks like a lightbulb and screws into a heat lamp. It works like a heat light too, but doesn't burn out so quickly. Edit: I'd suggest getting a heat lamp and suspending it, that way you can keep it on a timer if you want. Ideally it should have a dimmer, but I've had trouble finding lamps with dimmers rated over 75watts. I've been raising and lowering the lamp on its stand to control the heat.

[irThumper]

Actually it's not a ceramic heater, it's a ceramic heat emitter. It doesn't go in the tank so less chance of burning the frog. It looks like a lightbulb and screws into a heat lamp. It works like a heat light too, but doesn't burn out so quickly. Edit: I'd suggest getting a heat lamp and suspending it, that way you can keep it on a timer if you want. Ideally it should have a dimmer, but I've had trouble finding lamps with dimmers rated over 75watts. I've been raising and lowering the lamp on its stand to control the heat.

I use a ZooMed double deep mini dome with two 60 watt red bulbs in it, it hangs suspended from an adjustable lamp stand and I do the same thing as Elly, raising and lowering it to get the right amt of heat

[MariePey]

Yayyy!!! I found sonething thats working awesome!

I heat him up in the morning with the room heater for quicker temperature raise. Then i shut off the heater, turn on his lights, close the curtain and keep the bathroom door closed! Keeping the temp where it should be at! If that fails at some pojnt, i will get the emitter with the proper set up to have a thermostat and a shut off

Thank you guys for all your help!

[MariePey]

Lol! I'd say probably under a year if you don't see visible nuptial pads (could be wrong, but he looks younger than that). Mine started croaking before the pads showed up too. Here's a pic of what they look like and where they are located. Hope this helps!

Well well.. tonight was awesome! Looks like his nuptial pad are just starting to show uo andddddddd was able to make him croak.. and his throat blows huge!! And i did learn something after! Sexing them at the right age is a piece of cake!

Thanks for all the help

Weve officially got a boy! I knew it deep down but second guessed myself.. and especially the pet store cause they dont know **** all.. lol

[MariePey]

I use a ZooMed double deep mini dome with two 60 watt red bulbs in it, it hangs suspended from an adjustable lamp stand and I do the same thing as Elly, raising and lowering it to get the right amt of heat

So after reading and analyzing my situation and everyones opinion, i had to get a ceramic emitter with my obe blue glass bulb... and it works fantastic!!!! Were set finally!

I just want to say thanks to everyone!!